School party, right date, wrong barcode (Avanti)

[Howardh]

https://twitter.com/matthew_drama/status/1727259102412415406

Morning,
@AvantiWestCoast
! I'm a teacher with a school group, all ready and excited to get to London from Manchester this morning. We've turned up at the station...and the QR code you've sent for our journey is incorrect. It's for travel *yesterday*. 1/4
The concourse staff have been really helpful but there isn't anything they can do. The ticket office staff have been the opposite of helpful. When I explained the situation, the man shrugged and said "you'll have to buy new tickets." So, we're stuck. 2/4
I was then told to ring your Group Booking number. A colleague and I both did this. The phone rang and rang for over 15 minutes with no answer. Just to be totally clear: this is *your* mistake. The booking confirmation and invoice give today's date. The ticket isn't. 3/4
With a packed schedule in London and now delayed, through no fault of our own, what's the best course of action to take please?

Avanti reply;

Hi Matthew. Oh no! I'm sorry to hear this. Are you able to pop over your booking reference please? - Kim

If the teacher is correct, and they have an incorrect code through no fault of their own, why can't the ticket office correct that, or the guard simply let them on?? For goodness sakes, to have to revert to twitter when you can't even get through on the phone or be dealt with at the station is just crazy.

 

[30907]

If the teacher is correct, and they have an incorrect code through no fault of their own, why can't the ticket office correct that, or the guard simply let them on?

Poor all round. But their reservations wouldn't be there, which would be an issue if I were the teacher.

BTW I am surprised that Avanti send out barcodes with no accompanying documentation. Is this normal?

 

[357]

BTW I am surprised that Avanti send out barcodes with no accompanying documentation. Is this normal?

Reading the Twitter thread it looks like the accompanying documentation has the correct date

 

[Howardh]

Poor all round. But their reservations wouldn't be there, which would be an issue if I were the teacher.

BTW I am surprised that Avanti send out barcodes with no accompanying documentation. Is this normal?

If it's Avanti's mistake, on the first possible service I would try to put them together in an unreserved carriage even if that meant asking those already sat there to move (maybe upgrade them to standard + as a carrot) or put the school party in standard +. Suppose it depends on how many pupils there are.

 

[OscarH]

But their reservations wouldn't be there, which would be an issue if I were the teacher.

I'm not so sure that's guaranteed - if the confirmation email is correct then who knows if the bug is in the barcode generation, or affects the whole fulfilment process

 

[DarloRich]

If it isn't user error just stick them in standard plus on the next train and use the journey time to sort out any issues to make sure the return journey is smooth. Cant be that hard surely? It is a train ticket issue not the Apollo programme!

Why risk the bad PR: it was pretty fruity after that Preston incident where the schools party were messed about by short notice service failures and ended up eating chips in the street at midnight while the teachers sorted out a coach home!

 

[Howardh]

If it isn't user error just stick them in standard plus on the next train and use the journey time to sort out any issues to make sure the return journey is smooth. Cant be that hard surely? It is a train ticket issue not the Apollo programme!

Why risk the bad PR: it was pretty fruity after that Preston incident where the schools party were messed about by short notice service failures and ended up eating chips in the street at midnight while the teachers sorted out a coach home!

Think it's a case of no-one willing to make a decision, maybe because if they make the "wrong" call they will be faced with trouble from above? I agree, the company via ticket office/staff/guards should have put them in standard+ and then they are on their way and at Euston could go to the office and exchange for the correct codes. That's if, at Euston, someone is willing to do that for them!

 

[Lampshade]

Truly pathetic company.

 

[357]

Further update:

It was complete chaos, with us being advised to try all the things we had already tried. We got on our way but the journey itself was tricky, as we kept being challenged for our seats/tickets.

https://twitter.com/matthew_drama/status/1727315166851895439?t=zM78QjcDr4D1q1Bzlf3HCQ&s=19

 

[yorkie]

I'm not so sure that's guaranteed - if the confirmation email is correct then who knows if the bug is in the barcode generation, or affects the whole fulfilment process

Exactly; without knowing more information it is difficult to say where the error lies. But it is Avanti's problem.

Sadly, booking office staff are not always helpful; in this case Avanti's
booking office staff incorrectly told a school group to "buy new tickets"; their tickets were contractually valid and any barcode error is not the customers' problem.

Indeed I've tweeted this from the forum's account.

https://twitter.com/RailUKForums/status/1727403533849260205

I have very rarely had reason to use a booking office operated by Avanti or their predessors, Virgin, however on those rare occasions over the years I've had several extremely poor experiences, so this latest experience is, sadly, in line with my expectations of booking office staff at this company.

 

[Miken]

For my own understanding here - is a group ticket like this only issued with a barcode?

As all of my single user tickets have every detail printed on them and often (particularly on Avanti) the barcode is never read but the printed ticket details are taken as sufficient to validate my journey.

Also if challenged I'd be able to produce a pdf of the ticket, the booking email confirmation and the diary entry sent with the booking.

I'm also at a loss why Avanti staff treat a school party as if they were dodging the fare? What a horrible situation to find oneself in whilst supervising a group of school children.

 

[yorkie]

As all of my single user tickets have every detail printed on them and often (particularly on Avanti) the barcode is never read but the printed ticket details are taken as sufficient to validate my journey.

I don't know how these group tickets work but even if the ticket itself, with the barcode, has the details on it, these details may differ from what the booking confirmation says.

Without seeing exactly what has been written/encoded/displayed, it is difficult to say.

I'm also at a loss why Avanti staff treat a school party as if they were dodging the fare? What a horrible situation to find oneself in whilst supervising a group of school children.

Some staff who are responsible for checking/issuing tickets take the view that any mistake (on the part of any party, including a train company!) should be rectified by the purchase of a new ticket and sorting out a refund for the original tickets later.

Sadly there are insufficient safeguards within the industry to prevent such attitudes prevailing among a (vocal and noticeable) minority of staff.

It can be difficult to argue with staff sometimes; obviously ticket office staff can generally be ignored without concequences but at gatelines it can mean being denied access to the train.

To be fair most staff are pragmatic (especially on board staff in my experience; they tend to be far better than many gateline or ticket office based staff, on average) but the minority who aren't are far too big a minority to be acceptable and their actions have disproportionate concequences.

I can't see the rail industry changing its ways any time soon.

 

[Elecman]

The bigger problem will be the Euston gate line staff on the way back!!

 

[Parham Wood]

I would expect the school to be making a complaint and asking for compensation of some sort.

 

[Howardh]

I would expect the school to be making a complaint and asking for compensation of some sort.

I suppose it depends on what they missed, maybe the start of a show or something. Have a feeling this will end up in their local press at least, be interesting to read Avanti's account/ excuse.

 

[david1212]

Think it's a case of no-one willing to make a decision, maybe because if they make the "wrong" call they will be faced with trouble from above? I agree, the company via ticket office/staff/guards should have put them in standard+ and then they are on their way and at Euston could go to the office and exchange for the correct codes. That's if, at Euston, someone is willing to do that for them!

Perfectly understandable however all of ticket office staff, platform staff and on train staff should have someone to contact with the responsibility and authorisation to make the decisions. Simply ' passing the buck ' by giving the ticket holder the telephone number for ' Group Bookings ' was not acceptable then it not being answered just ' pours petrol on the fire '.

To have resort to X ( Twitter ) to get a response from a large organisation is appalling. Maybe using it rather than a Journey Check page on their website is useful way of updating information during disruption even though now inaccessible without an account to log in.

 

[Mcr Warrior]

So, what was the follow up to the story?

How was the problem/issue actually resolved?

 

[yorksrob]

Too many supposedly mainstream companies rely on social media platforms run by overgrown fratboy-capitalists for their comms. They need a traditional website of their own.

 

[skyhigh]

They need a traditional website of their own.

Last I checked, they did?

 

[AndrewE]

Last I checked, they did?

Really? or is it subcontracted somewhere? And what is the level of training and experience of the staff?

In reply to Yorkie's post #10 I would say that I can't fault the Crewe travel centre staff - their knowledge and patience - whenever I have needed their help (including when I was getting all sorts of things badly wrong post-Covid in spring 2020.)