Should Leeds - Doncaster be half hourly?

[Harvey B]

Am I the only one that thinks Leeds to Doncaster should be half hourly instead of the current hourly service it gets unless I'm missing something and there's a second DMU operated service which extends to Sheffield.

 

[northernchris]

Am I the only one that thinks Leeds to Doncaster should be half hourly instead of the current hourly service it gets unless I'm missing something and there's a second DMU operated service which extends to Sheffield.

Combined with the Sheffield service, the West Yorkshire stations get 2 trains an hour (although poorly spaced towards Leeds) as South Elmsall and Moorthorpe tickets are valid at either station. It would be nice to have a couple of extra peak services, such as reinstating the 1657 Leeds - Doncaster should units and crew permit but otherwise the Doncaster services don't seem too busy off peak

 

[darloscott]

Don't forget the main flows from Leeds, Wakefield and Doncaster already have the two LNER services every hour too. They do stick extras in morning and evening peak of course.

 

[Harvey B]

Don't forget the main flows from Leeds, Wakefield and Doncaster already have the two LNER services every hour too. They do stick extras in morning and evening peak of course.

Im not counting LNER services but im more counting Northern operated commuter services

 

[Harvey B]

Combined with the Sheffield service, the West Yorkshire stations get 2 trains an hour (although poorly spaced towards Leeds) as South Elmsall and Moorthorpe tickets are valid at either station. It would be nice to have a couple of extra peak services, such as reinstating the 1657 Leeds - Doncaster should units and crew permit but otherwise the Doncaster services don't seem too busy off peak

Explains why it's not already, I'd also agree with you on reinstating peak services and adding 2 peak services an hour full stop.
it would make sense to me to make it half hourly and out two extra 331 diagrams on to make it half hourly since Leeds are getting 12 331s.

 

[yoyothehobo]

Is there space to drop them in at Leeds?

 

[Harvey B]

Is there space to drop them in at Leeds?

Im not sure, if they added an extra diagram then maybe

 

[JonathanH]

The South Yorkshire stations (Doncaster, Bentley, Adwick) also get 2tph with the Adwick terminators so really the only 1tph bit is that over the South Yorkshire / West Yorkshire boundary.

No real reason to make Leeds to Sheffield stoppers 2tph either as most stations through that route (Moorthorpe, Thurnscoe, Goldthorpe, Bolton-on-Dearne excepted) get 2tph.

Interesting thought whether an hourly service via Pontefract Baghill (which would give 2tph at the four Dearne Valley stations could now sustain itself - I guess not.

 

[Bantamzen]

Am I the only one that thinks Leeds to Doncaster should be half hourly instead of the current hourly service it gets unless I'm missing something and there's a second DMU operated service which extends to Sheffield.

Outside of peak hours I'm not sure there is demand. As already stated South Elmsall / Moorthorpe to Leeds already has 2tph albeit not quite at half hourly instances, and this is because you have to accommodate 2 LNERs & a XC service. Travel on a service south of Sandal & Agbrigg and services outside of the peaks start to get fairly quiet. I think the current provision is more or less adequate for the demand.

 

[Harvey B]

The South Yorkshire stations (Doncaster, Bentley, Adwick) also get 2tph with the Adwick terminators so really the only 1tph bit is that over the South Yorkshire / West Yorkshire boundary.

Os that 2TPH in each direction or 1TPH in each direction

 

[Starmill]

Im not counting LNER services but im more counting Northern operated commuter services

Why not? You made a thread focusing on Leeds to Doncaster. People can use LNER services for Leeds or Wakefield Westgate to Doncaster and vice versa. There are also 4 Grand Central services between Wakefield and Doncaster.

You've already acknowledged that 2tph are provided from the West Yorkshire local stations to Leeds, and from Adwick and Bentley to Doncaster. So what sort of additional services do you want?

Is your argument that there should be more than 1tph from South Elmsall, Adwick and Bentley to Leeds? A reasonable argument perhaps but how many people are actually affected? Or is your argument that Fitzwilliam, Sandal & Agbrigg and Outwood should have 3tph to Leeds? Or both of the above?

 

[Iskra]

The current service is absolutely fine (as mentioned most stations get 2tph), I think you'd struggle to find paths for another stopper and the 4-car EMU's seem to carry fresh air outside of the peaks. I'm really not sure what extra demand exists.

 

[Harvey B]

Why not? You made a thread focusing on Leeds to Doncaster. People can use LNER services for Leeds or Wakefield Westgate to Doncaster and vice versa. There are also 4 Grand Central services between Wakefield and Doncaster.

You've already acknowledged that 2tph are provided from the West Yorkshire local stations to Leeds, and from Adwick and Bentley to Doncaster. So what sort of additional services do you want?

Is your argument that there should be more than 1tph from South Elmsall, Adwick and Bentley to Leeds? A reasonable argument perhaps but how many people are actually affected? Or is your argument that Fitzwilliam, Sandal & Agbrigg and Outwood should have 3tph to Leeds? Or both of the above?

Firstly, it wasn't really me who started the thread and I was intending to post it in the 331 diagrams thread.

Secondly, my argument for this is there should be extra services from bentley, adwick and south elmsall to Leeds or Fitwzwilliam, sandall & Agbrigg to Doncaster (mind you people could always go to doncaster from the former 3 stations and Wakefield from Fitzwilliam and sandall & agbrigg to get to whereever you're going) but it also would save someone who lives in bentley, for example and works in Leeds for example waiting an hour for the next train. My focus was really the the stops in between Leeds and Donny. Maybe a solution to this could be more trains during the peaks

Thridly, with it being generally a commuter service I would have genuinely thought it would have had trains every half hour.
(Just to let you know im not trying to be rude here)

 

[Starmill]

Thridly, with it being generally a commuter service I would have genuinely thought it would have had trains every half hour.

Nearly all of the places along the route do have two trains an hour already - to Doncaster, or to Leeds.

My focus was really the the stops in between Leeds and Donny.

I see. Unless you actually say so, nobody will really know though.

Maybe a solution to this could be more trains during the peaks

It could. There are already additional services at peak times, though.

 

[Harvey B]

Nearly all of the places along the route do have two trains an hour already - to Doncaster, or to Leeds.

Thanks, then they could change at either Wakey, Leeds or Donny to get to their end point.

I see. Unless you actually say so, nobody will really know though.

Thanks for the advice.

It could. There are already additional services at peak times, though.

IIRC there's only two services which are additional (one in the morning and one at night) but IMHO I think more services could be added at peak times.

 

[yorkie]

Firstly, it wasn't really me who started the thread and I was intending to post it in the 331 diagrams thread.

Please do ensure you post in the correct thread, but contact me privately directly if you wish to discuss this further.

Secondly, my argument for this is there should be extra services from bentley, adwick and south elmsall to Leeds or Fitwzwilliam, sandall & Agbrigg to Doncaster (mind you people could always go to doncaster from the former 3 stations and Wakefield from Fitzwilliam and sandall & agbrigg to get to whereever you're going) but it also would save someone who lives in bentley, for example and works in Leeds for example waiting an hour for the next train. My focus was really the the stops in between Leeds and Donny. Maybe a solution to this could be more trains during the peaks

Thridly, with it being generally a commuter service I would have genuinely thought it would have had trains every half hour.
(Just to let you know im not trying to be rude here)

The problem is that there are already a lot of trains on this line. The existing stopping trains aren't busy enough to justify an additional stopper really.

 

[Starmill]

someone who lives in bentley, for example and works in Leeds for example waiting an hour for the next train

There is no need for the customer to wait an hour. Let's say that they get to the station one minute too late, and arrive on the platform just in time to see the 0929 from Bentley to Leeds drawing out. Damn. It happens to the best of us.

There is no need for this person to twiddle their thumbs for 60 minutes. Half an hour later there is a 1000 departure to Doncaster. From Doncaster there is a connection for Leeds. This has almost exactly the same journey time as the direct train. By doing this, the person will arrive in Leeds 25 minutes sooner than if they sat and waited at Bentley. There is no reason not to offer this. Unfortunately, the likes of trainline, Northern and LNER will try and pretend that this journey does not exist. Very customer-focused of them! All good journey planning websites will offer this option though.

 

[Harvey B]

The problem is that there are already a lot of trains on this line. The existing stopping trains aren't busy enough to justify an additional stopper really.

Hearing it from every other member so far. I think I agree

 

[Harvey B]

There is no need for the customer to wait an hour. Let's say that they get to the station one minute too late, and arrive on the platform just in time to see the 0929 from Bentley to Leeds drawing out. Damn. It happens to the best of us.

There is no need for this person to twiddle their thumbs for 60 minutes. Half an hour later there is a 1000 departure to Doncaster. From Doncaster there is a connection for Leeds. This has almost exactly the same journey time as the direct train. By doing this, the person will arrive in Leeds 25 minutes sooner than if they sat and waited at Bentley. There is no reason not to offer this. Unfortunately, the likes of trainline, Northern and LNER will try and pretend that this journey does not exist. Very customer-focused of them! All good journey planning websites will offer this option though.

Thanks, answers my question