Sheffield Supertram Master Thread

[bb21]

They still have the bus / tram ticket, yes, £4 I believe (I referred to it above). I am only doing the third side of the triangle however, so I don't intend to buy one for what is a five minute tops trip! I'd settle for the £1.50 minimum fare

Edit - I meant 'singles only' as they don't do returns - only singles and then the rover.

It will be £1.50. There is a central fare zone on the Supertram for the lowest fare which extends to the station, University of Sheffield and somewhere along the third branch. Given that you are only going to Hyde Park, my money is on this only costing £1.50

 

[WillPS]

University, Hyde Park, Spring Lane are the boundaries of the £1.50 zone.

 

[34D]

They still have the bus / tram ticket, yes, £4 I believe (I referred to it above). I am only doing the third side of the triangle however, so I don't intend to buy one for what is a five minute tops trip! I'd settle for the £1.50 minimum fare

Edit - I meant 'singles only' as they don't do returns - only singles and then the rover.

Please could you report back whether or not your trip is successful, as i'd be interested to know (and times, destination display, etc etc).

 

[Peter Mugridge]

Just a thought, but is it possible if we had enough people far enough in advance we could arrange a charter so we could all bag the third side at a reasonable time like an early afternoon on a Saturday...?

 

[Harpers Tate]

Apparently you can do the third side in one direction on normal service trams thus:
Morning trams from Cricket Inn Road at the following times to Herdings Park or Halfway: 0520 SSuX, 0522 SO, 0530 SSuX, 0531 SO, 0539 SSuX, 0542 SO, 0559 SSuX, 0600 SuX, 0602 SO, 0659 SSuX, 0713 SSuX, 0719 SSuX, 0721 SuO, 0722 SSuX, 0739 SSuX, 0741 SuO, 0801 SuO, 0850 SO, 0916 SO.
But as far as I know, never in the other.

 

[Peter Mugridge]

Yes, but look at the times of those - I suspect very few of us live near enough to get those without having to stay over?

 

[bradders1983]

The engineering works start on Sunday which means no trams will run between Spring Land and the City Centre for a good 12 weeks. Anyone know where the trams will be kept overnight that cant get back to the depot?

 

[WillPS]

Just a thought, but is it possible if we had enough people far enough in advance we could arrange a charter so we could all bag the third side at a reasonable time like an early afternoon on a Saturday...?

That'd be daft, there's usually at least a couple of Sundays a year when the purple route avoids the City. Wait it out and one will happen.

The engineering works start on Sunday which means no trams will run between Spring Land and the City Centre for a good 12 weeks. Anyone know where the trams will be kept overnight that cant get back to the depot?

Good question. Are they going to ensure one line is open so they can (manually?) get a few trams through to Halfway in the morning and back at the end of the night?

It'll be good to see (some of) the bus stops on Park Grange Road finally getting some use after nearly a year.

 

[bradders1983]

That'd be daft, there's usually at least a couple of Sundays a year when the purple route avoids the City. Wait it out and one will happen.



Good question. Are they going to ensure one line is open so they can (manually?) get a few trams through to Halfway in the morning and back at the end of the night?

Cant see it as it could conflict with traffic, either at night or when they return to service in the morning (or both, depending on the schedule of works)
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---
http://www.supertram.com/uploads/KC1173RailreplacementtimetablebookletVis7.pdf

No details on the specific breakdown of works though. Part of the works will require me to perform a moving traffic offence to get out onto the main road.

 

[30mog]

Looks to me like some trams might be stabled at Halfway terminus during the works. I nearly crashed the car when I saw a tram travelling up the 'wrong line' at Waterthorpe earlier today. But a little closer to Halfway terminus. I noticed three trams parked just out of the terminus forcing trams in service onto wrong side. Which would hint at single track working from Crystal Peaks.

 

[edwin_m]

Can't speak for Sheffield, but for similar work elsewhere trams have been outbased overnight, presumably with some security presence. It is possible to work a tram "wrong line" though street sections but this effectively involves closing the road, so it would only be done at quiet times when a tram had to get back to the main depot for maintenance.

 

[WillPS]

Just seen a tram going down Park Grange Road on the wrong side of the tracks, with the destination 'Football Special'. So that answers that question.

I wonder if this is happening every night?
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---
And just now (0245) 3 have just thundered up the hill in quick succession, with a Supertram van immediately behind.

 

[talltim]

This creates more questions than answers.

Are Supertram also still getting new trams for existing routes? Talk was, so that a 5min headway would be possible between Gleadless Townend and Hillsborough.

Four more trams are being ordered, as well as the trams for the tram-train trial. They will all be to the tram-train spec to allow flexibility and standardisation

Yes I understand tram train trial will run on tram tracks in the city. But, is it intended for rail services to continue as now while trams run on NR tracks. As in, stand at Rotherham Central and see trams and trains depart from same platforms? And if so, can't see how the very different platform levels are going to be integrated, especially for disabled passengers?

The platforms will be extended, with a low height section, I assume at the south of the existing ones, and also an assumption, a ramp between the two levels

And finally. Aren't Northern Rail supposed to be a project partner? And if so why the assumption the tram trains will be in Stagecoach colours?

Because Stagecoach will be running the trams. Network Rail are also partners, but no-one is suggesting they be yellow!

 

[button_boxer]

It's been interesting chatting to conductors this week about what they think of the new ticket machines that were launched on Monday. The new machines have a built-in smartcard reader and conductors are now expected to scan all ENCTS passes - great news for SYPTE who now have accurate stats on pass usage, less good for Stagecoach who are missing out on revenue from full fares because it takes a conductor twice as long to get round a busy tram (if they have a group of 5 pensioners they now have to spend 15+ seconds scanning passes rather than 2-3 seconds pressing buttons).

Does anyone know whether these new machines will tie into the StagecoachSmart online ticket shop system? At the moment you can buy smart tickets online that are valid on trams but you have to pick them up from a bus ticket machine before you can use the tram.

 

[WillPS]

I would hope so. I'd also like to see contactless debit/credit cards accepted.

What would help is if they installed card readers at the entrance so people could scan themselves in.

 

[Harpers Tate]

I haven't witnessed the conductors' machines on the tram yet, but it constantly astounds me how long it takes for most bus ticket machines to produce a ticket, and consequently how long buses have to stand at stops when picking up a few fare-payers. If I were a large bus operator, I'd be exerting pressure on the machine makers to put a far greater emphasis on speed.

 

[Ben Jones]

SmartCards can now be uploaded on trams, and about time too. They are slightly cheaper than the 'scratch card' equivalents purchased at the travel centres, and far more convenient for regular users as recurring payments can be set up. This works for weekly & monthly.

Haven't chatted with any conductors, but my sharp ears tell me that a lot of them are less than pleased with their new machines, but like anything it'll just take some getting used to.

As I say, a long awaited kick into 21st century ticketing.

 

[button_boxer]

Haven't chatted with any conductors, but my sharp ears tell me that a lot of them are less than pleased with their new machines, but like anything it'll just take some getting used to.

The conductors I've spoken to tend to agree that they will gradually get more used to where all the different tickets are on their new machines, but that doesn't change the fundamental issue that they're now expected to scan each concession pass individually (rather than just press a button to register each one). This is what slows down their workflow to the point that they're missing out on full fares when the tram is busy.

 

[30mog]

Has anyone got anything to report on using a tram/bus combo around the Park Grange Road works?

From a personal view. I have only done two trips. But without boring you with the details, I would describe one instance as superb in terms of organisation and minimisation of extra journey time. While the other was utterly shambolic. On the latter, I have felt like emailing them a complaint, but fear not being able to keep the content to less than 350 swear words.

 

[WillPS]

Has anyone got anything to report on using a tram/bus combo around the Park Grange Road works?

From a personal view. I have only done two trips. But without boring you with the details, I would describe one instance as superb in terms of organisation and minimisation of extra journey time. While the other was utterly shambolic. On the latter, I have felt like emailing them a complaint, but fear not being able to keep the content to less than 350 swear words.

From somebody who lives just outside the Park Grange tram stop, it's a bloody nightmare. They have upped the frequency of the B2 to Every 10 Minutes at peak times now though, which is good.

What narks me is they're only giving a small discount on weekly tickets, no other discounts at all.

 

[bradders1983]

Well the summer tramline replacement works are 10 weeks in, out of a scheduled 12, and I would say they are only about halfway through,

Furthermore, there are rumours going around that some of the track has had to be lifted as it was the wrong track or something like that.

So far the contractors and the local PTE have ignored all requests from me as to an update on a estimated finishing date and as far as everyone else is concerned, trams start again on the 16th September. That certainly wont be happening!

Therefore I have contacted the Sheffield Star newspaper to investigate.

 

[syorksdeano]

Therefore I have contacted the Sheffield Star newspaper to investigate.

hahahahaha more chance of winning the lottery than getting them to investigate anything.

But I do have to say, the work looks nowhere near completion, and I wouldn't even say half way through

 

[bradders1983]

hahahahaha more chance of winning the lottery than getting them to investigate anything.

True but with all other parties ignoring me, its the best I can do.

 

[button_boxer]

I've not seen anything official but one conductor last week told me things were going slower than hoped and the best estimate they could give was mid-October.

 

[WillPS]

So now the official word is "end of October" - but in reality they're not even half way through, they haven't touched what would usually be the downhill direction track at all (except maybe a stretch between Beeches Drive and Park Grange Croft). I'm trying not to be on of 'those guys' on Sheffield Forum, but the contractors don't act like they're several weeks/months behind schedule at all! When you see what Network Rail pulled off in Nottingham in a couple of days over a month, it really begs questions of Volker Rail.

Worse still is Stagecoach's half thought out replacement bus timetable. From next week, the replacement bus is extended up to Gleadless Townend. This means an end to the split Express/Stopping B1/B2 service, and a replacement all-stops B3 to Gleadless Townend. This will mean that in order to get to town from my tram stop, I will need to take the bus heading up all the way to Gleadless Townend, and then stay on that bus all the way back in to town. Park Grange [Road] to Castle Square is, by tram, an 8 minute journey. By the B2, it's a 22 minute journey. Using the B3, it'll be a 35 minute journey. That's insane!

Surely the thing to do would have been to maintain the B2 and operate the B3 as an express as far as Manor Top?

 

[bradders1983]

So now the official word is "end of October" - but in reality they're not even half way through, they haven't touched what would usually be the downhill direction track at all (except maybe a stretch between Beeches Drive and Park Grange Croft). I'm trying not to be on of 'those guys' on Sheffield Forum, but the contractors don't act like they're several weeks/months behind schedule at all! When you see what Network Rail pulled off in Nottingham in a couple of days over a month, it really begs questions of Volker Rail.

Worse still is Stagecoach's half thought out replacement bus timetable. From next week, the replacement bus is extended up to Gleadless Townend. This means an end to the split Express/Stopping B1/B2 service, and a replacement all-stops B3 to Gleadless Townend. This will mean that in order to get to town from my tram stop, I will need to take the bus heading up all the way to Gleadless Townend, and then stay on that bus all the way back in to town. Park Grange [Road] to Castle Square is, by tram, an 8 minute journey. By the B2, it's a 22 minute journey. Using the B3, it'll be a 35 minute journey. That's insane!

Surely the thing to do would have been to maintain the B2 and operate the B3 as an express as far as Manor Top?

You could always get off the B3 at Spring Lane and walk the 50 yards round the corner to pick up a downhill B3 from the bus stop next to the petrol station?

Worst case scenario is that you pick up the same one you got off but in reality there is likely to be one in front of it somewhere.

 

[button_boxer]

So now the official word is "end of October" - but in reality they're not even half way through, they haven't touched what would usually be the downhill direction track at all (except maybe a stretch between Beeches Drive and Park Grange Croft). I'm trying not to be on of 'those guys' on Sheffield Forum, but the contractors don't act like they're several weeks/months behind schedule at all! When you see what Network Rail pulled off in Nottingham in a couple of days over a month, it really begs questions of Volker Rail.

The leaflet I saw on the tram this morning said something along the lines of they'd had problems with the process of preparing the concrete base for new track but have now worked out a faster method which they will be using for the rest of the work. So we should in theory expect the second track to take rather less time than the first.

 

[WillPS]

Is this the very first time work of this type has ever been undertaken? Smells rather of poor planning and/or a poor contractor choice. Anyway, work doesn't seem to be going any quicker, they've still got a significant chunk of the up side to do, before they get going with the downhill side.

 

[Starmill]

When I went to Sheffield Supertram back in early July most of the conductors were mainly in somewhat miserable resignation at the new machines. One said he'd had 45 minutes training a couple of months ago and been back to work that morning with it and didn't have a clue what he was doing!

I was surprised by how cheap it was too - £2.50 for a Y-P Plusbus Day! Unbelievable compared to the cost of other trams! Though my 'plusbus' was recorded around 25 times that day given the vast number of journeys I made if you counted every time I got on a new tram as a single! If money is drawn from the plusbus 'pot' like this I took out about 5 times more than I put in clearly!

One conductor was really unhappy though - he said when his tram is busy he still puts in the free passes manually - and when challenged by management he told them either I do that or you lose the cash fares revenue. I did try to cheer a few up by pointing out that SYPTE were getting on with smartcards much better than TfGM, my local, although since then a great many poles fro Smartcard readers have appeared at Manchester tram stops.

Regarding the works... I take it trams didn't resume service today? It reminds me of Manchester's blanket City Centre track closure in 2009... I think.

 

[34D]

One conductor was really unhappy though - he said when his tram is busy he still puts in the free passes manually - and when challenged by management he told them either I do that or you lose the cash fares revenue.

I do totally disagree with this. Should be for broken passes only.

Are the machines the same used by conductors in Blackpool and Leeds?