SailRail

[mlt11]

I have a question about SailRail, the ferry portion of the journey.

I'm looking to travel Saturday 9th Sep from Crewe to Dublin, return journey 1 week later, could be a Friday, could be a Saturday.

There seems to be two types of ticket you can purchase, a 'Sailrail Advance' or a 'Sailrail Single'.

If I get a Sailrail Single, does that give me flexibility over what ferry I board? Or do I *have* to reserve the ferry portion of the journey?

I'm just curious if there is flexibility or not, as I'm not exactly sure when I will be returning...

 

[Merseysider]

On the flexible ticket you'll receive a [foot passenger] reservation coupon. Providing there's more than one sailing that day, you'll be free to swap it for another at no cost. Ticket offices should be able to do this, and of course the ferry company.

On the advance ticket it'll cost a tenner to amend, as per Advance T&C

 

[gray1404]

On the flexible ticket you'll receive a [foot passenger] reservation coupon. Providing there's more than one sailing that day, you'll be free to swap it for another at no cost. Ticket offices should be able to do this, and of course the ferry company.

On the advance ticket it'll cost a tenner to amend, as per Advance T&C

OK so on a flexible ticket you still get a coupon do you. Do you need to change it or can you just rock up at the terminal and be subject to load?

 

[danm14]

I have a question about SailRail, the ferry portion of the journey.

I'm looking to travel Saturday 9th Sep from Crewe to Dublin, return journey 1 week later, could be a Friday, could be a Saturday.

There seems to be two types of ticket you can purchase, a 'Sailrail Advance' or a 'Sailrail Single'.

If I get a Sailrail Single, does that give me flexibility over what ferry I board? Or do I *have* to reserve the ferry portion of the journey?

I'm just curious if there is flexibility or not, as I'm not exactly sure when I will be returning...

The SailRail Advance restricts you to a specific train/trains and a specific ferry.
The SailRail Single (actually called SailRail Standby) restricts you to a specific ferry but allows you to take any permitted route by train to Holyhead without breaking your journey.

>>>> As above, you can amend the sailing time <<<<

There's no discount for booking a return (you just buy two singles) so your best bet is to just book a single journey to Ireland at this point. Then, once you're aware of the date and time of your return journey, phone Stena Line on 01 907 5388 or Irish Ferries on 01 607 5700 to book it. The fares will be in Euro, but the cost should be similar give or take a pound or so.

If you do this, you'll collect your (huge, handwritten) tickets at the check-in desk at the port when you give your name, and these will be valid on the ferry, as well as on any permitted route from Holyhead to Crewe by train.

 

[gray1404]

The SailRail Advance restricts you to a specific train/trains and a specific ferry.
The SailRail Single (actually called SailRail Standby) restricts you to a specific ferry but allows you to take any permitted route by train to Holyhead without breaking your journey.

But you could change the ferry without charge right? If not, might as well go for the advance if you can book by the day before....

 

[danm14]

But you could change the ferry without charge right? If not, might as well go for the advance if you can book by the day before....

To the best of my knowledge:

With the Single/Standby you can change it for free.

With the Advance you'd have to pay £10 (if you phoned Stena/IF in advance and asked, they might let you on an earlier/later ferry for free as it makes no difference to them, they still get paid the same - this wouldn't make your ticket valid on an earlier/later train though)

 

[mlt11]

Thanks for the advice guys. Although I'm still confused!

From my research, I thought SailRail tickets could only be collected from UK stations or delivered to UK addresses?

I e-mailed both companies today, and they both say I can rock up to any ferry I want without any issue. Although their websites completely contradict that!

My intention is buy and collect the Dublin to Crewe ticket in the UK ('Single' not 'Advance') for Friday 15th September, 08:20 StenaLine. Would I have issues if...

- I had to catch a later ferry, say the 14:15 IrishFerrie?
- Had to catch a ferry the next day? (Guessing the ticket would say Friday?)

IrishFerries website says 'However, a €10.00 amendment fee applies each time a change is made to the date or time on your SailRail booking.'

StenaLine website says 'If you travel on a different train or ferry to that booked, your ticket will be invalid and a full single fare will be payable.'

VirginTrains website says 'Reservations are compulsory on the sea crossing. Failure to obtain a reservation on the ferry may result in customers not being allowed to board the ferry.'

There is also a £41 'SailRail single' and a £46 'SailRail single'! What's the difference?

They don't make this simple!

 

[gray1404]

You defiantly will not be able to travel the next day.

I shall let others advise where you stand about booking for the earlier ferry but travelling on the later one. It would be better to be booked onto the later one but then turn up for the earlier one and ask them to put you on that. Rather then miss your first booked ferry. I will let others advise who know better. I know this is confusing.

If I were you I would go for the £41 and decide which ferry you want to travel on. You can book the advance tickets up until the day before.

 

[danm14]

Thanks for the advice guys. Although I'm still confused!

From my research, I thought SailRail tickets could only be collected from UK stations or delivered to UK addresses?

I e-mailed both companies today, and they both say I can rock up to any ferry I want without any issue. Although their websites completely contradict that!

My intention is buy and collect the Dublin to Crewe ticket in the UK ('Single' not 'Advance') for Friday 15th September, 08:20 StenaLine. Would I have issues if...

- I had to catch a later ferry, say the 14:15 IrishFerrie?
- Had to catch a ferry the next day? (Guessing the ticket would say Friday?)

IrishFerries website says 'However, a €10.00 amendment fee applies each time a change is made to the date or time on your SailRail booking.'

StenaLine website says 'If you travel on a different train or ferry to that booked, your ticket will be invalid and a full single fare will be payable.'

VirginTrains website says 'Reservations are compulsory on the sea crossing. Failure to obtain a reservation on the ferry may result in customers not being allowed to board the ferry.'

There is also a £41 'SailRail single' and a £46 'SailRail single'! What's the difference?

They don't make this simple!

In practice (for vehicle passengers and regular foot passengers) there's absolutely no issue with travelling on an earlier or later ferry on the same day, even if any delay was your fault. You'd be able to transfer free of charge from one sailing to another (but not between companies, and if moving from an IF slow sailing to an IF fast sailing there would be a charge of the price difference).

I can't see why this wouldn't be applied to SailRail customers - I'd say the terms and conditions as regards an earlier/later ferry are there to cover times when the ferries are absolutely packed (such as during the ash cloud seven or eight years ago) and wouldn't be enforced in practice, but I can't guarantee anything. The ticket would definitely not be accepted without change on another train though.

In the event of a travel delay (that wasn't your fault, so a train/ferry fault is fine but deciding to go for food and taking too long isn't) causing a missed connection, however, your train ticket is automatically valid on the next train or trains to your destination without paying extra, and in that case if a change of ferry was required due to a delay you would be directed to the ticket desk at Holyhead where your ticket would be endorsed or replaced to allow you to board the next sailing at no extra cost. The company running the next sailing would more than likely be irrelevant in this case, as would the type of ferry (fast/slow), but again I can't guarantee this.

 

[mlt11]

So, I bought and collected the ticket I 100% know I'm going to make.

I got...

Your bog standard Rail ticket..

From CREWE
To DUBLINPORT STENA

Ticket Type: SAILRAIL STNDBY
Start Date: 9th Sep
Valid Until: 9th Sep

(I'm assuming this means I cannot travel on another day)

Then it says...

Route HLYHD STENA_SHP
Validity ON DATE SHOWN

I'm guessing this means I can only catch Stenna ferrys?!

I got a bog standard SEAT RESERVATION ticket for the rail leg AND a SEAT RESERVATION ticket for the ferry leg, with the time and date of the ferry journey on it. (Valid at 13:50 HOURS ON 09*SEP*17)

So I'm assuming I MUST catch this ferry. (Which I will, my concern was with the return leg).

I think I'll just book a flight for the return journey to save any hassle

 

[najaB]

(I'm assuming this means I cannot travel on another day)

Much the same as most single rail tickets.

I'm guessing this means I can only catch Stenna ferrys?!

Yes, as opposed to the Irish Ferries sailing.

So I'm assuming I MUST catch this ferry. (Which I will, my concern was with the return leg).

You *should* catch this ferry but, as pointed out up-thread, Stenaline will more than likely let you board any sailing that day.

 

[danm14]

I think I'll just book a flight for the return journey to save any hassle

You can phone Stena or Irish Ferries in Dublin (numbers were posted by me above) to book a SailRail ticket for your return journey in advance of your journey once you know exactly when you'll be returning. You can even show up at the port an hour or so before departure* and buy a SailRail ticket there and then. You'll be effectively guaranteed a space on the next ferry, they will not be full under normal circumstances.

It'll be €41 (£38) if bought the day before, or €47 (£43) if bought on the day. Add an extra €6 (£5) if you want to go on the Irish Ferries fast-ferry (I wouldn't unless you're in a big rush, it's not as pleasant as the others)

* IF departures that carry foot passengers: 08:05; 08:45 (fast); 14:30 (fast); 20:55
* Stena departures (all carry foot passengers): 02:15; 08:20; 15:10; 20:40

Note: SailRail tickets issued in Ireland are huge handwritten pieces of paper about 9x3 inches - they look nothing like a train ticket, but despite this they're completely valid on UK trains (you don't need to swap them for a "real" ticket or anything)

 

[gray1404]

I hope this answers all your questions now. I note that you have gone for the Stand By ticket rather then the Advance ticket. Therefore, if on 9 September you cannot get the 13:50 ferry then you and travel on another Stena railing that day (earlier or later). Why did you not get the Advance ticket though if you are positive you are going to go for the train that connects with the 13:50.

Are Sail Rail Advance tickets quota controlled in so much that there are limited spaces on the ferry and the trains that connect with them? Or, is simply booking the day before and then sticking to booked train/ferry required (i.e. no actual quota)?

 

[najaB]

Are Sail Rail Advance tickets quota controlled in so much that there are limited spaces on the ferry and the trains that connect with them? Or, is simply booking the day before and then sticking to booked train/ferry required (i.e. no actual quota)?

In theory they are quota controlled, but other than when there's a big event on (e.g. football) the quota will never be exhausted.

 

[gray1404]

Has anyone got a copy of one of the Irish handwirtten tickets? Be interesting to see what they look like.

 

[gray1404]

In theory they are quota controlled, but other than when there's a big event on (e.g. football) the quota will never be exhausted.

Thanks - that's useful to know. To throw another spanner into the works, I am going to take one of these journeys with a friend of mine to Dublin. I shall travel on Sail Rail ticket. He has PRIV with boxes (ex BR) so how would he go about booking it and would he need to book both outward and return in Advance. I "think" he might just need to mark a box and pay port tax on the day.

Oh and once I've booked the Sail Rail ticket do I need to then phone the ferry company to make a foot passenger reservation or will I automatically have a reservation on the ferry?

 

[Hadders]

I don't know about Priv but when you purchase the ticket you'll be issued with a reservation for the ferry - no further action needed, just turn up before check-in closes!. When I travelled I did a night crossing and wanted a berth. I called Stena and managed to book this separately as there's no facility to do this as part of the rail booking process.

 

[gray1404]

I don't know about Priv but when you purchase the ticket you'll be issued with a reservation for the ferry - no further action needed, just turn up before check-in closes!. When I travelled I did a night crossing and wanted a berth. I called Stena and managed to book this separately as there's no facility to do this as part of the rail booking process.

That's interesting as when I book Sail Rail to the Isle of Man you are also given a reservation for the ferry but this means nothing to the Steam Packet Company. You still have to phone them to make a foot passenger reservation and say you have a Sail Rail ticket. Sounds like the railway systems and those of Stena and Irish Ferries are linked (where as IOM STP are not).

 

[danm14]

Has anyone got a copy of one of the Irish handwirtten tickets? Be interesting to see what they look like.

http://www.railforums.co.uk/showthread.php?t=118032 has complete scans of one. The first scan (with the picture of the train in the corner) is a paper folder, which the coupons (second scan) are stapled into.
The third scan is a boarding pass which all Stena Line passengers get on check-in, it's not issued with the ticket.

Also, google image search "sailrail ticket" and you'll see a few other photos of them

 

[gray1404]

http://www.railforums.co.uk/showthread.php?t=118032 has complete scans of one. The first scan (with the picture of the train in the corner) is a paper folder, which the coupons (second scan) are stapled into.
The third scan is a boarding pass which all Stena Line passengers get on check-in, it's not issued with the ticket.

Also, google image search "sailrail ticket" and you'll see a few other photos of them

Interesting as they don't appear to have a date or time on them (except for date of issue). But maybe the scan was bad.

 

[najaB]

Sounds like the railway systems and those of Stena and Irish Ferries are linked (where as IOM STP are not).

I believe they are.

 

[danm14]

Interesting as they don't appear to have a date or time on them (except for date of issue). But maybe the scan was bad.

I believe they have 2 month validity from date of issue for both outward and return journey as the conditions use this as an example (see below) and I'm assuming the 60 in the top left corner refers to 60 days.

"Save indication to the contrary shown on the front side of coupons, the journey maybe effected on any date within the limits of the period of validity. The journey must be completed at the latest by a train which is shown in the timetable as arriving at the destination station not later than midnight of the last day of validity (i.e. A coupon valid 2 months from 23rd October may be used up to midnight on 22nd December)"

If you look at other scans on google images, some have 1 month validity, 30 day validity or 31 day validity written on the front, and I'm guessing this is an "indication to the contrary shown on the front side of coupons". Whereas this one has that field left blank, so I'm guessing they default to 60 days.

Break of journey is also allowed, though this isn't a huge issue as with purchase of the handwritten tickets only permitted in Ireland for journeys beginning in Ireland, there's very little scope for abuse for a low fare on journeys wholly within the UK.

 

[gray1404]

So it sounds like the handwritten tickets issued in Ireland offer more flexibility then those which are printed on standard stock in the UK - not fair.

 

[danm14]

So it sounds like the handwritten tickets issued in Ireland offer more flexibility then those which are printed on standard stock in the UK - not fair.

Also, tickets purchased at the €6 (£5) Advance discount in Ireland have no restriction to a specific train in the UK like the UK bought tickets do. You're literally just getting a €6 discount for booking early, you're no more restricted than if you'd paid full price.

 

[Hornet]

So it sounds like the handwritten tickets issued in Ireland offer more flexibility then those which are printed on standard stock in the UK - not fair.

Had plenty of the hand written versions in my time ex Dublin Port. Went to Edinburgh once. Brought the ticket on the day. Clerk checked the zone in her Station Zone doc for the price. Wrote out the ticket and was bemused when I started shaking my head. She had managed to spell Edinburgh as Edinborough, even though she had the doc still open. Doh.

 

[danm14]

Had plenty of the hand written versions in my time ex Dublin Port. Went to Edinburgh once. Brought the ticket on the day. Clerk checked the zone in her Station Zone doc for the price. Wrote out the ticket and was bemused when I started shaking my head. She had managed to spell Edinburgh as Edinborough, even though she had the doc still open. Doh.

They really should be very careful and write in clear block letters, whereas that's a clear-cut case of stupidity and nobody would ever be in doubt as to where the ticket was for, there are cases (Adwick near Leeds, Ardwick near Manchester for example) where a misspelling or letter omitted/added could completely change the validity of the ticket and very easily go unnoticed until a ticket inspection (I'm assuming the paper tickets get very closely inspected as they'd be so rare nowadays with very few SailRail passengers compared to the days when flight was unaffordable, so any mistake would get spotted)

I'm assuming in a case of a misspelling you'd be entirely within your right to refuse to accept the ticket and request it be replaced as it technically is "invalid"?

 

[mlt11]

I hope this answers all your questions now. I note that you have gone for the Stand By ticket rather then the Advance ticket. Therefore, if on 9 September you cannot get the 13:50 ferry then you and travel on another Stena railing that day (earlier or later). Why did you not get the Advance ticket though if you are positive you are going to go for the train that connects with the 13:50.

I paid the extra fiver just to see what a 'standby' looked like (what it says etc) for the possible purpose of my return journey.

Thanks one and all for the help!

 

[danm14]

Out of interest, does anyone know whether the Irish handwritten tickets have validity on the Tube where a ticket for the same journey issued in Britain would, and more importantly would this be accepted by Tube staff?

I believe I have read somewhere that Tube staff refuse to accept till-roll style tickets/those ridiculously large tickets issued on-board Arriva Trains Wales services despite them supposedly having the same validity as regular coupons - would these Irish tickets be treated the same?

 

[najaB]

Out of interest, does anyone know whether the Irish handwritten tickets have validity on the Tube where a ticket for the same journey issued in Britain would, and more importantly would this be accepted by Tube staff?

Yes and more than likely not.

 

[181]

They really should be very careful and write in clear block letters....(I'm assuming the paper tickets get very closely inspected as they'd be so rare nowadays with very few SailRail passengers compared to the days when flight was unaffordable, so any mistake would get spotted)

Not very long ago (2006, I think) I travelled from Dun Laoghaire to somewhere in the Thames Valley with a ticket from Dun Laoghaire to [illegible squiggle]. I don't recall having any problems.

Am I right in thinking that tickets to destinations all over Europe used to be issued in this form? They were on the way out (although not extinct, I think) by the time I first made any such journeys.