School or works or Normal Stopping

[Martin1988]

Is there anyone who would be able to shed any light on why some school bus services are registered as "School or works" services whereas others are registered as "Normal stopping"?

Is there a notable difference between the two types of registration?

 

[darloscott]

The main difference is the services registered as "school or works" do not require DDA standard vehicles to be operated on them. You are unable to claim BSOG on these runs though as far as I'm aware.

 

[Busaholic]

Presumably those registered as 'normal stopping' must take any passenger offering.

 

[Dai Corner]

Darloscott and Busaholic have summed up the situation as I understand it. I notice that Newport Transport have registered their schools services as 'normal stopping'. I might try and catch one next month to see what happens!

Are there many 'works' services left? I vaguely remember destinations in Bristol such as Hartcliffe (Wills Factory) and Patchway (Shadow Factory) in the 1970s

 

[neilmc]

Darloscott and Busaholic have summed up the situation as I understand it. I notice that Newport Transport have registered their schools services as 'normal stopping'. I might try and catch one next month to see what happens!

You might have some fun! A couple of years ago when I lived in Manchester there was a rather useful Stagecoach school service which went from Sale to Manchester late afternoon which I caught a couple of times. The driver initially refused to pick me up saying "This is a school service!" until I told him that all school services other than the special yellow buses pick up normal passengers along the route as clearly stated in the tfgm website and timetables, and both tfgm and Stagecoach would be hearing from me if he didn't let me on.

When I was a conductor in Leeds we had a school service which followed the 44 service route between Chapeltown and York Road, and on one occasion an inspector flagged us down at Chapeltown and loaded a couple of dozen passengers when the 44 was missing or running late. This was perfectly proper, as any platform staff in those days would be expected to know.

 

[Bookd]

A thought from ancient history (well 50+ years ago!)
In the North east United had a range of works services to ICI works and other places. At the time fare tables were treated as being under the official secrets act, but when I acquired an old copy many years later I was surprised to find that these were mostly licensed as stage carriage, with fare tables covering the whole route.
You could, therefore, have flagged one down to go two stops down the road (2 adults + 4 child fares? ) and as this was on their license they would have to take you.
As the journeys were not in the public timetable, and usually showed the appropriate works as a destination, any such passengers would not have been popular with the conductor or the regular travellers.

 

[Bookd]

A thought from ancient history (well 50+ years ago!)
In the North east United had a range of works services to ICI works and other places. At the time fare tables were treated as being under the official secrets act, but when I acquired an old copy many years later I was surprised to find that these were mostly licensed as stage carriage, with fare tables covering the whole route.
You could, therefore, have flagged one down to go two stops down the road (2 adults + 4 child fares? ) and as this was on their license they would have to take you.
As the journeys were not in the public timetable, and usually showed the appropriate works as a destination, any such passengers would not have been popular with the conductor or the regular travellers.

 

[Harbouring]

There is a service that runs between Portsmouth and a farm estate in West Sussex, one trip each way every day. It travels round the city before it departs for the farm via the A27. It is not advertised anywhere but you can catch it I guess as it runs a route, it's non stop after it leaves the city though so the Crux of works buses is that they are not much use for the average customer.

I have occasionally travelled on buses which once a day divert via a school but are
Not school buses but full of children anyway, felt a bit conspicuous and there is a an awful noise so I try to avoid them where possible. There are a number of schools locally which seem to run school buses but invariably these are provided as coaches and would not be confused with a service bus.

 

[Andyh82]

Darloscott and Busaholic have summed up the situation as I understand it. I notice that Newport Transport have registered their schools services as 'normal stopping'. I might try and catch one next month to see what happens!

I imagine when you put your arm out it will go flying straight past

In the North East all the school buses generally say "Scholars - All Welcome" (Like this https://www.flickr.com/photos/gpr_bus_photos/29093509494/in/photolist-LjTQLE-LVHwCc-KoDknb-LXT3NC-LUuDpG-LdPTuw-KG9Suu-KZPUMy-KwHfGq-K9sq9Y-Jcy47t-JQkiyj-JLVzfn-NpUkH9-J58ER7-K7L1fJ-Jfn2Ks-Jfn58d-HYjEtf-JoQ7zG-HasYuU-J7FcEK-HsKcib-HMVxHX-GPXRo1-JwjssP-HXBvYc-GeKeJx-H1JUDC-GexsSm-GeERYB-H73jdm-H3VeF2-GeqemC-GezKmZ-H6P8D1-H1qHiY-H6Lje5-H6JRKq-H9ECsn-GJhWXG-Jz8DzT-FYpDUN-HiWhj1-Hy1Buv-Ji6NjN-qXAPYN-H9ZN1Y-FhV8th-Gdn7TR) as the standard blind display, but I doubt anyone other the kids actually travel.

 

[Dai Corner]

There's ones turns into a "school" (but actually 'normal stopping') service en route. It would be interesting to see if I got turfed off. 29B / SJ12

http://www.newportbus.co.uk/_literature_145199/SJ1-SJ12_ST_JOSEPHS_RC_SCHOOL_(from_Sept_2017)

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

A thought from ancient history (well 50+ years ago!)
In the North east United had a range of works services to ICI works and other places. At the time fare tables were treated as being under the official secrets act, but when I acquired an old copy many years later I was surprised to find that these were mostly licensed as stage carriage, with fare tables covering the whole route.
You could, therefore, have flagged one down to go two stops down the road (2 adults + 4 child fares? ) and as this was on their license they would have to take you.
As the journeys were not in the public timetable, and usually showed the appropriate works as a destination, any such passengers would not have been popular with the conductor or the regular travellers.

They certainly appeared in the timetables in later years. I can't remember the pre 1980s but think there was a CCC leaflet in the mid 1980s and then they appeared in United/Tees leaflets in 9** series.

There were a number of works services that United also ran in North Yorkshire and County Durham. Some definitely appeared in timetables such as the 58 (Durham to Aycliffe Ind Est) but I think they were not dedicated to one factory/employer. There were also variations to the Darlington to Richmond via Catterick Garrison services (25A) that also were just to serve the various major defence sites (e.g. RAOC HQ). However, there were others that didn't such as serving RAMAR clothing factories at Crook and Catterick Bridge - I guess they were dedicated contracts.

 

[Ianno87]

Presumably those registered as 'normal stopping' must take any passenger offering.

I used to travel on a "school service" in Greater Manchester, where all services at the time were registered as normal stopping services. Over the years we did have a couple of regular non-schoolkids turn up occasionally for a period of time, for whom the bus so happened to be perfectly timed and routed for their journey to work (the bus ran round the ring road in Bolton, whereas most 'normal' bus routes only run in and out of the town centre).

Usually for morning journeys. By the afternoon we far far too hyper and loud for anyone else to contemplate joining for the 'fun'.

School services however did not accept any System One multi-operator tickets. Not that it bothered me as I had a free pass.

 

[Mwanesh]

In Hampshire when i worked there we had a school service that was registered as normal stopping but did not take concessionary passes.All the kids had annual passes.If you tried using it the fare was too high to deter local people .They had an 8minute on the route.

 

[Observer]

The number of "normal stopping" school services will end up being reduced by 2020 due to DDA regulations fully coming into force for coaches. Many will become closed contracts, and if they are contracted services then perhaps the councils will have no choice but to pay more to the companies to cover for losing BSOG and the rest of the rewards that came with having them as normal stopping services.

Some operators have got around the need for low floor buses by certifying them as coaches by removing the standing requirement, but it won't last much longer. Obviously it's easy to get a hold of DDA deckers (even if a majority of them are clapped out ex-London stock) but some operators prefer using coaches as they can put them out to work all day, whilst a double decker will end up in the yard outside of schools unless there's other work available for it like a local service in between the schools.