Should We Leave the EU?

[EM2]

Do you personally have the solution to the minutiae of every single political, economic, social and environmental problem that could possibly occur in mind before voting in a general election?

Most people generally have some idea of how they think whatever problems concern them should be solved, and vote either for the party that they think will solve them, or the party whose manifesto has told them how they will solve them.

 

[Howardh]

Most people generally have some idea of how they think whatever problems concern them should be solved, and vote either for the party that they think will solve them, or the party whose manifesto has told them how they will solve them.

deleted

 

[EM2]

I really don't think Ireland is a major issue. EU citizens will have free movement into Ireland, and be able to get access to (rather generous) benefits, access to healthcare, a proper job without resorting to the black market (as they won't be illegal) and no fear of being deported unless they break the law.
If I was Georgi in Sofia, once I'd landed in Dublin, that's where I'd be staying. What possible advantage would I have going to the North?

 

[yorksrob]

My guess is option 1.

There won't be restrictions on EU nationals entering the country. There may well be restrictions on whether they can legally work in the UK, but how this would be enforced remains to be seen.

 

[Howardh]

I really don't think Ireland is a major issue. EU citizens will have free movement into Ireland, and be able to get access to (rather generous) benefits, access to healthcare, a proper job without resorting to the black market (as they won't be illegal) and no fear of being deported unless they break the law.
If I was Georgi in Sofia, once I'd landed in Dublin, that's where I'd be staying. What possible advantage would I have going to the North?

Or, what possible advantage would I have in coming to Great Britain? If it's not a problem, immigration isn't an issue, so why all the fuss?
Why is Farage standing in front of posters that shows hundreds of migrants on the march? Bizarre.

 

[Gutfright]

2. The border ramains as it is, but there are stronger checks on flights - and in particular - ferries between the North and Great Britain.
**This means compulsory photo ID for our citizens wishing to travel from one part of our country to another. If the EU demanded we had compulsory ID cards to travel within our own country, Brexiters would go through the roof, but it's THEIR suggestion.

Do yourself and the remain cause a favour, drop this hysterical idiotic nonsense about compulsory ID cards.

As things currently stand, unless you're willing to swim across the Irish Sea, you already need identification to travel from NI to mainland Britain, perhaps post-Brexit the requirements may be tightened and a passport or driving licence may be the only forms of ID accepted. Who knows?

The point is that you don't need to introduce compulsory ID cards. Passports are already a thing.

That, of course, doesn't solve the problem of Northern Ireland being swamped with illegal EU migrants.

How many illegal EU migrants do you imagine will swamp Northern Ireland? 10,000 per year? 100,000 per year? 1 million?

 

[Howardh]

My guess is option 1.

There won't be restrictions on EU nationals entering the country. There may well be restrictions on whether they can legally work in the UK, but how this would be enforced remains to be seen.

I think so too, you will end up with pretty much the same system that Cameron's worked on - no welfare/benefits etc for several years, virtually "starving" them home using a crude term; or more likely they can see the futility of coming in the first place. Enforcement will be expensive, how much does it cost to root out, arrest, send to court and remove physically an illegal? And the extra cost when he/she returns??

Think we will need free movement of people to get the deals Brexit want...but if their Big Aim is an epic fail, why bother leaving the EU and have all the uncertainty of renegotiations (and time...expense...delay...uncertainty...)?

I think the only reason Cameron offered the referendum was to get Farage off his back at General Elections, and at that time Remain was a certain winner.

In the cold light of day that we might actually have a Brexit win, Farage might be laughing (but he can leave politics..job done..) but Gove, Johnson and the rest of them are having a right old cold sweat.

They've promised so much, and can't deliver any of it. I'm hoping Brexit win fro the Schudenfreude effect > except it could hit my savings, pensions, chances of retiring in the sunshine, and the amount of booze I can bring back to obliterate the thought of the mess we are in

 

[EM2]

Or, what possible advantage would I have in coming to Great Britain? If it's not a problem, immigration isn't an issue, so why all the fuss?
Why is Farage standing in front of posters that shows hundreds of migrants on the march? Bizarre.

I'm talking post-Brexit, and specifically in relation to Northern Ireland.
People currently may prefer to live in the UK to Ireland for all sorts of reasons, when it's a level playing field. But when the rules become heavily weighted in one direction, it's very different.

 

[Howardh]

Do yourself and the remain cause a favour, drop this hysterical idiotic nonsense about compulsory ID cards.

As things currently stand, unless you're willing to swim across the Irish Sea, you already need identification to travel from NI to mainland Britain, perhaps post-Brexit the requirements may be tightened and a passport or driving licence may be the only forms of ID accepted. Who knows?

The point is that you don't need to introduce compulsory ID cards. Passports are already a thing.



How many illegal EU migrants do you imagine will swamp Northern Ireland? 10,000 per year? 100,000 per year? 1 million?

Anybody's guess. How many risk their lives trying to cross the Med in a dodgy dinghy? Just a few?? How many will get a cheap Ryanair jobbie to Dublin and a bus ticket? Lot harder than crossing the Med, huh??
Fact is, no-one has a clue as to how many will encamp in Norn. Might be none. Might be 100,000. If it's closer to 100,000 than 0, how are Brexit gonna cope? What are their plans? Surely they've thought of it? They can't go into a referendum without a list of best and worst-case senarios?


Edit; WAIT A MINUTE _ I DO KNOW, exactly! I saw Nigel's advert photograph where he's showing hundreds of migrants in a line trying to get in. Well, there's all those for starters! Farage MUST be right, yes?? I'll find it and count them...

Yes, ID is required between NI and GB, but last time I looked NI was in the UK (why pass the buck) and the ID required can be very minimal, and very likely forged. But how much would the UK government have to give to Norn to deal with these illegals? No-one who doesn't travel outside the UK (and Ireland) is required to have a passport. But you want everyone who wants to travel between Norn and Scotland now to have one??
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

I'm talking post-Brexit, and specifically in relation to Northern Ireland.
People currently may prefer to live in the UK to Ireland for all sorts of reasons, when it's a level playing field. But when the rules become heavily weighted in one direction, it's very different.

Northern Ireland IS the UK. Once there, it's our problem. Please don't patronise me by saying they will never, someway, find their way across to the mainland. And even if they tried, it would be massively expensive and time-consuming to arrest them, cage them, go through the deportation protocol including court + appeals, and then physically move them out...that's assuming they've somewhere to go (maybe they have *lost* their passport??) > and remember, we need the cash to "save the NHS".

Oh, and then they return via exactly the same route.....

 

[yorksrob]

I think so too, you will end up with pretty much the same system that Cameron's worked on - no welfare/benefits etc for several years, virtually "starving" them home using a crude term; or more likely they can see the futility of coming in the first place. Enforcement will be expensive, how much does it cost to root out, arrest, send to court and remove physically an illegal? And the extra cost when he/she returns??

Think we will need free movement of people to get the deals Brexit want...but if their Big Aim is an epic fail, why bother leaving the EU and have all the uncertainty of renegotiations (and time...expense...delay...uncertainty...)?

I think the only reason Cameron offered the referendum was to get Farage off his back at General Elections, and at that time Remain was a certain winner.

In the cold light of day that we might actually have a Brexit win, Farage might be laughing (but he can leave politics..job done..) but Gove, Johnson and the rest of them are having a right old cold sweat.

They've promised so much, and can't deliver any of it. I'm hoping Brexit win fro the Schudenfreude effect > except it could hit my savings, pensions, chances of retiring in the sunshine, and the amount of booze I can bring back to obliterate the thought of the mess we are in

You say all of these things such as "starving" people out of home, which is terrible for the individual, but of course no different from our policy for non EU nationals, or for that matter, an Englishman, were they to stow away to Australia for example. There's not much of a moral argument in this respect because even the majority of remain voters wouldn't be prepared to treat all countries in the world the same.

As far as savings, pensions etc, I suspect that a lot of these risks are underlying, to do with the national current account and our reliance on foreign investment (our own City which should be funding industry being more interested in taking a fast buck) than leaving the EU.

Mark Carney himself, when talking about the risks of "relying on the kindness of strangers" was alluding to the current account, and that has everything to do with too much money going out of the economy compared to what is going in. The EU is a market mechanism but it is open to question whether it encourages too much money going out compared to what goes in.

 

[Gutfright]

Anybody's guess. How many risk their lives trying to cross the Med in a dodgy dinghy? Just a few??

How many EU citizens risk their lives trying to cross the Med in a dodgy dinghy? Zero. Why do you ask?

How many will get a cheap Ryanair jobbie to Dublin and a bus ticket? Lot harder than crossing the Med, huh??

Are you talking about EU citizens or non-EU? If you're talking non-EU, how exactly do they get into Ireland without an EU passport?

NB - swim across the Irish Sea?? Where, exactly, has any remainer written that? No need to, there are plenty of legal and legitimate flights and ferries to go round.

In order to cross from NI to GB, you can either...

1) Book a flight
2) Get a ferry
3) Swim across the Irish Sea
4) Buy an ACME slingshot and try to catapult yourself over the sea
5) Try to dig a secret tunnel underneath the sea
6) Try to fly across using wings made of wax and feathers (getting too close to the sun shouldn't be an issue in NI!)

If you choose options 1) or 2) you are already required to have ID and are liable to identity checks. Perhaps post-Brexit the identity checks will become more frequent and gas bills will no longer be considered satisfactory ID? Much of it depends on how many EU citizens decide that working illegally in the UK is preferable to working legally, and with full entitlement to benefits, in the EU.

 

[miami]

As things currently stand, unless you're willing to swim across the Irish Sea, you already need identification to travel from NI to mainland Britain

No you don't. Last time I flew from Belfast I didn't even show my BA exec club card (they just scanned the boarding pass at the entrance to the lounge). Even if you did have to show ID, that doesn't prove a right to visit, reside or work in the UK.

perhaps post-Brexit the requirements may be tightened and a passport or driving licence may be the only forms of ID accepted. Who knows?

You don't seem to grasp the political situation in NI do you?

How many illegal EU migrants do you imagine will swamp Northern Ireland? 10,000 per year? 100,000 per year? 1 million?

I agree that Ireland is a very unlikely path in. I would put about 80% chance of the UK signing up for free-movement and no work-restrictions like Norway does, and 20% chance of visa-free movement for tourist and business purposes.

Anyone wanting to stay in the UK can simply fly in to Heathrow like the rest of us, then disappear into the black market, just like the Poles did in 2004.

Most immigration rhetoric seems to be about Syrians and refugees in general in any case.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

Edit; WAIT A MINUTE _ I DO KNOW, exactly! I saw Nigel's advert photograph where he's showing hundreds of migrants in a line trying to get in.

Queueing? They must be at least Half-British, let them in!

 

[Howardh]

How many EU citizens risk their lives trying to cross the Med in a dodgy dinghy? Zero. Why do you ask?
To make the point which you've clearly missed that it's dead easy to fly to Ireland and there's just the check of your EU passport. When the GB borders *close* they won't require hiding in lorrys, just an air and bus ticket to get into the UK.


Are you talking about EU citizens or non-EU? If you're talking non-EU, how exactly do they get into Ireland without an EU passport?

EU, clearly.

In order to cross from NI to GB, you can either...

1) Book a flight
2) Get a ferry
3) Swim across the Irish Sea
4) Buy an ACME slingshot and try to catapult yourself over the sea
5) Try to dig a secret tunnel underneath the sea
6) Try to fly across using wings made of wax and feathers (getting too close to the sun shouldn't be an issue in NI!)
You missed (7) dig a tunnel.

If you choose options 1) or 2) you are already required to have ID and are liable to identity checks. Yes, I accept that, but the problem is anyone "caught" trying to get from Norn to the mainland is ALREADY in the UK and their removal will have to be paid BY US> Perhaps post-Brexit the identity checks will become more frequent and gas bills will no longer be considered satisfactory ID? Much of it depends on how many EU citizens decide that working illegally in the UK is preferable to working legally, and with full entitlement to benefits, in the EU.
If the best legal wage they can get in the EU is less than a back-hand wage they can get in the UK - maybe they can't get a job in germany or Holland but can for £2.50/hr in Czech); they will come here. That happens now (or we wouldn't have such a fuss about EU's being "cheap labour" so Brexit or not, little will change except they can be deported (with all the cost that entails) and they can simply return - hence it's pointless voting Brexit if immigration and the black economy is your major issue.

Don't get me wrong...I DO want to see immigration controlled, and everyone here working legally and paying into the system. Just Farage's Way isn't the way to do it..it's too flawed and could actually INCREASE the UK's population (even without any illegals) if ex-pats return and retiree's/workers etc fail to move abroad, and legal's bring in their families and breed.

Those illegals coming in through the Irish border (and the back of lorries etc) won't be counted in, and won't appear on any official stats; so even if there are thousands, the official figure will be zero; a win-win for your beloved Nigel!
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---
Quick addition; genuinely true, I sailed from Holyhead to Dublin 2 or 3 yrs ago with a cash train/ferry ticket; my passport was looked out going out here (in the UK) but was never examined (nor any ID asked for) again (arriving there, setting off there or returning here).
No idea if that's just an odd day and there wasn't the staff, or that's the general procedure.
Can anyone who is neutral in the Brexit debate confirm what the situation is today r/e ID between the UK and Ireland and the UK and Norn?
Passports and photo ID are "advised" last time I looked.

 

[miami]

I don't think you're a politician. I'm asking you why you're voting Brexit when you haven't got a good solution to the problem in Northern Ireland. Why don't you just say your solution?

There is no "good" solution to Ireland. Thanks to a variety of people, from Mo Mowlam to Colin Parry to Tony Blair to *spit* Gerry Adams (and far more than those few), we have a working solution. For now. Just about.

 

[Gutfright]

No you don't. Last time I flew from Belfast I didn't even show my BA exec club card (they just scanned the boarding pass at the entrance to the lounge). Even if you did have to show ID, that doesn't prove a right to visit, reside or work in the UK.

You need ID to travel between NI and GB in the same way that you need a driving licence to drive on public highways.

If your ID shows you are a British or Irish citizen, that does prove a right to visit, reside or work in the UK.

If your ID shows that you're one of those foreign types, you would need to also show that you have a right to visit, reside or work in the UK. That's kind of the point of identity checks, which are already carried out (although not 100% of the time, as you've already shown).

The only potential difference post-Brexit would be that non-UK or Irish EU citizens may need to also provide visas when undergoing identity checks. I'd also expect the number of identity checks carried out to go up if illegal immigration through Ireland proves to be a major problem.

You don't seem to grasp the political situation in NI do you?

What is the point of saying this?

 

[miami]

Can anyone who is neutral in the Brexit debate confirm what the situation is today r/e ID between the UK and Ireland and the UK and Norn?
Passports and photo ID are "advised" last time I looked.

There are elements in the various terrorist acts (Schedule 7) where the police can demand to see identification, and even detain you if not provided, in any form of transport to/from Northern Ireland. This certainly isn't normal behaviour though, and is only allowed in determining if said person is a "terrorist"

An examining officer may question a person to whom this paragraph applies for the purpose of determining whether he appears to be a person falling within section 40(1)(b).
(2)This paragraph applies to a person if—
(a)he is at a port or in the border area, and
(b)the examining officer believes that the person’s presence at the port or in the area is connected with his entering or leaving Great Britain or Northern Ireland [F1or his travelling by air within Great Britain or within Northern Ireland].

(3)This paragraph also applies to a person on a ship or aircraft which has arrived [F2at any place in Great Britain or Northern Ireland (whether from within or outside Great Britain or Northern Ireland).]

(4)An examining officer may exercise his powers under this paragraph whether or not he has grounds for suspecting that a person falls within section 40(1)(b).

Section 40(1)(b) is a person who

is or has been concerned in the commission, preparation or instigation of acts of terrorism.

Aside from that there are no ID requirements to travel between NI and GB.
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You need ID to travel between NI and GB in the same way that you need a driving licence to drive on public highways.

Incorrect.

If your ID shows you are a British or Irish citizen, that does prove a right to visit, reside or work in the UK.

Incorrect. Well technically I guess it is correct, but the only ID that shows this is a passport, and that is not needed - and indeed many people don't own a passport. A driving licence for example shows nothing to do with citizenship.

If your ID shows that you're one of those foreign types, you would need to also show that you have a right to visit, reside or work in the UK. That's kind of the point of identity checks, which are already carried out (although not 100% of the time, as you've already shown).

Incorrect.

The only potential difference post-Brexit would be that non-UK or Irish EU citizens may need to also provide visas when undergoing identity checks. I'd also expect the number of identity checks carried out to go up if illegal immigration through Ireland proves to be a major problem.

There is currently no legal facility for checks on immigration status to be carried out on routes from Northern Ireland to Great Britain, and more than there is on routes from the Isles of Scilly to Great Britain.

The only legal powers held for those checks currently is to determine if a person is or has been concerned in the commission, preparation or instigation of acts of terrorism.

This applies to flights from London to Manchester, London to Belfast, or Belfast to Manchester.

Some airlines require photo id for revenue protection purposes. BA is not one of these airlines.

 

[Xenophon PCDGS]

In the days when "the troubles" were in full spate in Northern Ireland, the paramilitaries on both sides would have had a lucrative "protection racket" set up for all such immigrants, should the "threatened" flood of immigrants had ever happened then.

Mind you, who is to say that something similar would not happen in these times?

 

[Howardh]

There are elements in the various terrorist acts (Schedule 7) where the police can demand to see identification, and even detain you if not provided, in any form of transport to/from Northern Ireland. This certainly isn't normal behaviour though, and is only allowed in determining if said person is a "terrorist"



Section 40(1)(b) is a person who



Aside from that there are no ID requirements to travel between NI and GB.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---


Incorrect.



Incorrect. Well technically I guess it is correct, but the only ID that shows this is a passport, and that is not needed - and indeed many people don't own a passport. A driving licence for example shows nothing to do with citizenship.



Incorrect.



There is currently no legal facility for checks on immigration status to be carried out on routes from Northern Ireland to Great Britain, and more than there is on routes from the Isles of Scilly to Great Britain.

The only legal powers held for those checks currently is to determine if a person is or has been concerned in the commission, preparation or instigation of acts of terrorism.

This applies to flights from London to Manchester, London to Belfast, or Belfast to Manchester.

Some airlines require photo id for revenue protection purposes. BA is not one of these airlines.

Thanks for all that, illuminating. Thought all airlines (going anywhere) required photo ID to match the ticket to the ID for terrorist purposes, ie. not immigration - and if you say BA do not, what do they do?
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

In the days when "the troubles" were in full spate in Northern Ireland, the paramilitaries on both sides would have had a lucrative "protection racket" set up for all such immigrants, should the "threatened" flood of immigrants had ever happened then.

Mind you, who is to say that something similar would not happen in these times?

Think some of the immigrants are perfectly capable of their own protection racket!
Think I'm only half-joking too; on a totally aside issue, round my parts it's fair to say the locals believe the police won't enter certain areas, not necessarily of solid housing, shall we say. Not my view, obvs!

 

[miami]

Thanks for all that, illuminating. Thought all airlines (going anywhere) required photo ID to match the ticket to the ID for terrorist purposes, ie. not immigration - and if you say BA do not, what do they do?

The UK government (via the police) have the authority to stop and identify domestic airline passengers. I've had this done myself between Heathrow and Manchester, I was rather obstructive in my co-operation as they were not following the required rules. Eventually I showed them a boarding pass.

BA don't give a stuff about suspected terrorists, or illegal immigrants for that matter. They check passports on international flights as they would be fined if they transported someone without a passport/visa at the far end. This doesn't happen on domestic flights.

On domestic flights they are happy with no ID whatsoever (aside from a boarding pass), unless checking a bag in, in which case a credit card, or a BA executive club card, in the right name, is fine. An American travelling from London to Belfast would not be asked for a passport for example.

It's not the airline's job to enforce immigration policy.

 

[Gutfright]

Some airlines require photo id for revenue protection purposes. BA is not one of these airlines.

I've asked this question of the leave camp on this thread before, and have been met with a wall of silence, but I'm an optimist so I'll ask again:

Can anyone name a single airline or ferry company who will carry you across the Irish Sea but do not reserve the right to perform identity checks?

Just name one, that's all I ask.

Hint: BA is not one of them...

Identification on UK internal flights

If you are flying solely within the UK, including Northern Ireland, you do not need a passport but we advise that you carry photographic identification with you when travelling, such as your passport or driving licence. This may be requested at certain points in your journey. Children under the age of 16 years old do not require identification to travel within the UK.
Identification on flights between the UK and Republic of Ireland

If you are a citizen of the UK or Republic of Ireland who was born in that country you do not need a passport to travel between the two countries but you do require some form of photographic identification, such as a driving licence.
All other travellers require a valid passport to travel between the two countries.

 

[miami]

I've asked this question of the leave camp on this thread before, and have been met with a wall of silence, but I'm an optimist so I'll ask again:

Can anyone name a single airline or ferry company who will carry you across the Irish Sea but do not reserve the right to perform identity checks?

Just name one, that's all I ask.

Hint: BA is not one of them...

The two countries refers to the UK and the ROI, not a domestic flight from Belfast to London, so no idea why you even quoted that.

BA do not ask for ID on domestic flights. You may be asked for ID by PSNI - there are stands in Belfast airport for those purposes. The police also stop-and-search people getting of the tube at Walthamtow, however it is not a common occurrence.


"If you are flying solely within the UK, including Northern Ireland, you do not need a passport but we advise that you carry photographic identification with you when travelling, such as your passport or driving licence. This may be requested at certain points in your journey."

BA make no distinction between London to Manchester and London to Belfast, they don't care either way, however due to the terrorism act 2000 you may be asked for ID, but only for the purposes outlined above. There is no legal basis for generic immigration checks for people travelling inside the UK.

 

[Gutfright]

The two countries refers to the UK and the ROI, not a domestic flight from Belfast to London.

The top paragraph referred to UK internal flights.

You may be asked for ID by PSNI - there are stands in Belfast airport for those purposes. The police also stop-and-search people getting of the tube at Walthamtow, however it is not a common occurrence.

The point is that the UK government already have the authority to stop and identify domestic airline passengers. We already have a mechanism which can be used to identify illegal immigrants without tearing up the Common Travel Area or introducing compulsory ID cards.

No laws or agreements need to change for the UK government to be able to check the identity of people travelling from NI to GB.

 

[Spamcan81]

Ordinary consumers do cross borders to take advantage of lower tax rates, the most obvious example being tobacco where there are lots of cigarette shops in Belgium at the border with France. People also shop online and get deliveries from other EU countries.

AIUI within the EU, for on line shopping the VAT rate is levied at the rate chargeable in the customer's home nation.

 

[EM2]

Northern Ireland IS the UK.
I didn't say that it wasn't.
Once there, it's our problem. Please don't patronise me by saying they will never, someway, find their way across to the mainland.
Indeed it would be. But why would you run the risk of being an illegal immigrant in the UK, when you can be a legal immigrant in the RoI?

Minimum wage in Ireland is not much different (£7.19 equivalent), accommodation is cheaper (outside of the large cities anyway), benefits are more generous (I was actually better off out of work than in it in 2004!).

 

[Howardh]

I've asked this question of the leave camp on this thread before, and have been met with a wall of silence, but I'm an optimist so I'll ask again:

Can anyone name a single airline or ferry company who will carry you across the Irish Sea but do not reserve the right to perform identity checks?

Just name one, that's all I ask.

Hint: BA is not one of them...

Yes, you've answered your own question there. Travel between ROI and UK is immaterial* - travel within the UK does not require ID, even if it's strongly advised.
*Anyone worried about checks at Dublin which could prevent entry to the UK simply cross the border unmolested and cross the Irish sea from Norn.

 

[Busaholic]

I've asked this question of the leave camp on this thread before, and have been met with a wall of silence, but I'm an optimist so I'll ask again:

Can anyone name a single airline or ferry company who will carry you across the Irish Sea but do not reserve the right to perform identity checks?

Just name one, that's all I ask.

Hint: BA is not one of them...

In my neck of the woods, domestic flights are like hens' teeth, but Flybe make it quite clear what identification is required before they will allow you to board one such and they all require a photographic ID other than the one exception of a pension book. Personally, I might find it difficult to meet their requirements, as my driver's licence is so old it is pre-photographic, and I have no valid passport. They certainly enforce this, as an acquaintance was forbidden to board such a flight from London and had a rush to get to Paddington for the last train of the day.

 

[Howardh]

In my neck of the woods, domestic flights are like hens' teeth, but Flybe make it quite clear what identification is required before they will allow you to board one such and they all require a photographic ID other than the one exception of a pension book. Personally, I might find it difficult to meet their requirements, as my driver's licence is so old it is pre-photographic, and I have no valid passport. They certainly enforce this, as an acquaintance was forbidden to board such a flight from London and had a rush to get to Paddington for the last train of the day.

This will be for security r/e someone blowing the plane up, and not an immigration requirement I presume?

 

[Busaholic]

This will be for security r/e someone blowing the plane up, and not an immigration requirement I presume?

So what's the difference? Either way, you don't get to board without it.

 

[Gutfright]

Yes, you've answered your own question there. Travel between ROI and UK is immaterial* - travel within the UK does not require ID, even if it's strongly advised.
*Anyone worried about checks at Dublin which could prevent entry to the UK simply cross the border unmolested and cross the Irish sea from Norn.

ID is not required, but as the website states [Photo ID] may be requested at certain points in your journey.

You do not have the 'right' to not be indentified by the authorities just because you're on a domestic flight.

 

[Howardh]

Just a thought;

Suppose it was accepted all round that you had to show a passport or similar ID to travel from Norn to GB by air or ferry.

Joe Polish turns up at the gate @ Belfast with his EU passport; and shows it to the nice stewardess. It's a valid EU passport, not a fake or owt.

How's the airline gonna know if Joe's a legal or illegal immigrant? His passport could be fine for moving around the EU. So, check on a data base?
He might not even have attempted to enter the UK before, so no record of him not having *the points*. In other words, do the government get the airline or ferry company to do their work for them? Check to see what points he has - if any - and decide themselves if he should be allowed to continue?? What the hell's it got to do with an airline or ferry company?
Or do we have immigration points staffed by UK immigration officers at all ferry ports between Norn and GB?
So we end up moving across a (sort of) foreign border (IRL/NI) unchecked, but we get checked moving around our own country?
That really IS bizarre. Now, if the EU suggested that....