Scotrail Stock

[tbtc]

Very much so, but on some routes the Class 158 may have to be retained once the Class 156 have been disposed of (such as WHL, GSW, etc)
It is also possible that a next generation of the Class 170 may be utilised on the remaining Express routes, allowing capacity strengthening
However, even then there will be more rolling stock than services, so some will go

My understanding was that 158s couldn't do the West Highland line or the South Western? (hence 156s still being used)

 

[rail-britain]

My understanding was that 158s couldn't do the West Highland line or the South Western? (hence 156s still being used)

They've said that about so many other routes too, including Class 158 could not operate north of Aberdeen
Once the Class 156 units are life expired they will have no choice, and time is running out

 

[bb21]

As promised, here are some of the pictures I took.

Part 1

1 - Early start for me.
2/3 - Destination Edinburgh. The flight was less than 50% full.
4 - Lothian 991 at Edinburgh Airport.
5 - Lothian 345 at Gyle Centre.
6 - The Royal Scotsman hauled by 57001 at Edinburgh Waverley Platform 2.
7 - (334010) 1007 Edinburgh Waverley - Milngavie at Edinburgh Waverley Platform 7.
8 - (320321) 1057 Airdrie - Balloch at Westerton.
9 - (334010) 1157 Milngavie - Edinburgh Waverley at Milngavie. (318269) Arrived on the 1050 Motherwell - Milngavie.
10 - Just outside Milngavie station. What does the sign mean?

 

[bb21]

Part 2

1 - (320309) 1127 Airdrie - Balloch at Westerton.
2 - (156492 + 156485) 1221 Glasgow Queen Street - Oban / Mallaig at Dalmuir.
3/4 - (156492 + 156485) 1221 Glasgow Queen Street - Oban / Mallaig at Helensburgh Upper.
5 - (334004 + 334017) At Helensburgh Central.
6 - (320305) 1423 Balloch - Airdrie at Balloch.
7 - (318266 + 318270) 1453 Dalmuir - Motherwell at Dalmuir.
8 - (314214) 1535 Glasgow Central - Neilston.
9 - (314202 + 314206) 1650 Cathcart Circle (Clockwise) at Cathcart.
10 - (314214) 1705 Cathcart Circle (Anti-Clockwise) at Shawlands.

 

[bb21]

Part 3

1 - (Refurbished 314212) 1729 Glasgow Central - Newton via Mount Florida.
2 - (314214 Again!) 1820 Newton - Glasgow Central via Maxwell at Newton. What does this sign mean?
3 - (380009) 1905 Glasgow Central - Gourock. (380103) 1900 Glasgow Central - Ayr.
4/5 - (380107) 1950 Glasgow Central - Edinburgh via Carstairs.
6 - (380107) Virtually no one onboard.
7 - [Saturday] (43320 + 43310) 1450 Aberdeen - Doncaster via Carlisle at Edinburgh Waverley.
8/9 - [Saturday] (43320 + 43310) 1450 Aberdeen - Doncaster via Carlisle at Carlisle.

 

[CarterUSM]

The signs mean, termination of sandite application, and commencement of sandite application respectively. Nice to see you enjoyed your time here! There's never anyone on that 1950 Central-Waverley service either!

 

[rail-britain]

Equally, these sand signs are apparently unique to Scotland
The first SAND (line through word) means do NOT sand
This is typically used where open bridges and public walkways are nearby
The second SAND means sanding is permitted

 

[tbtc]

They've said that about so many other routes too, including Class 158 could not operate north of Aberdeen
Once the Class 156 units are life expired they will have no choice, and time is running out

Time is running out for the 156s being life expired?

They are nowhere near the front of that particular queue... plenty life left in them.

 

[First ScotRail]

May be completely not linked but Helensburgh Upper is getting its platforms redone and track readjusted and the contractor doing it says its due to a "new train" coming on the tracks. Are ScotRail looking at moving the 158s onto the WHL?
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

Very likely, however it might see some also returned to RoSCo as electrification takes place throughout the franchise

The 170s are due to get an upgrade shortly by First according to their latest results.

 

[Scotrail84]

May be completely not linked but Helensburgh Upper is getting its platforms redone and track readjusted and the contractor doing it says its due to a "new train" coming on the tracks. Are ScotRail looking at moving the 158s onto the WHL?
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---


The 170s are due to get an upgrade shortly by First according to their latest results.

Sorry mate i think you've been fed a loady pish. I suspect the platform has been replaced due to previous frost damage affecting the copes. This seems like prevention work for the coming winter.

 

[Blindtraveler]

well better do it now than wate til its too late. As to 156s life expiration? Wel personally hate them anyway but talk of replacing them woant please haters of the 14x classes of which I am not one. As to upgrading the 170s, I dont care if every seats nacked if they sort the bogs, strong eggy smel when flushed, fowel!

 

[First ScotRail]

Sorry mate i think you've been fed a loady pish. I suspect the platform has been replaced due to previous frost damage affecting the copes. This seems like prevention work for the coming winter.

Frost damage work was done at start of year. Whole platform being renewed big job. There is a bigger gap as well. It's clearly visible. I don't think it's imminent but it's something to consider.

 

[sprinterguy]

Very likely, however it might see some also returned to RoSCo as electrification takes place throughout the franchise

Although it's nothing but speculation on my part, I'd be quite shocked if the Central Belt electrification saw 170s going off lease from Scotrail instead of one of the two Sprinter classes. More widespread deployment of 170s (The Shotts line still doesn't see them, does it?) on the remaining diesel routes to allow Sprinters to be moved to another TOC would surely be the more likely proposition.

 

[tbtc]

Although it's nothing but speculation on my part, I'd be quite shocked if the Central Belt electrification saw 170s going off lease from Scotrail instead of one of the two Sprinter classes. More widespread deployment of 170s (The Shotts line still doesn't see them, does it?) on the remaining diesel routes to allow Sprinters to be moved to another TOC would surely be the more likely proposition.

Agreed.

156s and 170s will be the way forward.

 

[ainsworth74]

156s and 170s will be the way forward.

It would seem to be the most sensible move to me as well. Then maybe Northern can get back those 158s it 'loaned' to Scotrail that later ended up being a bit more permanent. Actually there are a lot of 158s at Scotrail (48) that's a very useful number to say the least. You could solve capacity issues on Liverpool - Norwich as well as strengthening FGW and Northern's services.

 

[tbtc]

It would seem to be the most sensible move to me as well. Then maybe Northern can get back those 158s it 'loaned' to Scotrail that later ended up being a bit more permanent. Actually there are a lot of 158s at Scotrail (48) that's a very useful number to say the least. You could solve capacity issues on Liverpool - Norwich as well as strengthening FGW and Northern's services.

Oh, don't worry, we'll get those 158s back once the Bathgate line is electrified and ScotRail don't need them any more?

What? It was electrified last year and they've kept the 158s to double up other services?

Oh...

Seriously though, the cascade of 158s (even if FSR need some additional 156s for routes like the Far North to compensate) would make a big difference to Northern (all over!)/ ATW (Manchester - Cardiff)/ EMT (Liverpool - Nottingham)/ FGW (Cardiff - Portsmouth)...

 

[michael769]

More widespread deployment of 170s (The Shotts line still doesn't see them, does it?)

Were the proposed gauge modifications to Fauldhouse Station ever carried out? They were required to clear 170s on the Shotts line IIRC.

 

[marks87]

Perhaps I'm missing something, but why would FSR prefer 156s to 158s?

I always thought the latter were better trains.

 

[CarterUSM]

170's are cleared for passenger use on the Shotts line, and have been for some time. They just are not diagrammed any work. Fauldhouse must have had work done a while back, though it has recently had a new bridge installed too.

 

[ainsworth74]

Perhaps I'm missing something, but why would FSR prefer 156s to 158s?

There are apparently issues with 158s on the West Highland Line that mean they cannot be used there. I'm not entirely sure what they are however...

 

[marks87]

There are apparently issues with 158s on the West Highland Line that mean they cannot be used there. I'm not entirely sure what they are however...

Yes, but there was a suggestion that FSR would accept 156s for the Far North Line, which is currently 158 operated.

 

[tbtc]

Yes, but there was a suggestion that FSR would accept 156s for the Far North Line, which is currently 158 operated.

...because its a waste of a 90mph 158.

When the Central Belt electrification is completed, there'll be a lot of 170s freed up which will replace a lot of 158s (e.g. through Fife/ Aberdeen).

156s are the only FSR DMUs which can run the WHL and GSW, which means the only 158s remaining would be the Far North units. Not worth keeping a micro fleet of just a handful.

 

[rail-britain]

...because its a waste of a 90mph 158.
156s are the only FSR DMUs which can run the WHL and GSW

Sadly that is not the way Transport Scotland look at it
They much prefer the Class 158, from a service level point of view (trolley area, bicycle storage, air conditioning and heating)

At the moment the Class 156 is the only unit which can operate on the WHL and GSW, but the same as the north Highland lines this can change in due course (and will have to during the next franchise)

It was planned to have Class 170 units take over the GSW, but there were many issues with this (timescale, availability, and some minor gauge issues)
I suspect this will proceed in a few years, once the cascade of Class 170 units commences

 

[scotsman]

There are apparently issues with 158s on the West Highland Line that mean they cannot be used there. I'm not entirely sure what they are however...

Gauging issues. A 158 with its doors open cannot pass through a lot of structures on the WHL

 

[Blindtraveler]

can someone enlighten me of the issues with GSW and 170s/158s? For what its worth im witi transport scotland on the 158 v 56 debate.

 

[rail-britain]

can someone enlighten me of the issues with GSW and 170s/158s?

Not just Scotland, all across the UK
The Class 158 can foul some structures, typically means minor platform adjustments

It doesn't typically affect the Class 170 now, as most platforms have been modified (if required)
The issue with the Class 170 on the GSW was just simply availabilty and training
The plan was for the East Kilbride services to commence first, but due to numerous spare Class 156 units it was decided to use these instead

 

[Blindtraveler]

are great, thanks for clearing that up. All that said though, the way its going a single 153 would do for stranrar.

 

[rail-britain]

the way its going a single 153 would do for stranrar

Very unlikely, all bodies have made it clear the fleet would be so small it would not be practical
More likely is the service will be simplified to just Kilmarnock - Stranraer, Glasgow passengers having to change at Ayr

 

[tbtc]

Very unlikely, all bodies have made it clear the fleet would be so small it would not be practical

Hence me thinking that a handful of 158s on the Far North line would be impractical.

 

[rail-britain]

Hence me thinking that a handful of 158s on the Far North line would be impractical.

25 is more than a handful (from memory the requirement is for about 10 for the InverNet services)
It was suggested a long time ago to acquire four Class 153 units, but eventually this was dropped in favour of retaining Class 156