• Our new ticketing site is now live! Using either this or the original site (both powered by TrainSplit) helps support the running of the forum with every ticket purchase! Find out more and ask any questions/give us feedback in this thread!

Royal Mail discussion

Status
Not open for further replies.

johncrossley

Established Member
Joined
30 Mar 2021
Messages
4,385
Location
London
Not even close. There are still numerous places/situations where contactless payments aren't accepted or appropriate.

Only because those retailers choose not to accept contactless. The point is that the technology already exists to scrap Chip & PIN. The end of Chip & PIN would mean even less post required through the letterbox.

Post is currently generated by the delivery of mobile SIM cards, which is annoying. You can get some SIM cards from the shop but some providers only deliver. But hopefully that won't be needed once eSIMs become standard.
 
Last edited:
Sponsor Post - registered members do not see these adverts; click here to register, or click here to log in
R

RailUK Forums

Tazi Hupefi

On Moderation
Joined
1 Apr 2018
Messages
1,838
Location
Nottinghamshire
I've also just recalled an incident many years ago were a police force decided to try and reduce the number of people failing to respond to notices for driver information - and the associated "I didn't receive it" excuses.

They decided, as it was then, to send some of their more serious notices by first class recorded post, now known as Signed For.

However, this promptly backfired.

Instead of the letter being forced through a letterbox, when the postman knocked and asked for a signature, with the fairly obvious police return address frank/postmark printed along the top, it was simply refused by the household before it had been handed over, with the inevitable legal arguments that it couldn't have been said to be served, if the postman wouldn't hand it over without a signature, and a signature for a letter not being a legal requirement.
 

najaB

Veteran Member
Joined
28 Aug 2011
Messages
33,594
Location
Scotland
The bank can still give you a card number even if you don't have a physical card. You can have single use card numbers, for example.
So not really any more convenient than a piece of plastic with the number written on it.
 

johncrossley

Established Member
Joined
30 Mar 2021
Messages
4,385
Location
London
So not really any more convenient than a piece of plastic with the number written on it.

But you have to have the card delivered. At best you can get the card printed in branch, for example with Metrobank. If you lose the card, then you have to wait for a replacement.
 

jfollows

Established Member
Joined
26 Feb 2011
Messages
10,084
Location
Wilmslow
I think that Royal Mail is being run by arrogant fools who are dismantling the only things of value that the company has - it is generally trusted by people who use it because of the staff that the fools manage. It is similar to John Lewis which had a unique selling proposition which has been dismantled by its management. Perhaps neither of these companies could survive without making these changes, but I don't believe so, and I do believe that in their new incarnations they won't survive. Royal Mail has the added damage from the Horizon scandal, for which the people responsible have never been properly held to account.
It's difficult, but that's why these people are paid lots of money. Falling into receivership would be their fault primarily. Coming up with a more equitable solution would be the right answer, but when they have lost the trust of their employees that's going to be hard.
Fortunately I'll never need to buy another stamp, I have enough of them to last many years, so the price rises are irrelevant. I wonder how many other people are in the same boat?
 

johncrossley

Established Member
Joined
30 Mar 2021
Messages
4,385
Location
London
I can't remember the last time I used a stamp. Must be a few years ago. I had a couple of old spare books of stamps which I have changed into the new format. I doubt I will ever need any more.
 

tigerroar

Member
Joined
30 May 2010
Messages
528
Location
Gloucester
So a 15% price rise for a service that is frankly diabolical. It's a company that doesn't deserve to be trading.

why is it diabolical?

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: ==

How do you judge value for money? I would compare against the alternatives over time. In the 80s, it was expensive to make a long distance call and so sending a letter was reasonable value by comparison. Now email is free and phone calls are more or less free if you use mobile apps or have unlimited UK minutes on your phone plan.
Send a letter from Penzance to Inverness and it arrives the next morning for just over a pound.
 

43096

On Moderation
Joined
23 Nov 2015
Messages
18,745
why is it diabolical?
Routinely late to deliver - it failed to meet its own deadlines at Christmas, for example, and I've waited weeks for items sent first class to arrive (currently at one month and counting for an item I know was sent). This isn't just occasional - it is routine. They're making TPE look like an efficient, punctual operation.
 

Dai Corner

Established Member
Joined
20 Jul 2015
Messages
6,990
Royal Mail has the added damage from the Horizon scandal, for which the people responsible have never been properly held to account.
Horizon was the Post Office, not Royal Mail. I realise many people still think they're the same organisation but the scandal is not taking up any Royal Mail management time, and I doubt if anyone avoids using RM because of it.
 

jfollows

Established Member
Joined
26 Feb 2011
Messages
10,084
Location
Wilmslow
Horizon was the Post Office, not Royal Mail. I realise many people still think they're the same organisation but the scandal is not taking up any Royal Mail management time, and I doubt if anyone avoids using RM because of it.
You're quite right, and thank you for correcting me, but the public perception of "value" is that it's the same organisation that sells you stamps over a counter as the one which collects your (stamped) letters from the letter box and delivers them to your front door.
EDIT PS I made £389 out of the Royal Mail sale in 2013-2014 so I really ought to remember which is which!
 
Last edited:

Gloster

Veteran Member
Joined
4 Sep 2020
Messages
12,945
Location
Up the creek
Horizon was the Post Office, not Royal Mail. I realise many people still think they're the same organisation but the scandal is not taking up any Royal Mail management time, and I doubt if anyone avoids using RM because of it.

You're quite right, and thank you for correcting me, but the public perception of "value" is that it's the same organisation that sells you stamps over a counter as the one which collects your (stamped) letters from the letter box and delivers them to your front door.
EDIT PS I made £389 out of the Royal Mail sale in 2013-2014 so I really ought to remember which is which!

If I have understood correctly, the Post Office was part of the Royal Mail until 2012. The Horizon scandal started in 1999, although the worst of the deliberate obstructiveness (and worse) was after the separation.
 

Tetchytyke

Veteran Member
Joined
12 Sep 2013
Messages
17,459
Location
Isle of Man
I think that Royal Mail is being run by arrogant fools who are dismantling the only things of value that the company has

Oh they’re not fools, it’s a deliberate policy to carve out all the juicy bits and leave a rump that’s “not profitable” to go bust/survive on subsidy/both.

That’s the whole point of privatisation: to privatise profit. Losses? Meh, that’s why the plebs pay tax.
 

Baxenden Bank

Established Member
Joined
23 Oct 2013
Messages
4,743
Oh they’re not fools, it’s a deliberate policy to carve out all the juicy bits and leave a rump that’s “not profitable” to go bust/survive on subsidy/both.

That’s the whole point of privatisation: to privatise profit. Losses? Meh, that’s why the plebs pay tax.
Placing all the liabilities (eg any pension fund shortfalls) in the rump and the assets (landholdings) in the juicy bit. Wonder if the Royal Mail bit has to lease it's operational properties from another part of the same group at excessive amounts?
 

jfollows

Established Member
Joined
26 Feb 2011
Messages
10,084
Location
Wilmslow
It looks like management incompetence at Royal Mail is not confined to the leadership team (https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/...ffers-pay-rise-in-april-fools-prank-fb2r3fswm):
Royal Mail apology after boss offers pay rise in April Fool’s prank
Charlie Parker

Tuesday April 04 2023, 12.00am, The Times

Royal Mail has apologised after a manager announced a big pay rise for striking staff in what turned out to be an April Fool’s prank.

A letter seen by staff said the company and the Communication Workers Union had “reached an agreement” after months of strikes. It detailed a breakthrough salary increase of 11 per cent, backdated to April last year, and said staff would be able to use their own cars to make deliveries.

The notice was put up at the Royal Mail Gloucester North branch, but was shared widely because it encouraged staff to spread the word on social media.

Celebrations turned to anger when workers realised it was a prank. The union described the stunt — which came days after reports that it was preparing to announce strike dates following a failure to reach an agreement with Royal Mail — as “nasty” and “tone deaf”.

The union said: “Throughout the postal workers’ strike, Royal Mail workplaces have seen managers engaging in unprecedented levels of intimidation against postal workers . . . For many employees, the workplace is now a completely toxic environment where nasty, tone-deaf ‘jokes’ such as these are considered culturally acceptable.”

On social media, Royal Mail workers described the manager behind the note, who has not been named, as a “horrible human being”. Some called for the person to be sacked. Others said that those who had believed the notice should “give their heads a wobble” as it was “unbelievable” and clearly “banter”.

Royal Mail said: “We apologise for any upset caused by this misjudged April Fool’s joke . . . The local manager has apologised.”
 

AlterEgo

Verified Rep - Wingin' It! Paul Lucas
Joined
30 Dec 2008
Messages
29,263
Location
LBK
To be fair that’s a proper April Fool prank with stakes. None of this wishy washy twee stuff.
 

pdq

Member
Joined
7 Oct 2010
Messages
893
I spotted a new collection times plate a few weeks ago and managed to get a photo this morning. It shows that the last collection time is 9am Monday to Friday and 7am on a Saturday.
Surely this means for most users their post will now be collected the following day. Is this becoming a common occurrence?

20230414_075320.jpg
 

Mcr Warrior

Veteran Member
Joined
8 Jan 2009
Messages
17,179
I spotted a new collection times plate a few weeks ago and managed to get a photo this morning. It shows that the last collection time is 9am Monday to Friday and 7am on a Saturday.
Surely this means for most users their post will now be collected the following day. Is this becoming a common occurrence?
Yes. Tends to happen at all the less busy / little-used collection boxes. The collection time might not be exactly 9.00 a.m. during the week, it could be then, or possibly a little later. Would be useful if the day of the next collection (metal plate) was always in use at such post boxes. (It's seemingly missing from the one in the pic).

If you want to post an item later on during the day, postboxes outside of sub post offices usually have later collection times.
 

jfollows

Established Member
Joined
26 Feb 2011
Messages
10,084
Location
Wilmslow
I spotted a new collection times plate a few weeks ago and managed to get a photo this morning. It shows that the last collection time is 9am Monday to Friday and 7am on a Saturday.
Surely this means for most users their post will now be collected the following day. Is this becoming a common occurrence?
Something like this has been the case for a number of years now for my nearest post box. I'd say ten or more.
It's fine with me. Post something and know that it'll be collected the following morning. My recent passport application required the return of my old passport, I posted it Friday evening, it was collected Saturday morning and delivered Tuesday morning.
I have the option of a short walk to a "central" postbox which has a collection at 5pm, so if I want the post to be delivered as quickly as possible I will use this.
The only good thing is that the local post box used to say that the nearest post box with a later collection was in Sainsbury's, which wasn't true, and it's now been modified and corrected.
 

Typhoon

Established Member
Joined
2 Nov 2017
Messages
3,540
Location
Kent
I spotted a new collection times plate a few weeks ago and managed to get a photo this morning. It shows that the last collection time is 9am Monday to Friday and 7am on a Saturday.
Surely this means for most users their post will now be collected the following day. Is this becoming a common occurrence?

View attachment 132946
Over the years more and more near me have exactly the same times on (used to be the nearest, on the estate; it is now the next nearest four at least). The post box is emptied when the postman (driver) passes it to deliver the mail. The times are 'not before' times so our mail is usually delivered sometime between 11:00 and 12:30, if I can put the post in by 10:00 it gets a 'soft landing' so there is quite a bit of post inside (ie not collected).

The postman who collects our post has been on the route for years, a decent bloke. Doubtless if you have similar delivery staff, they can give you a better idea of when the post is actually collected.
 

Trainbike46

Established Member
Joined
18 Sep 2021
Messages
4,367
Location
belfast
I spotted a new collection times plate a few weeks ago and managed to get a photo this morning. It shows that the last collection time is 9am Monday to Friday and 7am on a Saturday.
Surely this means for most users their post will now be collected the following day. Is this becoming a common occurrence?

View attachment 132946
almost every postbox in my area has these collection times. I think it means that they collect it while delivering post, which seems fair enough to me.

If it's urgent, I can drop it at the post office or delivery office, which at least in cities would be available relatively close by for most people
 

XAM2175

Established Member
Joined
8 Jun 2016
Messages
3,471
Location
Glasgow
The post box is emptied when the postman (driver) passes it to deliver the mail. The times are 'not before' times so our mail is usually delivered sometime between 11:00 and 12:30, if I can put the post in by 10:00 it gets a 'soft landing' so there is quite a bit of post inside (ie not collected).
I think it means that they collect it while delivering post, which seems fair enough to me.
Bingo, it allows them to merge emptying the boxes into delivery rounds rather than having to send people around again in the afternoon/evening.

If it's urgent, I can drop it at the post office or delivery office, which at least in cities would be available relatively close by for most people
Yes, most people in cities and towns will have that option. Certainly in Glasgow most of the street boxes out of the city centre have gone to 9 am clearances, but post offices still accept same-day post up to 5 pm, a handful of pillar boxes in the city centre are cleared between 6 and 6.15 pm, and for people who're very desperate you can take it to the mail centre yourself where there's a pillar box with a 7 pm clearance.
 

Peter Mugridge

Veteran Member
Joined
8 Apr 2010
Messages
17,800
Location
Epsom
Yes. Tends to happen at all the less busy / little-used collection boxes.
This is being done on extremely busy pillar boxes in the middle of Epsom as well... I think it's a national standard they're rolling out. I'd regard it as a national sub-standard, personally...
 

A0

On Moderation
Joined
19 Jan 2008
Messages
7,751
I think that Royal Mail is being run by arrogant fools who are dismantling the only things of value that the company has - it is generally trusted by people who use it because of the staff that the fools manage. It is similar to John Lewis which had a unique selling proposition which has been dismantled by its management. Perhaps neither of these companies could survive without making these changes, but I don't believe so, and I do believe that in their new incarnations they won't survive. Royal Mail has the added damage from the Horizon scandal, for which the people responsible have never been properly held to account.
It's difficult, but that's why these people are paid lots of money. Falling into receivership would be their fault primarily. Coming up with a more equitable solution would be the right answer, but when they have lost the trust of their employees that's going to be hard.
Fortunately I'll never need to buy another stamp, I have enough of them to last many years, so the price rises are irrelevant. I wonder how many other people are in the same boat?

Bit in bold - Horizon was the Post Office, not Royal Mail and took place *after* they'd been separated.

It's wrong and inaccurate to link Royal Mail to the Post Office Horizon scandal.
 

jfollows

Established Member
Joined
26 Feb 2011
Messages
10,084
Location
Wilmslow
Bit in bold - Horizon was the Post Office, not Royal Mail and took place *after* they'd been separated.

It's wrong and inaccurate to link Royal Mail to the Post Office Horizon scandal.
See posts 402, 403 & 404 above; the point has already been made and acknowledged.
 

A0

On Moderation
Joined
19 Jan 2008
Messages
7,751
If I have understood correctly, the Post Office was part of the Royal Mail until 2012. The Horizon scandal started in 1999, although the worst of the deliberate obstructiveness (and worse) was after the separation.

Wrong way round.

The General Post Office was the overall corporation, comprising of Telephones, Post Office, Royal Mail and Girobank.

Progressively telephone, Girobank etc were spun off and eventually they renamed GPO as Royal Mail Holdings as a govt owned entity, but the Post Office was run at arms length.

The Post Office was made fully independent on privatisation of Royal Mail in 2012.

So Horizon started under the GPO. Royal Mail, as it is today, wasn't responsible for Horizon except the brand was used as the umbrella brand for the holding company.
 

zero

Established Member
Joined
3 Apr 2011
Messages
1,593
I spotted a new collection times plate a few weeks ago and managed to get a photo this morning. It shows that the last collection time is 9am Monday to Friday and 7am on a Saturday.
Surely this means for most users their post will now be collected the following day. Is this becoming a common occurrence?

This was the case at my previous house since about 2017, but in reality the post got collected at noon, and there was another box with a collection at 5pm.

In my current house all the nearby postboxes state 9am, but in reality it gets collected between 1pm and 4pm, and it's not necessarily on the delivery rounds as I see the vans coming back for the collections about 1-3 hours after they do the deliveries.

However I have noticed since Christmas that letters are only arriving 3 days a week and on the other days it's parcels. It isn't the same days every week though.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Top