Ryanair and Easyjet

[Tetchytyke]

I think the thing that broke Ryanair's old attitude was the EU changes to compensation. They can't charge £5+fees anymore and make money, and people won't put up with the crap if they're not paying £5. Ryanair are not that cheap anymore- Aer Lingus often undercut them on London-Dublin, for instance- so they can't act like they are.

 

[jon0844]

What always confuses me is that Ryanair and others make money not so much from the cheap fares, but the more expensive ones. Yet once the price gets to a certain level, I'll fly with someone else.

Who are these people who paid £150-200 for a single flight (as you find on some flights) and still get the exact same service, with all the associated extra costs, as those who paid loads less? I guess they wouldn't want to be known.

 

[Aldaniti]

So far, I've managed to avoid travelling with Easy jet or Ryanair. My last flight was a short hop across the Irish Sea with Aer Lingus. Very satisfactory, leather seats, complimentary coffee and a snack, and a reasonable fare, in fact slightly cheaper than Easy Jet when I booked. The nearest I came to flying with Easy Jet was last year when I wanted to go from Liverpool to Berlin. I then looked at options using the train just for the fun of it as I was in no rush. For exactly the same fare that Easy Jet charged, I was able to travel first class (return) from London, and it was a very pleasant experience. OK, I had to buy a ticket to Euston as well, but the comfort, ambience, level of service and experience was, I imagine, much better than the budget airlines. No, I'll continue with my quest to get through life without the budget airlines thank you very much.

 

[northwichcat]

Who are these people who paid £150-200 for a single flight (as you find on some flights) and still get the exact same service, with all the associated extra costs, as those who paid loads less? I guess they wouldn't want to be known.

Some people have to buy flights at the last minute not through choice.

In 2008 I went to Paris via Eurostar and had booked a return flight home. On the morning I was due to return back I'd heard all Eurostar services to England were suspended due to a freight train catching fire, so when I arrived at the Airport the EasyJet Sales desks had a longer queue than the EasyJet check-in desks.

In 2013 I'd booked on EasyJet Manchester-Munich flight. As it got near my travel date Lufthansa announced a strike meaning multiple flights between Manchester and Munich were cancelled on the day I would be travelling. Unsurprisingly the flight I was on had every seat occupied.

 

[jon0844]

No, I'll continue with my quest to get through life without the budget airlines thank you very much.

No problem with that, but they're not too bad now. I think the fact there's more competition and rail is no longer seen as a slow, dirty, unreliable, experience has also helped.

Rail might be longer in terms of journey time (rail vs air) but factor everything else in, and rail is certainly something I will look at when comparing options and prices.

If you've got luggage, or don't fancy having to arrive at the airport hours before (even if you can rock up just 30 minutes before, you're likely screwed if your bus/train/taxi is delayed), or simply don't want the hassle of clearing security and hanging around, rail will often be worth a premium.

Some people have to buy flights at the last minute not through choice.

Yeah, but I wonder if there's enough of these people in the long run?

I guess there must be. Or else the fact there aren't that many really cheap fares means they actually do pretty well from everyone these days.

 

[northwichcat]

So far, I've managed to avoid travelling with Easy jet or Ryanair. My last flight was a short hop across the Irish Sea with Aer Lingus. Very satisfactory, leather seats, complimentary coffee and a snack, and a reasonable fare, in fact slightly cheaper than Easy Jet when I booked.

Have Aer Lingus changed their policy recently? There was no complimentary items when I few Manchester to Cork a few years ago.

I recall when I was in Ireland there was some media criticism of an Aer Lingus sale which allowed people to visit Ireland for less than it costed the Irish to travel abroad.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

Yeah, but I wonder if there's enough of these people in the long run?

I guess there must be. Or else the fact there aren't that many really cheap fares means they actually do pretty well from everyone these days.

The only budget airline routes I've ever travelled on where there's been a very low loading compared to the number of seats have been Liverpool to Cologne and Liverpool to Gibraltar, both were EasyJet and both those routes have since been withdrawn. It seems on most routes they can get a decent loading and if they can't the route doesn't survive.

Airlines know without cheapish seats they won't fill up planes outside school holidays but in school holidays they can charge full price and fill up all the seats.

 

[Tetchytyke]

Aer Lingus themselves don't do leather seats and don't do complimentaries. BA have them, but then BA are usually much more expensive (although not always). I didn't think Aer Lingus and BA codeshared anymore.

What always confuses me is that Ryanair and others make money not so much from the cheap fares, but the more expensive ones. Yet once the price gets to a certain level, I'll fly with someone else.

It depends where you're flying, Ryanair don't always have competition anymore. I paid £160 return when I flew to Derry last October for a wedding, because Ryanair were the only ones who flew there and the hassle of getting from Belfast wasn't worth it. Easyjet don't have competition Newcastle-Belfast, and Aer Lingus have only just returned to Newcastle-Dublin using Stobart Air.

 

[northwichcat]

Aer Lingus don't do leather seats and don't do complimentaries. BA have them, but then BA are usually much more expensive.

They were either leather or faux leather when I used them.

 

[WestCoast]

Aer Lingus are quite a nice airline but not that much "nicer" than Easyjet nowadays. Both have allocated seating and you have to pay for a preselected seat, both charge for hold bags and both offer no complimentary refreshments onboard. The A319s that EI use on Gatwick - Belfast City have worse legroom at the back than easyjet in my experience.

Aer Lingus do sell lovely Full Irish Breakfasts on-board though, which beats the EZY bacon roll anytime.

 

[Hornet]

Aer Lingus themselves don't do leather seats and don't do complimentaries. BA have them, but then BA are usually much more expensive (although not always). I didn't think Aer Lingus and BA codeshared anymore.

http://www.irishtimes.com/business/...ns-iag-as-shareholders-approve-deal-1.2321087

Aer Lingus and BA are both now owned by IAG, along with Iberia.

 

[Aldaniti]

Have Aer Lingus changed their policy recently? There was no complimentary items when I few Manchester to Cork a few years ago.

I'm not an expert in these things, but the flight was from Manchester to Dublin and I was given a coffee, a ham and cheese roll and a KitKat on the outward leg, but just a coffee and another Kit Kat on the return. Nobody else was charged so I can't claim the stewardess took a shine to me!
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

Aer Lingus themselves don't do leather seats and don't do complimentaries.

Must have been a figment of my imagination then.

 

[northwichcat]

http://www.irishtimes.com/business/...ns-iag-as-shareholders-approve-deal-1.2321087

Aer Lingus and BA are both now owned by IAG, along with Iberia.

Ryanair had been trying to get overall control but the Irish government kept telling O'Leary to **** off. When the Irish government sold their 25% to IAG, Ryanair also agreed to sell their 30% share.

 

[stut]

Who are these people who paid £150-200 for a single flight (as you find on some flights) and still get the exact same service, with all the associated extra costs, as those who paid loads less? I guess they wouldn't want to be known.

Depends on the flight, and your location. The LCCs fly an awful lot of routes that aren't supportable by a full-service model. So, in a lot of cases, it's people who don't want to waste several hours to save £20 or get a little extra comfort.

Even if you do live in the SE, your local airport may well be convenient. I live in Beds, and flying from Luton saves me a couple of hours off the door-to-door journey compared to Heathrow or Gatwick.

 

[northwichcat]

I'm not an expert in these things, but the flight was from Manchester to Dublin and I was given a coffee, a ham and cheese roll and a KitKat on the outward leg, but just a coffee and another Kit Kat on the return. Nobody else was charged so I can't claim the stewardess took a shine to me!

So was it an Aer Lingus flight (operated by an Airbus) or an Aer Lingus Regional flight (operated by an ATR by Stobart Air on behalf of Aer Lingus)? Both currently operate between Manchester and Dublin and the plane would have been in Aer Lingus livery regardless.

Also was your flight delayed? Maybe they offer free refreshments to passengers who have been delayed by more than a certain time?

The flight I mentioned which I took between Manchester and Cork was before Aer Lingus Regional was introduced.

 

[button_boxer]

Easyjet won for me on my most recent booking due to the fact that they have a sensible policy on musical instruments as hand luggage, explicitly advertising that they accept violins in the cabin even though they're longer than the official maximum dimensions.

 

[jon0844]

We had two guitars on our Air Berlin/Germanwings flight and they were pretty massive!

Luton is only 15 minutes by taxi and 45 by bus/train/bus and I cleared security last week in no time (and Easyjet's auto bag drop was dead quick too, mostly because 95% of people opted to queue up for half an hour).

The problem is that I know it's risky to cut it so fine. If I book a train ticket from start to end, including a London International ticket if going abroad, I will be covered as long as I follow the itinerary.

But clearly train isn't a viable alternative to a lot of flights. Berlin would have been slow, and my regular flights to Sweden are always going to be by air - except perhaps on occasion where I drive.

 

[nottinghamcity]

It is a bit academic as far as easyjet is concerned if you happen to live in the Midlands. Extremely limited destinations from BHX and nothing from EMA. The nearest airport therefore with a decent set of destinations is Luton, and I wouldn't recommend that to anyone!

 

[Bletchleyite]

It is a bit academic as far as easyjet is concerned if you happen to live in the Midlands. Extremely limited destinations from BHX and nothing from EMA. The nearest airport therefore with a decent set of destinations is Luton, and I wouldn't recommend that to anyone!

Nowt wrong with Luton Airport...quick to get through and a reasonable departure lounge.

 

[Hornet]

Ryanair had been trying to get overall control but the Irish government kept telling O'Leary to **** off. When the Irish government sold their 25% to IAG, Ryanair also agreed to sell their 30% share.

Nothing to do with the Irish Government, The EU blocked the takeover as a merger would have reduced competition on Ireland UK routes.

http://europa.eu/rapid/press-release_IP-13-167_en.htm

http://www.businesspost.ie/#!story/...cerns/id/19410615-5218-512d-f17a-252ab1242192

 

[edwin_m]

​

It is a bit academic as far as easyjet is concerned if you happen to live in the Midlands. Extremely limited destinations from BHX and nothing from EMA. The nearest airport therefore with a decent set of destinations is Luton, and I wouldn't recommend that to anyone!

I've been using Luton a lot recently, as my current work is taking me to Riga and Madrid neither of which have much of a service from anywhere nearer. Doesn't seem drastically worse than anywhere else, though it could do with a few more seats and the older gate areas revamping to match the new ones.

 

[stut]

Luton's vastly improved these days - the speed and professionalism of the security checks puts Heathrow to shame. The downside is the unseemly rush for the gate when it gets announced, and everyone has to pile down the same corridor.

 

[Bletchleyite]

Luton's vastly improved these days - the speed and professionalism of the security checks puts Heathrow to shame. The downside is the unseemly rush for the gate when it gets announced, and everyone has to pile down the same corridor.

That'll be caused by the old scrum boarding process. It's not needed now, but old habits die hard.

As for LTN security, it should improve further as it's being rebuilt with greater capacity.

 

[ivanhoe]

If it's any consolation, I do think they've improved a lot of late. They had no choice.

It was very much a case of 'first they came for the xxx and I said nothing....'

People defended Ryanair and derided those that moaned about hidden or excessive fees, saying they should just get the right prepaid card, check in well in advance, carry the right bag, do this, do that.

Eventually, even those who played the game probably got caught out. Thus, enough people said enough was enough.

And now Ryanair has woken up and realised. Pushing Michael O'Leary into the background (something I think he decided to do himself) was probably very smart.

I think the strategy that O'Leary used at first was very successful. He wanted to position Ryanair as anti flag carriers and he wanted to attract a new generation of flyers who would never have travelled with the likes of BA anyway. The strategy change was always going to happen and he has delivered Ryanair "2".
For most seasoned Ryanair fliers, allocated seats and the loss of that damn hunting horn when the plane landed, were the biggest changes. The biggest critics of Ryanair have always been those who rarely fly with the low cost carriers. I remember when BA were flying from Brum using extremely old aircraft and introducing charges for drinks and snacks that were once complimentary. Nobody batted an eyelid except me. I remember saying that I paid extra to fly with BA because I would be treated better than Low Cost Carriers. What a fool I was!

 

[Aldaniti]

So was it an Aer Lingus flight (operated by an Airbus) or an Aer Lingus Regional flight (operated by an ATR by Stobart Air on behalf of Aer Lingus)? Both currently operate between Manchester and Dublin and the plane would have been in Aer Lingus livery regardless.

Also was your flight delayed? Maybe they offer free refreshments to passengers who have been delayed by more than a certain time?

The flight I mentioned which I took between Manchester and Cork was before Aer Lingus Regional was introduced.

Planes are not my field of expertise or interest, but it was a jet (I flew from Schiphol to Berlin in 2013 with KLM and was slightly surprised to find myself on a small propeller driven plane), it was in Aer Lingus green livery and had leather seats. Neither flight was delayed, I don't have any airline loyalty or points cards, and paid just over £50 for the return flight.

 

[tony_mac]

I remember when BA were flying from Brum using extremely old aircraft and introducing charges for drinks and snacks that were once complimentary.

I've never seen BA charge for drinks and snacks. You don't get a significant snack on domestic flights, but the beer is certainly free.

I was never caught out by Ryanair's sneaky tactics, but I know people that were. They often changed the rules in strange ways deliberately to catch people out - and did so with obvious disdain for their customers.
They may have 'turned over a new leaf', but their past attitude is enough for me to stay well away from them for at least a while longer.

I like Easyjet's new seats, and found them more spacious, and have also been impressed with Norwegian.

 

[fowler9]

I prefer Easyjet to Ryanair and I prefer the A320 to the 737. That said I tend to use Ryanair more as they fly from Liverpool to the Eastern European destinations I go to. There really is little between them in service though. Coming up though we now have Veuling serving Liverpool to Barcelona and also Aer Lingus on Liverpool to Dublin. Aer Lingus will open up some US destinations. Also FlyBE to Amsterdam will offer others. I was hoping Veuling may with their associations but not via Barca. CSA and Blue Air as well as those make JLA a bit more interesting though. Slightly off subject but BA offered the scabbiest long haul service I have ever had and that was Heathrow to Hong Kong so hardly a backwater amongst their services.

 

[stut]

That'll be caused by the old scrum boarding process. It's not needed now, but old habits die hard.

To an extent, yes, but it's also in part down to the baggage fees encouraging people to take carry-on luggage at the size limit, meaning if you're not in the first half on board, you may end up with it under the seat in front, which I'd extremely uncomfortable if you're tall.

But it's also the layout of the airport and the high gate utilisation, and fast turnarounds. It can take 10-15 minutes to the furthest gates, with queues for other gates often blocking your path. But they won't post the number until the previous flight has departed, which may not be very long before your boarding time.

As regards BA charging for food - mainline BA didn't, but BA Connect (the bit that was eventually sold to flymaybe) did. But not at London City because bankers.

 

[fowler9]

To an extent, yes, but it's also in part down to the baggage fees encouraging people to take carry-on luggage at the size limit, meaning if you're not in the first half on board, you may end up with it under the seat in front, which I'd extremely uncomfortable if you're tall.

But it's also the layout of the airport and the high gate utilisation, and fast turnarounds. It can take 10-15 minutes to the furthest gates, with queues for other gates often blocking your path. But they won't post the number until the previous flight has departed, which may not be very long before your boarding time.

As regards BA charging for food - mainline BA didn't, but BA Connect (the bit that was eventually sold to flymaybe) did. But not at London City because bankers.

Mate you know what you get. I have flown 9 times in the last 12 months. I earn an average Northern England customer services wage. I don't spend all my money bashing planes. I'd say we are doing pretty well.

 

[northwichcat]

Planes are not my field of expertise or interest, but it was a jet (I flew from Schiphol to Berlin in 2013 with KLM and was slightly surprised to find myself on a small propeller driven plane), it was in Aer Lingus green livery and had leather seats. Neither flight was delayed, I don't have any airline loyalty or points cards, and paid just over £50 for the return flight.

Sounds like you were on a KLM flight being operated by an Aer Lingus livered plane for some reason. KLM do offer complimentary refreshments.

 

[Bletchleyite]

I like Easyjet's new seats, and found them more spacious

Surprised at that, because they have added an extra row, and the legroom to me seems tighter than the old A320 layout as a result. (The 320s always had slightly more legroom than the 319s).