Season tickets to Birkenhead

[exile]

Something seriously wrong with season ticket prices Warrington-Birkenhead....

Warrington-Liverpool - PSF 2060 PSS 1368
Warrington-Birkenhead - PSS 2144 (!!!!!!) - no PSF?

Same with 7 days - Liverpool 7DF 51.50 7DS 34.20
Birkenhead 7DS 53.60 (again no 7DF)

When my wife was regularly buying seasons to Birkenhead they were about 5% dearer than the Liverpool ones.... looks like they've got the 1st class ticket prices instead of standard.... anyway, if we see prices that look wrong, is there anything that can be done?

 

[First class]

Warrington - Liverpool 7DS is £34.20
Warrington - Liverpool 7DF is £51.50

Warrington - Birkenhead 7DS is £53.60
Warrington - Birkenhead 7DF is not available.

I don't see the issue? Birkenhead is further so is correctly more expensive than Liverpool.

The fares are correct. The 7DF Warrington-Liverpool is cheaper than the 7DS Warrington-Birkenhead because Birkenhead is further away. The majority of trains also do NOT have First Class which reflects in the price.

Anyway, a Warrington to Eastham Rake 7DS is only £38.00

You should investigate whether a Runcorn East to Eastham Rake ticket route Any Permitted is valid via Liverpool/Birkenhead, as that is only £29.30 7DS.

 

[ChrisTheRef]

Warrington - Liverpool 7DS is £34.20
Warrington - Liverpool 7DF is £51.50

Warrington - Birkenhead 7DS is £53.60
Warrington - Birkenhead 7DF is not available.

I don't see the issue? Birkenhead is further so is correctly more expensive than Liverpool.

The fares are correct. The 7DF Warrington-Liverpool is cheaper than the 7DS Warrington-Birkenhead because Birkenhead is further away. The majority of trains also do NOT have First Class which reflects in the price.

In that example, it would be cheaper buying the 7 Day Season between Warrington and Liverpool, then SDRs between Liverpool and Birkenhead.

There's no point in a 7DF as there is no First accommodation available between Liverpool and Birkenhead

 

[tony_mac]

I think the issue is that fares from Warrington to Birkenhead have risen by over 50% recently, whereas the fares to Liverpool have not.

 

[calc7]

Perhaps an accidental transposition of 5 and 3 in the price?

 

[tony_mac]

No, the other tickets (single / returns) have also risen by similar amounts.

 

[First class]

It looks like a load of anomalies have been corrected around the Merseyside area. A lot of the ones I used to exploit have gone. The fares to Birkenhead have had to rise because I assume they undercut the Liverpool fares?

 

[exile]

It looks like a load of anomalies have been corrected around the Merseyside area. A lot of the ones I used to exploit have gone. The fares to Birkenhead have had to rise because I assume they undercut the Liverpool fares?

No they don't undercut the Liverpool fares.

Looking at single fares

Warrington-Liverpool £4.60
Warrington-Birkenhead £8.30
Liverpool-Birkenhead £2.30

So, clearly the single fares are wrong anyway - but even assuming
they're not

Warrington-Preston - £11 single - the 7DS fare is cheaper than Warrington-Birkenhead. 26.7 miles compared to 20.5 - although in this case you're travelling by Pendolino in 20 minutes.....

Aren't these fares regulated?

 

[First class]

No they don't undercut the Liverpool fares.

Looking at single fares

Warrington-Liverpool £4.60
Warrington-Birkenhead £8.30
Liverpool-Birkenhead £2.30

So, clearly the single fares are wrong anyway - but even assuming
they're not

Warrington-Preston - £11 single - the 7DS fare is cheaper than Warrington-Birkenhead. 26.7 miles compared to 20.5 - although in this case you're travelling by Pendolino in 20 minutes.....

Aren't these fares regulated?

I don't think people understand "regulation". You could increase a specific regulated fare by 200% so long as you don't bust the "basket" increase.

When it comes to regulation the headline figure, (e.g. 5% increase), is averaged out across all of the fares that the TOC manages. Some fares can go way, way up, some go down or stay the same. As long as the net result is approximately around the permitted %, then DfT/PTE are happy.

 

[exile]

It still seems bizarre that this particular group of fares (from the Warrington area to the Wirral, and to Merseyrail stations north of Liverpool) is so far out of line with other fares in the North West (compare Runcorn or Wigan to Birkenhead). Anyone with any knowledge would of course never buy a through ticket given that splitting is possible, either rebooking at Liverpool (you have to change trains anyway) or buying Merseytravel Zone(Railpass) seasons - though even with splitting, the fare is still substantially increased on previous years.

 

[island]

I don't think people understand "regulation". You could increase a specific regulated fare by 200% so long as you don't bust the "basket" increase.

Are you sure? I seem to remember there being a limit of 5% above the basket change on any one fare (so if the basket goes up 6%, no individual fare can go up more than 11%).

 

[tony_mac]

There are probably people here who know, but it seems as if that was the case - and I guess still is.
http://www.publications.parliament.uk/pa/cm200809/cmselect/cmtran/233/23305.htm

Train operating companies have some flexibility in setting prices through the 'fares basket' system. This allows some individual fares to be increased by up to 5% more than RPI +1%, provided the overall average does not exceed RPI +1%.