Saver Half

[Sleeper]

I’d be grateful for a bit of advice – to do with a Saver Half I believe.

I’m planning to go from Kings Cross to Doncaster on Monday 23rd October, First Class advanced, probably on the 09:35.

But I want to be flexible coming back on Thursday 26th, travelling Standard Class. (In fact, if my business schedule permits I’m hoping to come back on the 14:27 from Doncaster to Lincoln, the 16:00 to Peterborough, thence to Kings Cross by about 18:30 by whatever comes along. This is a permitted route by the way – map EE.

I understood that for the return I would be able to get a “Saver Half” if I booked on the Virgin website at the same time as my outward advance ticket, at a price (for me as a Senior Railcard holder) of £29.70 – source BRfares.com, which lists two products at that price, SSU and SSH.

But the best-price flexible ticket Virgin booking site offers me with my first class advanced is a Super Off-Peak Single at £44.50 – which price I can only see listed for a Child fare!! (I have checked I'm not booking as a child with senioir railcard!)

Have I misunderstood what is available? If not, how can I get this Saver Half product at the price listed by BRfares?

 

[Elecman]

I though Saver halfs are only available when you book the journey as a return. They aren't available as an option to another single

 

[philjo]

I haven't seen these offered on the new VTEC website. I have been trying to book one just now and failed to get any offered for the return leg when the outward leg is an 1st advance. (Stevenage to Leeds). Raileasy site is offering them.

 

[yorkie]

I’d be grateful for a bit of advice – to do with a Saver Half I believe.

Saver Half (SVH) was the old name for a ticket that was not available singly, and was effectively half of a Saver Return.

At "simplification" it became known as an Off Peak Single (SVH); not to be confused with the full-priced Off Peak Single (SVS).

These were on certain flows priced by Virgin Trains and only available on the Virgin Trains website.

I’m planning to go from Kings Cross to Doncaster on Monday 23rd October, First Class advanced, probably on the 09:35.

But I want to be flexible coming back on Thursday 26th, travelling Standard Class. (In fact, if my business schedule permits I’m hoping to come back on the 14:27 from Doncaster to Lincoln, the 16:00 to Peterborough, thence to Kings Cross by about 18:30 by whatever comes along. This is a permitted route by the way – map EE.

I understood that for the return I would be able to get a “Saver Half” if I booked on the Virgin website at the same time as my outward advance ticket, at a price (for me as a Senior Railcard holder) of £29.70 – source BRfares.com, which lists two products at that price, SSU and SSH.

But the best-price flexible ticket Virgin booking site offers me with my first class advanced is a Super Off-Peak Single at £44.50 – which price I can only see listed for a Child fare!! (I have checked I'm not booking as a child with senioir railcard!)

Have I misunderstood what is available? If not, how can I get this Saver Half product at the price listed by BRfares?

The fare you want is a Super Off Peak Single at half the price of the Super Off Peak Return at a special price only through the Virgin Trains East Coast website. These used to be available singly, but then weren't, and now are again available singly.

The website is offering them for this date; don't try to get an itinerary via Lincoln as that won't work. Simply travel that way on the day.

 

[yorkie]

I though Saver halfs are only available when you book the journey as a return. They aren't available as an option to another single

That's correct for Virgin Trains priced SVH fares (formerly known as Saver Half, now known as Off Peak Single) but the fare in question is actually a Super Off Peak Single fare priced by a different train company.

 

[yorkie]

I haven't seen these offered on the new VTEC website. I have been trying to book one just now and failed to get any offered for the return leg when the outward leg is an 1st advance. (Stevenage to Leeds). Raileasy site is offering them.

Yes Raileasy and Trainsplit offer them.

The VTEC site is riddled with many bugs, but is offering them for Doncaster to London on 26 October for me: https://imgur.com/a/eT02a

 

[Sleeper]

Thanks all for such prompt answers. I have successfully booked with Raileasy, paying £29.70 with Senior Railcard discount - as I originally hoped.

Yorkie, your illustration shows the same £44.50 ticket I was getting. The only Doncaster to London fare listed on BRfares at that price is the SSS Child fare.



Anyway, thanks to the forum, I have what I wanted (albeit for a booking fee). Query closed.

BTW, congratulations on the site upgrade.

 

[Starmill]

That's because the fare being offered @ £44.50 isn't a half price Super Off-Peak Single (SSH/SSU) - it's a full price Super Off-Peak Single (SSS) with a 50% online discount.

The fare you would have been offered by the old website, if you were buying an Advance the other way, would have been £45. The £45 ticket is available by itself for purchase from very limited retail outlets, like Avantix.

I understand that this discount is a short-term fudge, and it means that the requirement to buy a ticket in the other direction at the same time has been temporarily relaxed.

It also means that if someone wants one of these tickets for a journey where they can't take a Virgin Trains East Coast train all the way (e.g. Leeds to Brighton or London to Knaresborough) they cannot get the half price single.

It is a very poor fudge though because if the traveller has a railcard, the Virgin Trains East Coast website does not apply the 50% discount after taking the railcard fare, it replaces the railcard.

 

[yorkie]

.. and it means that the requirement to buy a ticket in the other direction at the same time has been temporarily relaxed....

Or maybe we are back to the original rule which was simply that it had to be bought online (by 2359 the day before) and there was no requirement to buy a ticket in the other direction? Maybe that's wishful thinking but I'd hope so.

 

[jsmith300]

nearly 5 months later the railcard discount has still to be fixed.

 

[yorkie]

nearly 5 months later the railcard discount has still to be fixed.

This isn't surprising. The move to the new website has been a complete farce.

I don't know who is to blame; is it VTEC, Vix Technology (who made the website), or Silverrail (who supply IPTIS)? Anyone know?

 

[alistairlees]

This isn't surprising. The move to the new website has been a complete farce.

I don't know who is to blame; is it VTEC, Vix Technology (who made the website), or Silverrail (who supply IPTIS)? Anyone know?

There are really two problems here:

1. the fares data structure does not support the 'correct' retailing of SVH (or SSH, or SSU) products; or, for that matter, the 'correct' retailing of child flat fare products (mostly TKR, TKS and TKT products, but now additionally including CFF and CFS, and probably more)
2. the additional work to implement these products in the TIS (i.e. to overcome the inadequacies of the fares data structure) has not been done (or not been done correctly)

Point no 1 is really a TOC / RDG thing: no pricing manager should be creating products that can't be supported by the fares data structure. Either the fares data structure should be amended, or the products should not be created. For the record, the issue is that there is nothing in the fares data structure to force one product to only be retailed together with another (different) product. Products are essentially independent - hence the issue.

Point no 2 is Vix's fault - they should be quite capable of resolving this (i.e. creating a set of rules embedded in their TIS to overcome the inadequacies of the fares data structure, and this retail the product correctly.)

As a general principle I don't think TOCs should expect or be able to create any product with new product rules not supported by the fares feed data structure, and just expect this to be supported by TIS - there is cost to implementing and supporting these things and it is, in any case, a poor way to manage data and architecture.

However, SVH and similar products have been around for what feels like ages now, so I think these should just be dealt with by TIS. It's not that hard, and other TIS all manage to do it properly. Just not VTEC's own!

 

[sheff1]

This isn't surprising. The move to the new website has been a complete farce.
I don't know who is to blame; is it VTEC, Vix Technology (who made the website), or Silverrail (who supply IPTIS)? Anyone know?

I assume VTEC commissioned the new website. If so, it is they who are to blame as, either it meets the standard they specified or, if it does not, it should not have been allowed to go live. If the 'faults' were not discovered until after go live then reversion to the previous version until they were fixed would be the correct decision and that decision is the responsibility of the commissioners.

 

[Haywain]

I assume VTEC commissioned the new website. If so, it is they who are to blame as, either it meets the standard they specified or, if it does not, it should not have been allowed to go live. If the 'faults' were not discovered until after go live then reversion to the previous version until they were fixed would be the correct decision and that decision is the responsibility of the commissioners.

That's a bit harsh on VTEC, given that the fault lies with the booking engine rather than the website. The overall scheme was part of the bid and VTEC had insufficient input into the functionality of that, at least until it was too late!