Seat Reservations Question

[Alex C.]

I travelled from London to Liverpool yesterday - I booked the seats well in advance, and got a table which suited us brilliantly as there were 4 of us.

When we got on the train, we found our seats occupied - when asking the people to move, they pointed out the reservation LCD display showed the seats as available (one was reserved to Preston - the train didn't even stop in Preston) and refused to move.

We did speak to one of the on board staff who confirmed that they were our seats, but it appeared that there was a problem with the reservation display. He initially told us to explain to the people sitting down which we did, but they again refused to move on the basis of it being "available"

The staff member did then say he'd explain but when he went to the table he saw there was a child as part of the party and said he couldn't ask them to move and we would need to find seats elsewhere.

We did - but not a table seat which was definitely disappointing.

Is there any point in me pursuing further with Virgin? I realise it's not the end of the world and I'm not expecting any big gesture but the service was fairly non-existant.

 

[Flamingo]

IMHO, a child being part of the other group has bugger-all to do with shifting them or not. It sounds like somebody is taking their "Conflict Avoidance" training a bit too seriously!

What IS relevant is that the reservation system was not working, the guard should have either come with you first time and explained this to the other group, or declared the whole reservations a write-off but found you an alternative that would have accomidated you as a group if possible.

I would pursue it to a certain point , it's the sort of complaint that Customer Services get all warm and fuzzy about and send vouchers for.

If you had reserved seats and asked for a table, but not been allocated one, that would be different, but in this case it sounds like worth a bit of pursueing, but don't get too hung-up on it, you did get to your destination after all!

 

[thenorthern]

I would ask for compensation, if you have reserved a seat you should expect to be able to sit in it.

Did the Screen say "[seat number] Available" or just "[seat number]"?

 

[Alex C.]

three of them said e.g "09 AVAILABLE" and one said "10 RESERVED TO PRESTON" or something along those lines.

Clearly a problem with the reservation system as the train wasn't stopping at Preston!

I'll send off a letter to Virgin at some point in the hope of a couple of quid off a future journey... worst they can say is no!

 

[thenorthern]

three of them said e.g "09 AVAILABLE" and one said "10 RESERVED TO PRESTON" or something along those lines.

Clearly a problem with the reservation system as the train wasn't stopping at Preston!

I'll send off a letter to Virgin at some point in the hope of a couple of quid off a future journey... worst they can say is no!

I would ask Virgin Trains for compensation, I had a problem the other day with a train where it did the same thing but the train was empty so I got my seat. Its normally a case that the reservations were downloaded incorrectly or were not downloaded at all.

The best way to contact them to ask them what to do is to tweet them @VirginTrains.

 

[yorkie]

He initially told us to explain to the people sitting down which we did, but they again refused to move on the basis of it being "available"

Why would you expect them to move if the seats said 'Available'?

I'd complain to Virgin because on almost every other operator, the policy is that if the reservation labels aren't out (or, in this case, system not working) then there are no reservations.

This topic has been done to death before, not everyone will agree, but the general consensus appears to be against enforcing invisible reservations.

...and we would need to find seats elsewhere....

I'd argue that the Train Manager should be helping you a bit more with this. One of the purposes of the job is "to ensure the provision of excellent Customer Service in Standard Class" and they are "responsible for using their initiative and discretion... to ensure that all our customers expectations are met." would you say that the TM acted in accordance with those snippets from the job description?

Do you know how busy 1st class was? I'd say a good TM should be upgrading you to 1st class if possible, given there were no alternative table seats available in Standard. That's just my opinion and I am sure some others will disagree, though!

Is there any point in me pursuing further with Virgin? I realise it's not the end of the world and I'm not expecting any big gesture but the service was fairly non-existant.

Yes, but not for refusing to make people move from seats they reasonably thought were available.

I'd concentrate on the fact you specifically requested table seats, and they were not provided, and describe the way you were 'assisted' (or lack of!) deviated from the expectations you had of one of a Virgin Trains 'ambassador' (their words, not mine!)

I'd say you're not entitled to compensation, as you did find alternative seats, but as the seats were not what you were reasonably expecting, they may give you a goodwill gesture.

 

[Muzer]

Yup, I've experienced Virgin upgrading people to first before (specifically it was the last down run of the Pretendolino in normal service, there were no labels and a load of enthusiasts were in the first carriage. Naturally some of them were not at all willing to move, so the TM sent the normals to first).

 

[BestWestern]

I agree with Yorkie and the general idea that no 'labels' (or their supposedly hi tech equivalent, in this case) means no reservations. This should however be announced on board for incoming passengers and ideally displayed on station CIS to allow some advance warning to those paying sufficient attention. I feel the TM's 'advice' was rather shabby; it is both unwise and unfair to expect you to revisit passengers who have already refused to move for you, without the assistance of staff, and it is equally unfair for those passengers to be turfed from seats they have been informed they are perfecy entitled to sit in. Best course of action would have been a simple 'Sorry, no reservations today I'm afraid', and depending on the situation possibly a free ride in First - however, it is well worth bearing in mind the second bit is not always practical or possible.

I would complain on the basis that you were disappointed with your journey; that should be enough to warrant some vouchers given Virgin's customer focus.

 

[ian1944]

Not touching on this particular problem, but the other side of "no visible reservation" - on a recently-used Crosscountry train, the seats had tickets and the little display screens were giving the same details.

 

[work-traveller]

IMHO, a child being part of the other group has bugger-all to do with shifting them or not. It sounds like somebody is taking their "Conflict Avoidance" training a bit too seriously!

Here-here. A child being one of the party is as relevant as not moving them on the grounds that one of them is wearing a navy cardigan.

I think I might have tried the old 'Not to worry Mr.Train Manager, I can see it's a little awkward for you. We'll just carry on up the train until we reach a vacant set of 4 seats around a table - hopefully before we get into 1st class, but if not, then not to worry'. Of course, this would be accompanied by a Nicholson-esque grin. Rather like this one:

http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2013/10/28/article-2478599-18FB74A600000578-794_634x392.jpg

 

[Starmill]

A not insignificant number of Virgin Trains TMs announce that reservations are still to be enforced even when the signs are non-functional. In such cases their only advice to passengers without reservations is to take a seat in coaches U or F.

On almost all Virgin Trains services there are many many available seats in First Class anyway, so I would have thought that, had he or she had time to do so and made an effort, keeping you sat together would not have been too difficult. Presumably the TMs who might consider this and the ones who make the aforementioned announcements are mutually exclusive groups!

 

[Peter Mugridge]

three of them said e.g "09 AVAILABLE" and one said "10 RESERVED TO PRESTON" or something along those lines.

Clearly a problem with the reservation system as the train wasn't stopping at Preston!

That sounds to me as if either they might have uploaded the reservations for the wrong service or the diagrams were stepped up at the last minute and the unit was originally supposed to run another service - and already had the reservations loaded up for that service?