ScotRail cancelling services July 2024

[Devon Sunset]

How is it action short of a strike if there has been no industrial action called? How many times does it need repeating, they are short of staff. That is the reason for the emergency timetable and the only people responsible for that are sitting in ScotRail HQ with the possible exception of the Scottish Government for not paying for more staff. If staff deciding not to work rest days brings the job to a halt then it's fairly obvious that there is a staffing issue.

 

[InOban]

AIUI
A lot of drivers are reaching retirement.
No new drivers were trained during Covid
They are training new drivers as fast as they can but that training takes at least a year.
They have no difficulty in recruiting these trainees.
What else should scotrail be doing?

 

[swaldman]

How is it action short of a strike if there has been no industrial action called? How many times does it need repeating, they are short of staff. That is the reason for the emergency timetable and the only people responsible for that are sitting in ScotRail HQ with the possible exception of the Scottish Government for not paying for more staff. If staff deciding not to work rest days brings the job to a halt then it's fairly obvious that there is a staffing issue.

Refusing to work rest days, en mass, *IS* action short of a strike. Sort of by definition. It is coordinated industrial action that is not a strike. It just happens to be industrial action that is not a breach of employment contracts.

 

[northscots]

OK, but I doubt the passengers forcibly removed from the train at Edinburgh on Sunday would have known, or cared about, the difference between a strike and action short of a strike; The effect was the same, an utterly abysmal service for the customer.

It wasn't action short of a strike either, just scotrail not having enough drivers to cover their timetable. And nobody was removed from a scotrail service.

 

[Leven Railuser]

Not sure if this is the right place/thread, so mods feel free to move...

The off peak fare trial will come to an end on 27th Sept.

 

[northscots]

Not sure if this is the right place/thread, so mods feel free to move...

The off peak fare trial will come to an end on 27th Sept.

There's a thread in the fares section

 

[sannox]

There are still many, many Scotrail trains which were withdrawn with Covid still missing, what hope now is there for the full Edinburgh/Queen Street, Ayrshire or Barrhead & Kilmarnock services, for example, ever being restored?

Is there a need for them? Working at home has increased many of which were the commuter office market in Glasgow and Edinburgh that filled the pre 9am and post 5pm and brought considerable revenue. Presumably given staff issues they can be rostered more effectively elsewhere.

 

[snookertam]

Is there a need for them? Working at home has increased many of which were the commuter office market in Glasgow and Edinburgh that filled the pre 9am and post 5pm and brought considerable revenue. Presumably given staff issues they can be rostered more effectively elsewhere.

Agreed, the days of a 15 minute weekday service between Edinburgh and Queen Street are over. I’d argue the requirement for two trains per hour between Dundee and Glasgow was a figment of someone’s imagination too but we’re persisting with this for now.

There is a link to the off peak fares trial here which is a demonstration that the genie is out of the bottle as far as car usage now. You could make trains completely free and a fair chunk of the population would prefer their cars. There is a mitigating factor in that the usual timetable is unreliable and has very little resilience, which impacts passenger experience.

All in all, I think a few service cuts outside of the central belt would do ScotRail some good.

 

[northscots]

Agreed, the days of a 15 minute weekday service between Edinburgh and Queen Street are over. I’d argue the requirement for two trains per hour between Dundee and Glasgow was a figment of someone’s imagination too but we’re persisting with this for now.

There is a link to the off peak fares trial here which is a demonstration that the genie is out of the bottle as far as car usage now. You could make trains completely free and a fair chunk of the population would prefer their cars. There is a mitigating factor in that the usual timetable is unreliable and has very little resilience, which impacts passenger experience.

All in all, I think a few service cuts outside of the central belt would do ScotRail some good.

There's already been significant cuts in Aberdeen local services in the previous December timetable change. I wouldn't be surprised if there's more changes on the way to off peak services but that's entirely speculation

 

[GordonT]

I wouldn't be surprised if there's more changes on the way to off peak services but that's entirely speculation

Chopping services purely in the off peak won't always save megabucks if the resources, human and traction, are remaining on the books to cover maybe as few as two peak journeys a day. ScotRail finding creative ways to boost income by filling more of the otherwise empty seats in the off peak might be more productive.

 

[najaB]

ScotRail finding creative ways to boost income by filling more of the otherwise empty seats in the off peak might be more productive.

Indeed. A £5 seat sold and filled is better than a £35 seat that's empty.

 

[WAB]

Chopping services purely in the off peak won't always save megabucks if the resources, human and traction, are remaining on the books to cover maybe as few as two peak journeys a day. ScotRail finding creative ways to boost income by filling more of the otherwise empty seats in the off peak might be more productive.

This being the demographic most put off by the effects of industrial action...

 

[driverd]

As for pre-covid timetable, I don't think we will see that again anytime soon. These services ran at a loss then, they certainly won't bring them back when passenger numbers are even lower.

Would you be able to back this up with some figures? Not to cast doubt, I'm just curious about the raw data/how much of a loss these services ran at and how much of a difference reducing services has made to that situation.

 

[Falcon1200]

How is it action short of a strike if there has been no industrial action called? How many times does it need repeating, they are short of staff. That is the reason for the emergency timetable

It can equally be argued that the reason for the emergency timetable is staff no longer working overtime shifts which they had previously been quite happy to do. That sounds very much like action short of a strike to me.

And nobody was removed from a scotrail service.

Passengers were removed from another operator's service absolutely and entirely due to the lack of Scotrail services. People will be very much aware of that.

Is there a need for them? [pre-Covid services not restored}

Not in all cases, perhaps, but in some, definitely yes. For example, with there being only 1 Glasgow C/Barrhead terminator per hour, half the Kilmarnock trains now call at every single station en route, making the journey slow and tedious, while also not exactly making great use of the electrification to Barrhead.

 

[43066]

It can equally be argued that the reason for the emergency timetable is staff no longer working overtime shifts which they had previously been quite happy to do. That sounds very much like action short of a strike to me.

You can’t reasonably conclude that based on what’s happened. Staff have no obligation to do overtime just as the company has no obligation to offer it. It’s August, peoples’ kids are off school etc.

Why is there always this desperation to blame staff shortages on unions/individual staff members?

 

[Falcon1200]

You can’t reasonably conclude that based on what’s happened.

But that is exactly what's happened, isn't it, as per Post #33? The service until a couple of months was reasonable, all of a sudden it has been decimated.

Why is there always this desperation to blame staff shortages on unions/individual staff members?

I do not actually blame the Unions or individual staff, and I agree absolutely that sufficient staff should be employed to cover a reasonably-anticipated level of absence. However the fact remains that until recently staff did work overtime, thereby lessening the incentive for Scotrail to increase numbers, now as a result of a collective decision to no longer work overtime multiple trains are cancelled.

And BTW the Scottish kids are now back at school (hurrah!)

 

[43066]

But that is exactly what's happened, isn't it, as per Post #33? The service until a couple of months was reasonable, all of a sudden it has been decimated.

But - unless I’ve missed something - there’s no evidence it’s due to industrial action, or a “collective decision”, and Scottail have even stated as much IIRC. It’s simply people choosing to take their time off!

I have rest days coming up. I have a few things planned so am electing not to do overtime (and avoid the crazy levels of overcrowding and frayed tempers this weekend) by your logic I suppose I’m taking action short of a strike by doing so.

However the fact remains that until recently staff did work overtime, thereby lessening the incentive for Scotrail to increase numbers, now as a result of a collective decision to no longer work overtime multiple trains are cancelled.

So if the staff don’t work overtime it’s their fault trains are cancelled. If they do work overtime you’ll say they’re enabling the company not to recruit, so that’s also their fault.

At what point does the company have to take responsibility for any of this?

 

[JamesT]

But - unless I’ve missed something - there’s no evidence it’s due to industrial action, or a “collective decision”, and Scottail have even stated as much IIRC. It’s simply people choosing to take their time off!

I have rest days coming up. I have a few things planned so am electing not to do overtime (and avoid the crazy levels of overcrowding and frayed tempers this weekend) by your logic I suppose I’m taking action short of a strike by doing so.

It does seem remarkably curious that large numbers of staff have all decided at the same time that they value their rest days over overtime. I imagine it has nothing whatsoever to do with them being balloted for strike action at the same time...

 

[Falcon1200]

So if the staff don’t work overtime it’s their fault trains are cancelled. If they do work overtime you’ll say they’re enabling the company not to recruit, so that’s also their fault.

Staff, including me when I was still at work, always have the choice of whether or not to work overtime, and, BTW, not having enough staff to cover shifts, without overtime, at peak absence times, ie mostly the summer, was a fact from the very first day I joined the railway in 1978 to my last day in 2016. But the fact remains, in Scotland staff were happy to work overtime to cover the service, and now they are not, which absolutely is entirely their choice. But it is also the choice of passengers (or rather, not so much a choice as a forced decision) to find other ways to travel when the railway lets them down. And that for me is a risk to the future of all railway staff.

 

[43066]

Staff, including me when I was still at work, always have the choice of whether or not to work overtime, and, BTW, not having enough staff to cover shifts, without overtime, at peak absence times, ie mostly the summer, was a fact from the very first day I joined the railway in 1978 to my last day in 2016.

Not having enough staff to cover shifts may be a fact, but it is also a choice made by the employer. As I say, it just seems a little blinkered to blame staff who don’t work overtime for the consequences of this choice, and also simultaneously blame those who do work overtime for enabling it, while completely ignoring the role of the employer!

But the fact remains, in Scotland staff were happy to work overtime to cover the service, and now they are not, which absolutely is entirely their choice.

Absolutely. I wouldn’t bother working overtime at that marginal tax rate, either.

But it is also the choice of passengers (or rather, not so much a choice as a forced decision) to find other ways to travel when the railway lets them down. And that for me is a risk to the future of all railway staff.

As a rail staff member I don’t consider it a risk at all - if we look at the rest of the UK, passenger numbers are growing strongly, despite two years of chaos (now hopefully at an end). No reason to suppose Scotland will be any different.

 

[sannox]

Not in all cases, perhaps, but in some, definitely yes. For example, with there being only 1 Glasgow C/Barrhead terminator per hour, half the Kilmarnock trains now call at every single station en route, making the journey slow and tedious, while also not exactly making great use of the electrification to Barrhead.

But is there enough demand for reintroducing the semi-fast and 2nd Barrhead terminator? Barrhead stoppers were always lightly loaded in my experience. I agree the stopper train is slower for Kilmarnock customers, (50-ish mins over 40-ish mins on the Semi-Fast to Kilmarnock) but it might just be a better use of resources to have stopping Kilmarnock trains as opposed to having a 2nd service to Barrhead.

 

[320320]

I do not actually blame the Unions or individual staff, and I agree absolutely that sufficient staff should be employed to cover a reasonably-anticipated level of absence. However the fact remains that until recently staff did work overtime, thereby lessening the incentive for Scotrail to increase numbers, now as a result of a collective decision to no longer work overtime multiple trains are cancelled.

And BTW the Scottish kids are now back at school (hurrah!)

If scotrail are happy to be so reliant on staff working overtime to operate the timetable then they should have been more proactive in resolving this dispute before it reached the stage of staff refusing to work that overtime.

They could have made the latest, below inflation offer months ago and avoided this disruption but they chose not to. The blame for this lies squarely at the feet of scotrail/SG not staff, working their contracted hours.

 

[380101]

It does seem remarkably curious that large numbers of staff have all decided at the same time that they value their rest days over overtime. I imagine it has nothing whatsoever to do with them being balloted for strike action at the same time...

The ballot was not sent out until the first week in August, so had nothing to do with drivers deciding to enjoy their contracted time off.

As mentioned elsewhere in this thread, the blame for the timetable chaos lies squarely with ScotRail senior management, Transport Scotland and ultimately the Scottish government.

 

[JamesT]

The ballot was not sent out until the first week in August, so had nothing to do with drivers deciding to enjoy their contracted time off.

As mentioned elsewhere in this thread, the blame for the timetable chaos lies squarely with ScotRail senior management, Transport Scotland and ultimately the Scottish government.

ASLEF rejected the pay offer and announced they would be balloting for strike action at the start of July.

 

[norbitonflyer]

Scottish government under fire as it brings back peak rail fares

Decision to end year-long pilot scheme for financial reasons condemned by trade unions and opposition parties

www.theguardian.com

News today that peak rates are tio be re-introduced in Scotland because during the "off peak all day" scheme passengers only increased by 6.8% when 10% was needed for it to be revenue neutral. No account taken of how much usage has been depressed by the recent industrial action though

 

[380101]

ASLEF rejected the pay offer and announced they would be balloting for strike action at the start of July.

Pay offer rejected on the 5th July and an intention to seek a ballot was announced. However, no such ballot commenced until the 5th August. Plenty of cancellations before the 5th of July, especially in the East and all blamed on drivers.

 

[chuff chuff]

Pay offer rejected on the 5th July and an intention to seek a ballot was announced. However, no such ballot commenced until the 5th August. Plenty of cancellations before the 5th of July, especially in the East and all blamed on drivers.

Indeed "quality " time happened well before call for a ballot.

 

[Aaron_TTL]

Scottish government under fire as it brings back peak rail fares

Decision to end year-long pilot scheme for financial reasons condemned by trade unions and opposition parties

www.theguardian.com

News today that peak rates are tio be re-introduced in Scotland because during the "off peak all day" scheme passengers only increased by 6.8% when 10% was needed for it to be revenue neutral. No account taken of how much usage has been depressed by the recent industrial action though

Fairly unfair 'trial' considering the circumstances...

 

[Sealink]

The last train from Inverness to Wick today has been cancelled, with ScotRail currently unable to source alternative transport.

 

[Dfatcontroller]

The last train from Inverness to Wick today has been cancelled, with ScotRail currently unable to source alternative transport.

16-seater minibus is all that can be sourced.
Ticket acceptance on the X99.