ScotRail class 170s - potential future uses?

[reecestrains]

Should replacements be introduced for the HST's by 2026-2027, what's going to happen with the Class 170's already operating on that route?

 

[Wolfie]

Should replacements be introduced for the HST's by 2026-2027, what's going to happen with the Class 170's already operating on that route?

If they end up surplus 170s will always find a home. Perhaps Chiltern to retire some 165s?

 

[delt1c]

Should replacements be introduced for the HST's by 2026-2027, what's going to happen with the Class 170's already operating on that route?

Hopefully cascaded to more suitable services and in turn release 158's for WHL and Other longer services

 

[reecestrains]

Hopefully cascaded to more suitable services and in turn release 158's for WHL and Other longer services

If 170's were to run on Far North or Kyle of Lochalsh, further infrastructure upgrades would be needed as they're currently not cleared for those routes. I know they've upgraded the track between Inverness and Tain recently.

158's are currently not cleared for West Highland at present.

 

[delt1c]

If 170's were to run on Far North or Kyle of Lochalsh, further infrastructure upgrades would be needed as they're currently not cleared for those routes. I know they've upgraded the track between Inverness and Tain recently.

158's are currently not cleared for West Highland at present.

Not proposing far north or Kyle, and appreciate that the 158's are not cleared for WHL. But much has been speculated for the WHl as 156's are getting long in the tooth for the WHL. Cant think of any other motive power has lasted so long on WHL

 

[reecestrains]

Not proposing far north or Kyle, and appreciate that the 158's are not cleared for WHL. But much has been speculated for the WHl as 156's are getting long in the tooth for the WHL. Cant think of any other motive power has lasted so long on WHL

158's would be a good replacement for West Highland. 170's would struggle up there due to their slow acceleration on upward climbs, that's why I say I think they'd be better suited for Far North and Kyle.

 

[delt1c]

158's would be a good replacement for West Highland. 170's would struggle up there due to their slow acceleration on upward climbs, that's why I say I think they'd be better suited for Far North and Kyle.

Dont disagree but whl needs an upgrade asap

 

[hexagon789]

158's would be a good replacement for West Highland. 170's would struggle up there due to their slow acceleration on upward climbs, that's why I say I think they'd be better suited for Far North and Kyle.

170s perform better than 158s on gradients.

 

[stevieinselby]

158's would be a good replacement for West Highland. 170's would struggle up there due to their slow acceleration on upward climbs, that's why I say I think they'd be better suited for Far North and Kyle.

Also the lack of gangway connections on the 170s would be a problem.

 

[Farigiraf]

Could some of the 170s be used on the Stranraer route, possibly restoring an hourly or 2-hourly service to/from Ayr?

I'm sure CrossCountry would also gladly take them to boost existing services.

 

[snookertam]

There won’t be any surplus 170s.

 

[reecestrains]

A number of the newer ScotRail 170's moved to Northern a few year ago, wherever capacity on services is needed really where the 2 car 158's or 156's exist.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 17 Dec 2024 ==

Also the lack of gangway connections on the 170s would be a problem.

People could change at Crianlarich to ensure they're in the correct part of the train whilst one portion goes to Oban and the other goes to Mallaig.

Dependant if there's any short platforms between Glasgow Queen Street and Crianlarich.

 

[Scotrail84]

ScotRail need all the 170s they currently have. Leven potentially going half hourly from next May means they'll need every available unit in traffic where possible

 

[stevieinselby]

People could change at Crianlarich to ensure they're in the correct part of the train whilst one portion goes to Oban and the other goes to Mallaig.

Dependant if there's any short platforms between Glasgow Queen Street and Crianlarich.

Not good practice to make people change between units though, especially on a line used heavily by tourists with lots of luggage, where the weather has a tendency to be – how can I put this? Scottish – and where there won't be a conductor in one of the units to check everyone's tickets and make sure they are in the correct portion. Also remember that some trains on this route have a catering trolley.

As far as I can see, all the platforms between Queen Street and Crianlarich are at least about 120m long, so could accommodate 5 carriages of Turbostar – so at least you wouldn't have the issue that some people travelling from local stations on that section beyond Crianlarich might not be able to board the correct section of the train ... but it's still pretty problematic. Would a 3-carriage Turbostar provide enough capacity for Fort William and Mallaig in the busy summer? I've only ever used the line at slightly quieter times of year so I don't know how full the current 4-car 156s get.

 

[Transilien]

The 158s are almost as old as the 156s. The West Highland line needs newer trains that aren’t almost life expired. Maybe specially designed stock would be more suitable than ether 170s or 158s.

 

[Scotrail84]

The 158s are almost as old as the 156s. The West Highland line needs newer trains that aren’t almost life expired. Maybe specially designed stock would be more suitable than ether 170s or 158s.

ScotRail eventually want to reduce the number of classes of train in their fleet to only a few. I cant see them ordering units that can really only be used on the WHL if thats what you mean.

 

[Transilien]

ScotRail eventually want to reduce the number of classes of train in their fleet to only a few. I cant see them ordering units that can really only be used on the WHL if thats what you mean.

They could also also order the same units for Far North, Kyle of Lochalsh and Stranraer lines to replace all sprinters in the fleet.

 

[sprinterguy]

Cant think of any other motive power has lasted so long on WHL

Indeed - I think you'd have to go back as far as the D34s and K2s to find anything that had a presence on the WHL for nearly as long as the 156s, but even then neither had a monopoly on passenger day traffic in the same way as the 156s.

There won’t be any surplus 170s.

That was my thought - the HST replacement tender only specifies an incremental increase in the number of diagrams over those already operated by the HSTs.

 

[Avenger20]

Not sure where the idea that there will be surplus 170s is coming from.

The ITT is to provide a fleet of trains to replace the HSTs - that's it. So the new fleet of trains will come and replace the HSTs like for like and 170s will likely continue to operate the services that they operate now, particularly on the Aberdeen corridor.

There certainly won't be any wiggle room to release any of our 170s to another TOC.

 

[Warrior2852]

I've only ever used the line at slightly quieter times of year so I don't know how full the current 4-car 156s get.

Extremely busy, there's a lot of tourists with varying degrees of luggage going to all parts of the line. Even when lots get off at Fort William a whole load more get on to replace them down to Mallaig. And in the busy times it's common for the 6 car combined Oban/Mallaig out of Queen Street to be full and standing.