David57
Member
Had an e-mail from serco yesterday, saying that ScotRail are handling berth only bookings into the serco takeover period.
Farce.
Farce.
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Serco for Sleeper
- Thread starter Steve childs
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It is looking more and more that this is just the tip of the iceberg. April will be a critical month for the new franchise when most of the UK's media wil be waiting to pounce when the slightest thing goes wrong. With no concrete plans in place on how the logistics will be carried out i.e staffing, motive power, maintenance and stabling, I fear that the whole thing could collapse in the first few weeks.
Serco really do look as if they have stumbled into this blindly and the best PR move for them would be to come out with the detailed plans on how the whole thing will work, starting with telling the staff!
scotraildriver
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It is pretty shocking with a month to go and none of the current staff have a clue whats going on. The only guarantee is that Abellio Scotrail guards will continue to work the service, being hired by Serco. This has been confirmed in writing. As for everyone else....
Fishplate84
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It all looks a bit loose but to be fair to Serco, Transport Scotland probably decided to split the ScotRail franchise without having any clue how integrated it all was. You've probably got First Group walking away in no mood to help, Abellio trying to get their head around the business and Serco stuck in the middle trying to unpick pieces of if that nobody has really understood until they've had to do it.
A franchise transfer is usually relatively simple, transfer contracts and people, change a few visual bits like signs and website branding and keep everything pretty much the same for a while as the new management finds out exactly how the business operates and where all the bodies are buried.
Why Transport Scotland didn't force First to physically separate the sleeper operation and account for it clearly in the last couple of years if they wanted to let it as a separate business is anyones guess. The other obvious way would have been to have the new ScotRail franchisee do it in their first couple of years instead, and then let it as a separate franchise.
But one integrated operation into two wholly separate ones with two totally new operators on the same day, neither of which can be expected to fully understand the infinite detail of how it all works now? Brave or stupid.
Long term it'll be fine and probably a good decision but the way they've done it without much understanding of the detail and not thought through the implications sets it up for failure.
A franchise transfer is usually relatively simple, transfer contracts and people, change a few visual bits like signs and website branding and keep everything pretty much the same for a while as the new management finds out exactly how the business operates and where all the bodies are buried.
Why Transport Scotland didn't force First to physically separate the sleeper operation and account for it clearly in the last couple of years if they wanted to let it as a separate business is anyones guess. The other obvious way would have been to have the new ScotRail franchisee do it in their first couple of years instead, and then let it as a separate franchise.
But one integrated operation into two wholly separate ones with two totally new operators on the same day, neither of which can be expected to fully understand the infinite detail of how it all works now? Brave or stupid.
Long term it'll be fine and probably a good decision but the way they've done it without much understanding of the detail and not thought through the implications sets it up for failure.
Good to see earlier boarding times:
Edinburgh-Euston: changed from 2300 to 2100.
Glasgow-Euston: from 2200 to 2100.
Aberdeen-Euston: from 2110 to 2000.
Euston-Edinburgh: from 2300 to 2145.
Euston-Glasgow: from 2300 to 2145.
Yes it's not been withdrawn, that would definitely have made waves if it was!
Altnabreac
Established Member
Yes this is very sensible. My wife often uses the Sleeper to come home after a late finishing meeting in London. Last Central London departures by day train or Air is surprisingly early.
However she would much rather be able to have dinner and then go straight to her cabin at 21.45 than the 23.00 time now. You can wait in the lounge of course but much better to just get unpacked and your head down earlier.
Altnabreac
Established Member
The ITT specified bikes and luggage for berth passengers had to be directly conveyed "with no further passenger input after boarding".
It seems there will either be a bike space in the Hybrid carriage or staff will have to move the bikes at Edinburgh.
For seated passengers the ITT said it preferred they didn't have to change carriages but this could be ignored if there was a "commercial justification".
Serco obviously feel the loss of an Aberdeen or Inverness sleeper carriage outweighs the disbenefit of seated passengers changing.
For budget conscious travellers there is at least now the Pod option to Fort William with no change required.
bavvo
Member
Ok, random question. Does the sleeper still carry shellfish from the Highlands to London, and will this continue under Serco? I saw it mentioned here and a couple of other places, although I don't know if that info is up to date (and there seems to be no mention in the franchise docs).
Seems a curious hangover from the past (although I'd love it to be true).
Seems a curious hangover from the past (although I'd love it to be true).
Altnabreac
Established Member
I believe it still runs (Inverness - London southbound only).
It is explicitly mentioned in the ITT.
I haven't seen it mentioned in the Franchise document.
Transport Scotland ITT 4.1.2.2 said:
The current welcome brochure that sleeper passengers find on their berths mentions it.
scotraildriver
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A nasty rumour. Serco have had job ads in the noticeboards for a couple of months now.
Abellio have had staff roadshows and a Q&A on their website since the turn of the year. It's no secret things are changing, but Serco seem to be keeping their cards close to their chest for whatever reason. The simple fact is the workers affected can't trust a company that doesn't engage and let their staff in on the plans.
As someone has mentioned though Abellio have the easiest out of the two as they just take over - Serco have to pick the bones and seperate a whole business out of a larger one - this takes time. And you may find that this month they will ramp up the staff engagement seeing how its a month till the take over isnt it?
No doubt they got the more complicated franchise which does make us wonder if they are ready for it. Nobody at the current Scotrail wants to see this fail. We have too many colleagues and soon to be ex colleagues TUPE'd over relying on this franchise to work.
I definitely would expect more info to come out this month.
higthomas
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Wow, seriously wow. I am absolutely flabbergasted that this still exists, but I must say it seems sensible, and I love it.
Is there a goods compartment built into the spec for the new stock? The one in the BUO at the moment is very roughly 16 cubic metres.
Steve childs
Member
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Have you seen the Tessa document? Serco have said they plan to reduce costs by head count i hope the link works from my phone. The RMT have failed everyone on this information. Its a dam shame for the staff. I hope abellio stick to their work. More so I hope the stupid rumours stop. Made up drivel. http://www.tssa.org.uk/en/Your-unio...vices-and-to-serco-caledonian-sleeper-service
Yes, Priv. "box" cards are valid with the appropriate berth supplement. No Priv. travel in the seated coach however.
In most cases you are cheaper to forgo your "box" and buy a berth inclusive Priv. Advance fare.
BRX
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- 20 Oct 2008
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I've just booked on the FTW for May/June.
The prices seemed fairly similar to what I might have expected from Scotrail in previous years. Not cheap, but about 25% cheaper than an off-peak return plus supplements (and it looks like it would still have been possible to book that way via the Scotrail website).
I think the website is good. Much less confusing than doing it on the Scotrail one. And it makes it easy to flip through a few consecutive days to see what the cheapest is for each.
I do think it's important that the ability to buy a regular ticket/supplement combination continues after the franchise swap-over, though, for reasons already mentioned in the thread. On this occasion going both ways by sleeper suited me fine but often I want to go up on the sleeper, and return by day train, with a flexibility on that date and the possibility to break the journey.
The refund up until the day before is nice (and surprising). Although looking at the T&Cs it looks like there's an admin charge of £10 ticket. So, I don't know if that means that the actual refund on all the tickets I've just booked (a single each way for two people) would be subject to a cost of £40. They could do with clarifying this on the booking page.
Also, they don't seem to offer the option to book through to, say, Mallaig or Kyle of Lochalsh. You'd have to do that in a separate transaction with Scotrail. Not so user friendly.
I noted that on most days (but not all) the seated option was listed as "sold out". Seems odd. I've rarely seen that coach full on the FTW service. I wonder if that means there's an allocation of tickets that hasn't been released onto the system yet.
By the way, upthread there was a bit of discussion about retiming of trains and whether the FTW sleeper could arrive an hour or two earlier. While that would be useful for connections through to the small isles etc, I don't think overall it would be positive. Part of the pleasure of that service is that you don't have to get up super-early to sit and have your breakfast watching the scenery go by.
In any case an earlier arrival can be achieved by getting the sleeper to Glasgow and then on the earlier Scotrail service up the WHL.
What would be more useful would be to retime the FTW-mallaig trains so that there was one that conveniently connected with the arrival of the sleeper.
The prices seemed fairly similar to what I might have expected from Scotrail in previous years. Not cheap, but about 25% cheaper than an off-peak return plus supplements (and it looks like it would still have been possible to book that way via the Scotrail website).
I think the website is good. Much less confusing than doing it on the Scotrail one. And it makes it easy to flip through a few consecutive days to see what the cheapest is for each.
I do think it's important that the ability to buy a regular ticket/supplement combination continues after the franchise swap-over, though, for reasons already mentioned in the thread. On this occasion going both ways by sleeper suited me fine but often I want to go up on the sleeper, and return by day train, with a flexibility on that date and the possibility to break the journey.
The refund up until the day before is nice (and surprising). Although looking at the T&Cs it looks like there's an admin charge of £10 ticket. So, I don't know if that means that the actual refund on all the tickets I've just booked (a single each way for two people) would be subject to a cost of £40. They could do with clarifying this on the booking page.
Also, they don't seem to offer the option to book through to, say, Mallaig or Kyle of Lochalsh. You'd have to do that in a separate transaction with Scotrail. Not so user friendly.
I noted that on most days (but not all) the seated option was listed as "sold out". Seems odd. I've rarely seen that coach full on the FTW service. I wonder if that means there's an allocation of tickets that hasn't been released onto the system yet.
By the way, upthread there was a bit of discussion about retiming of trains and whether the FTW sleeper could arrive an hour or two earlier. While that would be useful for connections through to the small isles etc, I don't think overall it would be positive. Part of the pleasure of that service is that you don't have to get up super-early to sit and have your breakfast watching the scenery go by.
In any case an earlier arrival can be achieved by getting the sleeper to Glasgow and then on the earlier Scotrail service up the WHL.
What would be more useful would be to retime the FTW-mallaig trains so that there was one that conveniently connected with the arrival of the sleeper.
BRX
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I note they are insisting on calling travellers "guests". Even more irritating than using "customers" as became the fashion with other operators some time ago.
What's wrong with "passengers"?!!
What's wrong with "passengers"?!!
Bletchleyite
Veteran Member
And, of course, in Germany the word "Fahrgast" is commonly used for "Passenger", though "Passagier" is I suppose the direct equivalent.
I think I like it better than the horribly generic "Customer".
Neil
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