Routine track inspections.

[83G/84D]

Don't have many details however have been told that in the not too distant future the majority of track inspections will be done by train rather than patrollers walking the line.

This is certainly on the cards for the Western Route. Given the frequency and sheer number of inspections every week I'd be interested to know what type of trains will be used and the number that will be used.

Will they be conversions from exisiting trains or new build?

Anyone able to shed any light on this?

 

[142094]

Network Rail already run some converted trains - the Flying Banana (HST), a former 150 unit and also some coaches hauled by 31s.

Have a look here

 

[jopsuk]

Is the future to some extent more equipment on all trains? The Class 379s all have a track camera with light on the front, and a pantograph/overhead camera with light on the roof.

 

[apk55]

There will alway be some requirement for some inspectors walking the line, the good old mk1A eyeball is unbeatable for some things. Problems may not always be visible from the limited viewpoint of a train mounted camera system for example with drainage, embankment and cutting problems, bridges, track-side fencing etc. And if something suspicious is seen on a camera then the first thing that is probably done is to send out an inspector to look at the situation in detail.

 

[142094]

I wouldn't be surprised to see more use of 'self-repairing' technology and things that can report a fault before it becomes too major. As has been said, there are no doubt some things can can't be seen without someone actually going out and looking at it.

 

[michael769]

And if something suspicious is seen on a camera then the first thing that is probably done is to send out an inspector to look at the situation in detail.

Isn't this more likely to be the future with automated systems and video being used to spot potential problems which are then followed up by more detailed site inspections?

 

[The Informer]

Don't have many details however have been told that in the not too distant future the majority of track inspections will be done by train rather than patrollers walking the line.

This is certainly on the cards for the Western Route. Given the frequency and sheer number of inspections every week I'd be interested to know what type of trains will be used and the number that will be used.

Will they be conversions from exisiting trains or new build?

Anyone able to shed any light on this?

Its the PLPR train...
HYDRO is the man for this.

 

[driver9000]

a former 150 unit

The 150 was purpose built by BR for departmental work, it was never in the passenger fleet. With the exception of the HST I think a lot of the Network Rail inspection fleet is formerly of the BR departmental stock once used by the RTC.

 

[83G/84D]

Network Rail already run some converted trains - the Flying Banana (HST), a former 150 unit and also some coaches hauled by 31s.

Have a look here

Yes I know about them but they are not specifically for visual track inspections.

 

[Ploughman]

There is some use of R/Rail vehicles like Landrovers and also personnel carrying trolleys rigged up with additional lighting.

 

[DarloRich]

Yes I know about them but they are not specifically for visual track inspections.

i think they are!

There is the also new S&C inspection MPV jobbie

 

[driver9000]

It may not be quite the same thing but during last years heavy snow I had p/way carrying out patrols riding with me in the cab. One guy explained that the snow had meant it wasn't possible for them to patrol on foot as they normally would do.

Could they simply use normal service trains and be issued with the necessary passes?

 

[DXMachina]

Do rail faults (cracks, breaks, damaged joints) affect the operation of automatic signalling by changing the resistance of the circuit? (I understand the train completes a circuit by connecting both rails together.. if wrong, ignore..)

Could smarter electrical monitoring detect some sorts of failure or give forewarning?

 

[Nym]

Theres many other things you don't care about that affect the track circuit conductivity and harmonics though.

 

[Hydro]

Current track recording vehicles, the NMT, the unit, Track Recording Coach et al are not visual inspection vehicles. They are dynamic geometry measurement vehicles first and foremost. They do record video but not for component inspection purposes.

PLPR (plain line pattern recognition) is a system being trialled on the NMT development vehicle. It uses cameras and machine pattern recognition software to inspect the rails fastenings, sleepers and general track componentry and flag up misplaced, damaged, or incorrectly fitted components - like a patrolman would. It is monitored by a qualified track patrolman and the defects verified and validated by them before reporting.

It's an experimental system that should supplement existing track walks and potentially cut down on the amount of times plain line track needs to be walked, not replace the walks entirely. The train can't see everything, nor carry out minor repairs en route. It's only aimed at plain line track, hence the name. S&C will generally be manually checked, with some having the MPV used in complex station throats where standard patrolling is dangerous or disruptive, assuming it passes the trials.

The PLPR kit will be mounted on Mk.2 vehicles and inserted into an Infrastructure Monitoring Train, which will be PLPR, Geometry and a specialist (OLE contact/non contact system, Conductor Rail etc measurement vehicle).

An IMT is proposed to be loco + coaches + DVT/DBSO or loco.

 

[swt_passenger]

It's an experimental system that should supplement existing track walks and potentially cut down on the amount of times plain line track needs to be walked, not replace the walks entirely. The train can't see everything, nor carry out minor repairs en route. It's only aimed at plain line track, hence the name. S&C will always be manually checked.

Ought to be just the job for the sort of incident found up in the north east this week when a length of Pandrol clips were found to be missing...

 

[jopsuk]

Hydro, what then are the 379 cameras used for? Do you know if any other future stock will be so covered in cameras (they no doubt have a "drivers eye" one, plus they have DOO ones on the sides and many, high quality, CCTV ones inside)

 

[PaulLothian]

Hydro, what then are the 379 cameras used for? Do you know if any other future stock will be so covered in cameras (they no doubt have a "drivers eye" one, plus they have DOO ones on the sides and many, high quality, CCTV ones inside)

Could be the basis for a selection of Driver's Eye DVDs to help reduce Network Rail's funding problems!

 

[Hydro]

I can't say. I've not heard of anything within our department about receiving data from 379 cameras.

The only service train equipment I know we were involved in was the fitting of at least one instrumented pantograph to a Pendo, and Unattended Geometry Measurement Systems to Pendolinos and Chiltern DMUs. The lack of maintenance and problems downloading the data regularly meant these systems seem to be sidelined IIRC.

 

[DarloRich]

Current track recording vehicles, the NMT, the unit, Track Recording Coach et al are not visual inspection vehicles. They are dynamic geometry measurement vehicles first and foremost. They do record video but not for component inspection purposes.

PLPR (plain line pattern recognition) is a system being trialled on the NMT development vehicle. It uses cameras and machine pattern recognition software to inspect the rails fastenings, sleepers and general track componentry and flag up misplaced, damaged, or incorrectly fitted components - like a patrolman would. It is monitored by a qualified track patrolman and the defects verified and validated by them before reporting.

It's an experimental system that should supplement existing track walks and potentially cut down on the amount of times plain line track needs to be walked, not replace the walks entirely. The train can't see everything, nor carry out minor repairs en route. It's only aimed at plain line track, hence the name. S&C will generally be manually checked, with some having the MPV used in complex station throats where standard patrolling is dangerous or disruptive, assuming it passes the trials.

http://www.flickr.com/photos/darlo2009/6692356735/in/photostream

That is a picture of the new S&C inspection unit (better pictures are available! )

 

[brianthegiant]

Do rail faults (cracks, breaks, damaged joints) affect the operation of automatic signalling by changing the resistance of the circuit? (I understand the train completes a circuit by connecting both rails together.. if wrong, ignore..)

Could smarter electrical monitoring detect some sorts of failure or give forewarning?

My guess is that the crack would need to be quite severe to pick it up in the most accurate resistance measurement of 100s of metres of track, lots of other variables like temperature, dampness, quality of connection onto track, vibration effects,

Hmm, In theory, you could use a variant of a 'reflectometer' this is an electrical test unit popular with BT engineers, has 2 croc clips which clip to the pairs of a signal cable. Its screen shows a graph, which indicates the distance to any breaks in the cable based on reflection of high frequency pulses sent down the wires. however the accuracy isn't great, and though I have used them on larger power cables, I think if you get complexities like regular welds in the rail you would get too much 'noise' in the signal to deduce anything meaningful.

My guess is you'd stand a better chance of finding invisible/barely visible cracks with sonic / ultrasonic technology, then you can vary frequency, possibly agregating out some of the noise.