Rules regarding station queues

[gizmo]

Hi,

Can anyone tell me the rules regarding queues at stations. I'm pretty sure I've read before that if you arrive having arrived at the station having left a reasonable amount of time to buy tickets and the queues are too long for you to purchase one you can board the train and pay there if you immediately inform the guard.

I'm asking because I was today forced to miss a train from London Bridge despite having arrived 12 minutes before departure because the queues were insane (I asked to be allowed through the gate but denied - I then went and queued, which took 15 minutes - I got my ticket 7 minutes after my train departed...) The lack of ticketing machines at this station is scandalous!

 

[me123]

Same at Glasgow Central, I'm afraid, and we have a reasonable number of machines. At peak time, the "human barriers" are in place, and you have to buy a ticket. All the machines are queued and the "normal" ticket offices are jam packed as well; there's really no chance of getting a ticket if you turn up 10 minutes early. And I have spoken to barrier staff, and they have refused to sell a ticket.

If the barriers are in place, they are quite right however to refuse to let you onto the platform without a ticket. The solution at London Bridge and Glasgow Central has to be more TVMs; IMO if you turn up 10 minutes early, you should always be able to board your train.

 

[gizmo]

If the barriers are in place, they are quite right however to refuse to let you onto the platform without a ticket. The solution at London Bridge and Glasgow Central has to be more TVMs; IMO if you turn up 10 minutes early, you should always be able to board your train.

Exactly! While I'm they're within their rights to stop me boarding, I'm sure there's a rule somewhere that in stations without barriers if you manage to board the train then the queues being unacceptably long is a reasonable excuse (like a broken ticket machine)...

 

[dan_atki]

There are no rules about queues to purchase a ticket. TOCs will specify a target in their Passenger Charter but this doesn't mean if they fail to serve you in that time that you can buy on board.

At ungated stations, asking the guard before boarding will sometimes allow you to purchase from them but you should never expect them to sell you a ticket if there is an opportunity to purchase before boarding regardless of the length of wait.

Rules state if there is a retail opportunity (be it machine or ticket office) in working order/open then the ticket must be purchased before travel EXCEPT if
a) signs/notices say you may buy a ticket on board
b) the TOC allows you to purchase full priced tickets on board

However, neither of these apply to barriered (human or automatic) stations or those that operate a compulsory ticket area.

 

[rail-britain]

If the barriers are in place, they are quite right however to refuse to let you onto the platform without a ticket

Not according to Network Rail
I brought this up when I complained about accessing the platforms, as the signs CLEARLY state BOARDING a train, not a platform
Network Rail also agree with this
However, it's quite to prove you are not travelling on a train when on a platform, and equally that you did not travel on a train that may have subsequently arrived at that platform
I did this recently at Glasgow Queen Street, where I accessed the platform with a ticket between Anniesland and Partick!

 

[Mojo]

As others have said, I don't think there are set rules other than in the passenger charter. The DfT's Penalty Fares Rules do say, however

4.12 Where penalty fares apply, passengers must allow enough time to buy a ticket, including time to queue, if necessary. Under normal circumstances, passengers may still be charged a penalty fare if they join a train without a ticket, even if there was a queue at the ticket office or ticket machine. However, we expect operators to provide enough ticket windows, ticket machines and staff at staffed stations to meet the queuing standards set out in the Ticketing and Settlement Agreement and their Passenger's Charter under normal circumstances. This standard is normally five minutes at peak times and three minutes at other times. If queues at a particular station regularly fail to meet these standards at certain times or days of the week, the operator must either take action to sort out the problem before a penalty fares scheme is introduced or make sure that passengers are not charged penalty fares when these queuing standards are not met. This might include providing extra staff or ticket machines. A penalty fares scheme must include arrangements for telling authorised collectors when long queues build up at ticket offices.

 

[BlueGrey]

Hi,

Can anyone tell me the rules regarding queues at stations. I'm pretty sure I've read before that if you arrive having arrived at the station having left a reasonable amount of time to buy tickets and the queues are too long for you to purchase one you can board the train and pay there if you immediately inform the guard.

I'm asking because I was today forced to miss a train from London Bridge despite having arrived 12 minutes before departure because the queues were insane (I asked to be allowed through the gate but denied - I then went and queued, which took 15 minutes - I got my ticket 7 minutes after my train departed...) The lack of ticketing machines at this station is scandalous!

This kind of 'Zero Tolerance' policy regarding tickets concerns me as I think it discourages people from using the Railways. While the problem is caused by the number of people who attempt to travel fraudulently I feel it is scandalous to attempt to charge normal law abiding passengers who have been unable to buy a ticket the full fare or even in some cases to prevent them from travelling. Unfortunately I feel some Railway staff's attitude to passengers who have genuinely been unable to purchase a ticket can be very disappointing. While fradulent travel is a problem it is completely unacceptable to penalize normal passengers especially where the TOCs fail to provide adequate ticket purchasing facilities.