Siena 445s

[Richard Scott]

Anyone know if there are any remaining passenger diagrams for Siena allocated 445s please? Any info appreciated. If there are, which locos are still serviceable?
Thanks in advance.

 

[HS2isgood]

Siena? I don't think so, it's all newer DMUs to Empoli, hybrids or new DMUs to Firenze (fast), and either new or old DMUs to Chiusi and Grosseto

 

[Richard Scott]

Siena? I don't think so, it's all newer DMUs to Empoli, hybrids or new DMUs to Firenze (fast), and either new or old DMUs to Chiusi and Grosseto

Ok, thanks, didn't know if there were a few loco hauled turns surviving on the Borgo line, which were worked by Siena locos?

 

[D6130]

Ok, thanks, didn't know if there were a few loco hauled turns surviving on the Borgo line, which were worked by Siena locos?

Yes, I'm afraid all the Siena services are now worked by units, including the infamous 13 52 school train to Chiusi and its return working early next morning. However a couple of weeks ago there were still a few loco-hauled/propelled workings on the Firenze-Borgo route. On 17/10 the 12 55 ex-SMN was a D445, as was the 16 55 on 24/10. Unfortunately I was unable to identify either loco due to a combination of oil spillage and graffiti. On the afternoon of 17/10 there were at least three D455s visble on depot at Firenze Romito, one of which was standing at the head of - but not coupled to - the breakdown train. Meanwhile D445 1073 was stabled shut-down on the headshunt at the South end of Siena station and at least another five locos were visible on the depot.

 

[Richard Scott]

Yes, I'm afraid all the Siena services are now worked by units, including the infamous 13 52 school train to Chiusi and its return working early next morning. However a couple of weeks ago there were still a few loco-hauled/propelled workings on the Firenze-Borgo route. On 17/10 the 12 55 ex-SMN was a D445, as was the 16 55 on 24/10. Unfortunately I was unable to identify either loco due to a combination of oil spillage and graffiti. On the afternoon of 17/10 there were at least three D455s visble on depot at Firenze Romito, one of which was standing at the head of - but not coupled to - the breakdown train. Meanwhile D445 1073 was stabled shut-down on the headshunt at the South end of Siena station and at least another five locos were visible on the depot.

Thanks, looks like I can partially answer my own question, 1073 looked like it had arrived from Siena this morning and 1115 from Borgo. 1090 and 1035 (I did check this one twice as took me by surprise) on the depot at Florence.
Currently heading for Rome so going to hijack my own thread, what Voltage is high speed line as looks like heavy duty wire? Looks as though it could be 3kV but, if so, surprised it's not 25kV?

 

[D6130]

and 1035 (I did check this one twice as took me by surprise) on the depot at Florence.

1035 is one of the first batch - which now have no train heat or push-pull equipment - and are used on breakdown train standby duties around the network, or on a dwindling number of freight duties. The sporadic Empoli-Castellina in Chianti steel trip is booked for a pair of these locos, but sometimes produces a D445 and a G-2000 in tandem. Presumably the G-2000 works the train from its point of origin - wherever that is (anybody know?) as far as Empoli....and if there is only one D445/10 available it works through to Castellina on the front of the G-2000 to provide sufficient power for the steep gradients beyond Poggibonsi. I'm assuming that Siena drivers don't sign open-access companies' G-2000s....but said companies must have to provide a driver for tandem working.

A pair of Siena-based D445/10s can also usually be found at Lucca for the trip to the paper mill at Diecimo on the Garfagnana line to Aulla.

I'm wondering how the D445s change over between Siena and Firenze. Do they do it with light engine movements....or is there still an early morning loco-worked passenger service out in the early morning and back in the late evening? I couldn't see any MDVC/MDVE push-pull stock on my recent visit to Siena, so presumably the Borgo workings use Firenze-based stock. Unfortunately, on that visit I didn't have the opportunity to chat to any drivers.

 

[ABB125]

Currently heading for Rome so going to hijack my own thread, what Voltage is high speed line as looks like heavy duty wire? Looks as though it could be 3kV but, if so, surprised it's not 25kV

The original line from Rome to Florence is 3kV, everything else built afterwards is 25kV (except for when it rejoins the classic network on the approach to major cities).

 

[D6130]

The original line from Rome to Florence is 3kV, everything else built afterwards is 25kV (except for when it rejoins the classic network on the approach to major cities).

At present Regionale Veloce and Inter-City services, operated by single voltage DC-only class E464 and E401 class electric locos, run on the Firenze-Roma high speed line between Firenze and Arezzo and Orte and Roma (Settebagni). However the long-term aspiration is to convert that section to 25 Kv AC, to allow an increase in the maximum permitted speed from 250 to 300 km/h. This would mean that any remaining IC services would have to be operated by dual-voltage class E402 locos....and the RV services would either have to be worked by new dual-voltage EMUs, or diverted via the much slower original line through Monterotondo.

 

[Richard Scott]

Thanks all for the info.
I'll answer my own question with observations from today.
Borgo SL line still pretty good for locos on evening turns, hauled turns out of Florence were 14.19, 15.55, 16.55 and 17.55, that I saw producing 4 different locos - 4451137, 4451118, 4451116 and 4451138.
Still lots of loco hauled trains around Florence with 464s. I know these are fairly common but still preferable to the plastic units that have recently come in.

 

[D6130]

Thanks all for the info.
I'll answer my own question with observations from today.
Borgo SL line still pretty good for locos on evening turns, hauled turns out of Florence were 14.19, 15.55, 16.55 and 17.55, that I saw producing 4 different locos - 4451137, 4451118, 4451116 and 4451138.
Still lots of loco hauled trains around Florence with 464s. I know these are fairly common but still preferable to the plastic units that have recently come in.

Also several InterCities in each direction by-passing Santa Maria Novella and calling instead at Rifredi and/or Campo di Marte....hauled or propelled by class E401 locos. Plus the Nightjet sleepers to/fro Muenchen and Vienna....hauled by E402s.

The 14 19 FSMN-Borgo SL is the 'school train' and will probably be the last working to go over to hybrid units.

 

[Richard Scott]

Also several InterCities in each direction by-passing Santa Maria Novella and calling instead at Rifredi and/or Campo di Marte....hauled or propelled by class E401 locos. Plus the Nightjet sleepers to/fro Muenchen and Vienna....hauled by E402s.

The 14 19 FSMN-Borgo SL is the 'school train' and will probably be the last working to go over to hybrid units.

Yes, did see one of the IC trains and there were lots of school children on the 14.19 train!!