ScotRail 158 refurbishment underway

[Altnabreac]

158 refurbishment programme announced.

First train is launched today at Springburn and is to be used on Borders Rail from next week.

As it says this is the first of 40 trains it looks like both the ex Haymarket and ex Inverness units will be done to the same standard, although presumably the ex Haymarket ones will be done first as they are in worse condition.

Not sure whether the 8 units to be released in 2018 will come from the Haymarket or Inverness pool?

ScotRail unveils first of 40 new-look trains

ScotRail today unveiled the first of 40 new-look trains as part of a £14million modernisation project.

The new trains will deliver improved seating, better lighting, accessibility enhancements and at-seat power sockets for customers.

The two-carriage Class 158 trains will be painted in ScotRail’s 'Saltire' livery and receive revamped interiors including modern carpets, finishes and toilets.

The 137-seat trains will also be fitted with new CCTV systems and automated passenger-counting systems.

The fleet is being upgraded with Scotland’s scenic railways in mind, with seats aligned alongside windows to offer panoramic views on the country’s most picturesque routes.

The refurbishment project is being funded by ScotRail, and jointly managed by Porterbrook. The work being carried out at the Knorr-Bremse RailServices’ Springburn facility in Glasgow – with 14 extra new staff already recruited specifically for this project.

The first carriage will leave the depot tomorrow (2/9) and will be on the track ready for the opening day of the new Borders Railway.

http://www.transportscotland.gov.uk/news/scotrail-unveils-first-40-new-look-trains

 

[jopsuk]

Presumably photos will follow soon

 

[Altnabreac]

Not sure whether the 8 units to be released in 2018 will come from the Haymarket or Inverness pool?

On checking the Franchise Agreement it's explicit that it is the 8 Angel trains 158s (158782/786/789/867-871) from the Haymarket pool that will be released in 2018 and thus not included in this refurb programme.

Think they were in Springburn relatively recently (2011 or so) and so may be in less decrepit condition than some of the others.

 

[trei2k]

There is a single picture on the hearld's website:

http://www.heraldscotland.com/news/...aldScotland+(Scottish+News+|+Herald+Scotland)

Hopefully more will follow soon!

 

[Blindtraveler]

On checking the Franchise Agreement it's explicit that it is the 8 Angel trains 158s (158782/786/789/867-871) from the Haymarket pool that will be released in 2018 and thus not included in this refurb programme.

Think they were in Springburn relatively recently (2011 or so) and so may be in less decrepit condition than some of the others.

I'll miss these ones when they go, some of the seating is super cumfy and easily the best Haymarket have to offer 158 wise!
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The Inverness pool woant I assume have much done other than realignment of seats, WiFi and plugs and maybe any doable improvements to the loos? DDA stuff to I guess?

 

[Altnabreac]

I'll miss these ones when they go, some of the seating is super cumfy and easily the best Haymarket have to offer 158 wise!

They're not going until 2018 so hopefully by the time they leave most of the rest of the fleet will be upgraded and in service.

The Inverness pool woant I assume have much done other than realignment of seats, WiFi and plugs and maybe any doable improvements to the loos? DDA stuff to I guess?

I think possibly replacing the CCTV too and the automatic passenger counting equipment will be new as I don't think any Scotrail trains have that at present.

 

[47271]

I'll miss these ones when they go, some of the seating is super cumfy and easily the best Haymarket have to offer 158 wise!
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---
The Inverness pool woant I assume have much done other than realignment of seats, WiFi and plugs and maybe any doable improvements to the loos? DDA stuff to I guess?

Are they the ones that were inherited from other TOCs ten or so years ago, I'm sure there are one or two with a far superior SWT type of seat in them, although I haven't had the pleasure of one of those for quite a few years? And another sort with grab handles at the tops of the seat backs? Sorry, I'm not that technical.

Unfortunately only the lifelong Scotrail bum crunchers seem to turn up when I'm travelling!

 

[158722]

There is a single picture on the hearld's website:

http://www.heraldscotland.com/news/...aldScotland+(Scottish+News+|+Herald+Scotland)

Hopefully more will follow soon!

158701 apparently...

 

[fgwrich]

158701 apparently...

Oh. So disappointingly a refurbishment of the already refurbished ex FSR Inverness Set then rather than the long awaited ex NEX ScR 'Haymarket' 158s.

 

[Blindtraveler]

The sinic in me says that this was done deliberately as it would be much quicker, given these sets are far nearer to the standard expected than the Haymarket sets which will need a serious stripping out rather than a few cosmetic tweeks.

 

[sprinterguy]

Are they the ones that were inherited from other TOCs ten or so years ago, I'm sure there are one or two with a far superior SWT type of seat in them, although I haven't had the pleasure of one of those for quite a few years? And another sort with grab handles at the tops of the seat backs? Sorry, I'm not that technical.

Yes, that's correct: A couple of formerly South West Trains, and further ex-Wessex Trains sets.

 

[sheeldz]

Some photos of the refurbishment on the Evening Times site.

http://www.eveningtimes.co.uk/news/...rains_as_part_of___14m_modernisation_project/

 

[158722]

The sinic in me says that this was done deliberately as it would be much quicker, given these sets are far nearer to the standard expected than the Haymarket sets which will need a serious stripping out rather than a few cosmetic tweeks.

I thought exactly the same...!

 

[Bletchleyite]

Does look good though. I already liked the Inverness interior, but the blue is much nicer than the garish purply pink.

 

[fgwrich]

Yes, that's correct: A couple of formerly South West Trains, and further ex-Wessex Trains sets.

Although somewhat bizarrely, the ex Wessex Trains sets and I gather the ex SWT pair have now been reseated - with ex Arriva Trains Wales Chapman seats still complete with ATW Moquette. A very strange choice for ScotRail!

And hardly improving the already scruffy ex Wessex Trains interiors either!

 

[158722]

Oh. So disappointingly a refurbishment of the already refurbished ex FSR Inverness Set then rather than the long awaited ex NEX ScR 'Haymarket' 158s.

Those Angel owned 8 (782/786/789/867-871) are not included in this project as they are off lease in 2018. The 15 long-term Haymarket inmates of 726-736/738-741 are however, but as others have said, the Inverness batch look like the quicker way to get some 'scenic' sets in traffic asap, hence they look to be getting done first.

 

[Altnabreac]

Although somewhat bizarrely, the ex Wessex Trains sets and I gather the ex SWT pair have now been reseated - with ex Arriva Trains Wales Chapman seats still complete with ATW Moquette. A very strange choice for ScotRail!

And hardly improving the already scruffy ex Wessex Trains interiors either!

As they're only staying in Scotland for 2-3 more years they won't want to invest too much in those 8 units.

 

[47271]

The sinic in me says that this was done deliberately as it would be much quicker, given these sets are far nearer to the standard expected than the Haymarket sets which will need a serious stripping out rather than a few cosmetic tweeks.

Oh dear, and indeed on closer inspection the photos in the news stories reveal the same seat frames as used in the existing Inverness sets. So actually the only significant change here from the passenger point of view is the power sockets, and that's not to dismiss the original refurb of these sets, it just isn't quite what we thought this morning. This initial unit's going to be busy keeping up appearances on both the Borders and north lines all at the same time.

It looks like the old bum crunchers are going to be around for a while yet.

 

[Bletchleyite]

Oh dear, and indeed on closer inspection the photos in the news stories reveal the same seat frames as used in the existing Inverness sets.

Which is expected, as the scenic sets were always shown as having that type of seat. They do seem to have gone for more airline seating than the all-table layout originally planned, though the layout looks similar to the original 158 layout so that is probably good - a bit more legroom than all-tables and some people (e.g. me) quite like well-spaced airline seating.

 

[Blindtraveler]

I dont know if the split between Airline and Non Airline was was actually in the franchise spec but the power sockets will be nice. Anyone any idea if 2020 compliance work was done at the same time?
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

That's not to dismiss the original refurb of these sets. This initial unit's going to be busy keeping up appearances on both the Borders and north lines all at the same time.

It looks like the old bum crunchers are going to be around for a while yet.

Indeed it does. Again the sinic in me says that once the media have all gone home this already high qualitty recently refurbished train with its more recent improvements will quietly trundle back up north again.

 

[47802]

There is a single picture on the hearld's website:

http://www.heraldscotland.com/news/...aldScotland+(Scottish+News+|+Herald+Scotland)

Hopefully more will follow soon!

Comments underneath that article describe the 158's as the sweatbox model and prefer 170's, better not tell Transport for Scotland that given they don't seem to like them.

 

[Altnabreac]

Comments underneath that article describe the 158's as the sweatbox model and prefer 170's

I know the borders route is being marketed as a scenic railway but isn't it really meant to be a commuter route and transport link to the Borders perhaps 170's might have been more appropriate and for some other routes for that matter.

I think the scenic 158s will be a good compromise between commuter stock and tourist potential in the Borders.

For me 170s aren't fantastic on longer journeys with lots of stops in Winter because the 1/3 door locations means cold air blasting in every time you stop.

A refurbished 158 will be a better product for a 60 minute journey from Tweedbank.

Also they are obviously phasing out 170s over the course of the franchise. While the current plan sees 21 remaining on lease until 2025 I'd be very surprised if they last much longer than that (or indeed quite that long) in Scotland as the additional CP6 electrification plans are likely to see more 170s and 156s cascaded down south in the period 2020-24.

The current Scotrail stock leasing plan is based only on electrification up to and including Shotts line in 2019, which is all that is currently formally committed.

2019 - 2024 is likely to see Maryhill, East Kilbride, Barrhead, Kilmarnock, Fife Circle and Dundee electrified. That means a large chunk of the 156 fleet and all the 170 fleet would become surplus to requirements before the end of the franchise.

All that means that the 158 fleet is the diesel Scotrail stock that has a long term future in Scotland and is thus getting the most long term investment in its ambience.

 

[Bletchleyite]

I dont know if the split between Airline and Non Airline was was actually in the franchise spec

I don't know about the franchise agreement itself as I haven't read it, but there certainly was a diagram being bandied about that showed a layout with 100% tables. However I'm not complaining per-se, as that layout wastes a lot of space between seat backs and as such gives reduced legroom over a mixed layout with the same number of seats.

 

[47802]

I think the scenic 158s will be a good compromise between commuter stock and tourist potential in the Borders.

For me 170s aren't fantastic on longer journeys with lots of stops in Winter because the 1/3 door locations means cold air blasting in every time you stop.

A refurbished 158 will be a better product for a 60 minute journey from Tweedbank.

Also they are obviously phasing out 170s over the course of the franchise. While the current plan sees 21 remaining on lease until 2025 I'd be very surprised if they last much longer than that (or indeed quite that long) in Scotland as the additional CP6 electrification plans are likely to see more 170s and 156s cascaded down south in the period 2020-24.

The current Scotrail stock leasing plan is based only on electrification up to and including Shotts line in 2019, which is all that is currently formally committed.

2019 - 2024 is likely to see Maryhill, East Kilbride, Barrhead, Kilmarnock, Fife Circle and Dundee electrified. That means a large chunk of the 156 fleet and all the 170 fleet would become surplus to requirements before the end of the franchise.

All that means that the 158 fleet is the diesel Scotrail stock that has a long term future in Scotland and is thus getting the most long term investment in its ambience.

And by 2025 Scotrail will a very ancient Diesel fleet 35 year old Sprinters and 45 to 50 year old HST's

 

[Altnabreac]

I don't know about the franchise agreement itself as I haven't read it, but there certainly was a diagram being bandied about that showed a layout with 100% tables. However I'm not complaining per-se, as that layout wastes a lot of space between seat backs and as such gives reduced legroom over a mixed layout with the same number of seats.

The Franchise Agreement specifies "Premium comfort seating", "maximum legroom", "maximum passenger comfort", and "alignment with windows" as being the output requirements while not specifying the exact number of fixed tables vs airline seats.

The Agreement also specifies that the designs have to be signed off in advance by Transport Scotland once Abellio's deisgners have consulted user groups and trade unions so presumably they decided a few airline seats was what passengers wanted and/or helped the remaining seats align better to the windows.
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And by 2025 Scotrail will a very ancient Diesel fleet 35 year old Sprinters and 45 to 50 year old HST's

Indeed, I suspect a key element of the post 2025 Scotrail franchise will be procuring a new "self powered" (diesel?) scenic train for the next 30 year period for those lines that are never going to be electrified (Far North, Kyle, West Highland, Stranraer).

The HSTs are a trickier question as there is going to be a difficult balancing act between the earliest possible electrification timescales for reaching Aberdeen / Inverness and the HSTs reaching the end of any further possible life extension works.

Hitrans recently commissioned an interesting piece of work on this very subject:
http://www.hitrans.org.uk/documents/InverSparkie_-_InverCity_Rail_Study_Update.pdf

I think the proposed timescales of Inverness electrification in that document are over optimistic at 2027, Aberdeen might be getting done at that point but Highland Mainline is not going to happen for a few years after that.

Looks likely that the next Franchise will face choices between ekeing the HSTs out until 2030-35 or perhaps acquiring some bi mode IEPs to operate Perth - Inverness and Aberdeen - Inverness for a few years.

 

[Blindtraveler]

Comments underneath that article describe the 158's as the sweatbox model and prefer 170's, better not tell Transport for Scotland that given they don't seem to like them.

Sensible TS, I agree with them but fear letting so many of these crapulous but useful (for short commuter work) will cause problems

I think the scenic
158s will be a good compromise between commuter stock and tourist potential in the Borders.

For me 170s aren't fantastic on longer journeys with lots of stops because the 1/3 door locations means cold air blasting in every time you stop.


Also they are obviously phasing out 170s over the course of the franchise. While the current plan sees 21 remaining on lease until 2025 I'd be very surprised if they last much longer than that (or indeed quite that long) in Scotland.

All that means that the 158 fleet is the diesel Scotrail stock that has a long term future in Scotland and is thus getting the most long term investment in its ambience.

If this is indeed the case then I hope they will fix the aircon better than at present or all these tourists will leave us swetty and a bit brassed off, leaving the stratogy in a sticky heap on the floor. Borders should, if the commuter numbers are as expected be using refurbished and reformed 170s, hate them as I and TS do. I fear also that replacing 170s with sprinters on other routes woant allow enough capacity from the off and will become a serious issue if groath remains as is or accelerates.

 

[alexf380]

Anyone happen to know if the second unit has gone for refurb, and if so, what one it is?

Thanks,
Alex

 

[SC318250]

Anyone happen to know if the second unit has gone for refurb, and if so, what one it is?

Thanks,
Alex

Next one due in October, 711 and 713 are the next 2 units to go in. Not sure in what order

 

[alexf380]

Thanks! If 711 and 713 are up next, is it reasonable to assume they'll be done in broadly the same order as the last Inverness refurbishment? In that case it would be 158711. I'll keep an eye out for any more news though!

 

[47271]

I know it won't happen going by this thread, but for the sake of everyone's backsides Dear God some sort of priority given to the worst of the Haymarket collapsed seat brigade please.