Romford - Upminster pre Overground

[Dstock7080]

. . . and I believe there's been no pointwork between any of them since the 1960 rebuild.

LU did install pointwork on their side around 2010 in anticipation of some S Stock to be delivered directly into Upminster depot but an OHLE mast in the way prevented NR from ever completing the link.

Upminster Signal Box

Upminster, eastern terminus of the District Line. 18th May 2016.

www.flickr.com

 

[357]

LU did install pointwork on their side around 2010 in anticipation of some S Stock to be delivered directly into Upminster depot but an OHLE mast in the way prevented NR from ever completing the link.

I thought this was done earlier with the idea of D stock refurbishment at Ilford? I believe they put a crossover at Barking instead some years later

 

[Harpo]

I thought this was done earlier with the idea of D stock refurbishment at Ilford? I believe they put a crossover at Barking instead some years later

As I understand it, the Barking connection was for engineering trains and was unsignalled so could only be used in a possession. I recall the strange photos of 66s on District relaying trains some years ago.

 

[357]

As I understand it, the Barking connection was for engineering trains and was unsignalled so could only be used in a possession. I recall the strange photos of 66s on District relaying trains some years ago.

Yes, the Upminster connection was going to be a similar arrangement as I understood it at the time.

 

[Alfie1014]

In the period immediately after electrification, I'm also now wondering whether the other slam door suburban EMU classes based on the Great Eastern - 302, 307, 308 - ever made an appearance on the line. As the EMU fleets were used interchangeably, to some extent, you would have thought they might have appeared occasionally, substituting for a 305.

However, I don't remember seeing anything other than 305s, until the 315s took over. An explanation may be delay in completing platform lengthening at Emerson Park, to accommodate four cars, though I thought this was finished before the line was energised.

I’m pretty sure 305/1s only ever worked the branch before the 315s arrived. Of course the 305/1s were non gangwayed so there may have been a push to replace with gangwayed stock for safety reasons late at night?

 

[Magdalia]

I’m pretty sure 305/1s only ever worked the branch before the 315s arrived. Of course the 305/1s were non gangwayed so there may have been a push to replace with gangwayed stock for safety reasons late at night?

There was no service late at night. In the early electrification years the last train was 2123 from Romford and 2141 from Upminster.

This was to fit in with 2100 pub closing in the City of London.

 

[Chrius56000]

. . .Just a thought – did the Romford–Upminster line get Totems in the DMU era or did Emerson Park only get an ER Blue Running–In Board?

Chris Williams

 

[MadMac]

. . .Just a thought – did the Romford–Upminster line get Totems in the DMU era or did Emerson Park only get an ER Blue Running–In Board?

Chris Williams

A selection of pictures Here would suggest that it never got totems.

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There was no service late at night. In the early electrification years the last train was 2123 from Romford and 2141 from Upminster.

This was to fit in with 2100 pub closing in the City of London.

Pubs were closing at 9 PM in the 80s?

 

[D6130]

A selection of pictures Here would suggest that it never got totems.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 14 Jul 2025 ==


Pubs were closing at 9 PM in the 80s?

Only in the City of London....where in those days thousands of people worked in banks, offices, etc. but hardly anybody lived. It would be dead by 21 00 - or even earlier - when the remaining stragglers would have staggered off to the appropriate station to catch their trains home to the suburbs.

 

[Sprinter107]

A selection of pictures Here would suggest that it never got totems.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 14 Jul 2025 ==


Pubs were closing at 9 PM in the 80s?

There is a lovely picture on RMweb of Emerson Park Halts' totem. I'm not sure of copywrite or how to put the link on here however.

 

[Magdalia]

Pubs were closing at 9 PM in the 80s?

Yes. Pub opening hours were very restricted until the late 1980s. In residential areas most pubs had evening opening 7-11pm, but, because City of London pubs relied on after work drinking, they did their 4 hours 5-9pm instead. If they had waited until 7pm to open nearly all of their custom would have gone home.

 

[PeterC]

Yes. Pub opening hours were very restricted until the late 1980s. In residential areas most pubs had evening opening 7-11pm, but, because City of London pubs relied on after work drinking, they did their 4 hours 5-9pm instead. If they has waited until 7pm to open nearly all of their custom would have gone home.

I used to do front of house work for a music promoter in Camden Town. When a group in suits turned up it was a good bet that they had been preloadeding for two or three hours.

 

[reddragon]

In the late 70's / early 80's it was mostly class 106 (105) Craven pairs DMBS+DTC. Occasionally you got a class 104 twin / triple, very rarely a class 116 2/3 car. Apparently pre-1977 class 125s often ran on the line in busier times.

I did my school project on the line, capturing passenger numbers over the years (from the old Appold St BR office) and made a case for electrification which I submitted to BR, who wrote back to say they liked it & 3 years later it was wired up as I suggested, albeit without the 2 extra stations that I suggested.

My dad was on the save the push-pull line committee in the 1960's, so I got a book about the line written as part of the case to save it. The clincher was LT lacked enough buses or drivers to run a rail replacement service. Actually, all local bus services then were awful. Only half the buses scheduled run on my school's bus route due to breakdowns & no drivers!

305.4xx units were chosen to run the service on electrification as they were the only 3-car units able to fit the platforms and had been displaced by class 315s on West Anglia Jazz services.

 

[Bishopstone]

In the late 70's / early 80's it was mostly class 106 (105) Craven pairs DMBS+DTC. Occasionally you got a class 104 twin / triple, very rarely a class 116 2/3 car. Apparently pre-1977 class 125s often ran on the line in busier times.

I did my school project on the line, capturing passenger numbers over the years (from the old Appold St BR office) and made a case for electrification which I submitted to BR, who wrote back to say they liked it & 3 years later it was wired up as I suggested, albeit without the 2 extra stations that I suggested.

Not building a new station at the Wingletye Lane overbridge was a missed opportunity, with hindsight. The nearby school with a local catchment (Dury Falls) was transformed into the sixth form college with students from across east London, by 1991, and this would be giving a basic station a good level of trade, easing pressure on the buses from Romford.

There was land available until the late 80s, when houses were built on the plot.

That said, another station stop might have made the half-hourly service pattern too tight.

 

[reddragon]

Not building a new station at the Wingletye Lane overbridge was a missed opportunity, with hindsight. The nearby school with a local catchment (Dury Falls) was transformed into the sixth form college with students from across east London, by 1991, and this would be giving a basic station a good level of trade, easing pressure on the buses from Romford.

There was land available until the late 80s, when houses were built on the plot.

That said, another station stop might have made the half-hourly service pattern too tight.

The nail in the coffin there was the utilities in that land! Transmission Gas & Electric, they cost £millions to move.

 

[MCG]

Mett-Camms mentioned above, 104, 105, 116s also appeared. Also a possibility that the 114s that briefly went to Stratford before going to Lincoln appeared. They certainly did Upminster -Grays and some LTS excursions.

In steam days there were through Romford -Grays workings.

Between 1958 and 1964 I lived in a house that backed on to the LTS line just where the Romford line started to run parallel into Upminster station.

I have a vivid memory of the "shadow" of the connection from the Romford line across the District line to the LTS main line ie the dirty remains of the ballast after the track was removed.

According to Wikepedia "from 20 April 1957 a new bay platform numbered six opened at Upminster and as a result the link between the branch and the LT&S line was removed in 1959".