"Rip Off Britain" and Virgin Trains

[trainophile]

Did anyone see the item on this morning's programme, having a pop at Virgin for not allowing a family with Advance tickets to travel home a few days early?

I wasn't really watching so missed the introduction, but apparently they were on holiday and had a message that another member of the family had been taken seriously ill, so they needed to go back immediately.

Virgin said they would have to buy new tickets, as the rules for Advance tickets mean no flexibility. I completely agree with their stance, otherwise they would have everyone rocking up with an urgent family crisis.

If it was that critical I wouldn't think twice about buying another walk up ticket - even if I had to use a credit card or overdraft.

What annoyed me most was that they went on national TV, on a programme focussing on flagging up unscrupulous traders or scams, and potentially giving Virgin bad publicity. Shame on them, no excuse for that.

 

[gimmea50anyday]

Why didnt they just rebook. £10 admin fee an all that...

 

[trickyvegas]

If they had an annual family travel insurance policy, that would cover exactly this sort of instance. I'm not Virgin's biggest fan but they are definitely not in the wrong here.

 

[yorksrob]

Do Virgin WC not allow advanced purchase passengers to amend their tickets for an admin fee (usually £10) ?. If not, it would seem that their policy is not the best industry practice.

 

[Phil.]

Why don't Virgin - other TOCs are available - simply charge the punter the difference between what the punter has paid and the ticket required to travel on the train. That way the TOC hasn't lost money and the punter will feel it's a fare (see what I did there?) charge. But they won't, they'd rather go for the easy charge again option with the "plenty more punters where they came from attitude". At least that what it seems like.

 

[Ash Bridge]

Do Virgin WC not allow advanced purchase passengers to amend their tickets for an admin fee (usually £10) ?. If not, it would seem that their policy is not the best industry practice.

I'm sure I was able to do this 4/5 years ago, can't remember if it was £10 per ticket then.

 

[AnonymousUser1]

typical over-entitled view of life

the fact anytime tickets exist o nthe railyway is the exception rather than the rule ... coaches, ferries ( barring Dover-Calais ) flights the vast majority of peopel are travelling on 'advance' ticketing

 

[trainophile]

As I said, I missed the intro, so don't know what journey they were making, but it's possible that their tickets were not much more than a tenner anyway, and if there were several of them (I believe two older parents - who may have had railcards - and an adult son), they probably didn't want to fork out £30. We weren't told the outcome, or whether they even travelled back that day.

One of the guest presenters (not the three women) even tutted a bit and said that Virgin could (i.e. should) have used some discretion. Very misleading for people watching, who will miss the whole point of Advance ticket restrictions.

I write as someone who has wasted at least £100 this year due to changed plans, but hey that's the chance I take.

 

[AlterEgo]

Didn't see the programme but that sounds very unfair. Virgin are many things but a charity they are not. And why should they be?

 

[Don King]

And what won't be reported is how many times Virgin Trains' guards have shown discretion over the years, and gone far and above to look after their passengers, and help them out when things have gone wrong.

 

[gsnedders]

If they had an annual family travel insurance policy, that would cover exactly this sort of instance. I'm not Virgin's biggest fan but they are definitely not in the wrong here.

Though many travel insurance policies don't cover any holiday where you're staying with family within the UK (i.e., your choice of accommodation can make the entire trip uncovered).

 

[Tetchytyke]

Why didnt they just rebook. £10 admin fee an all that...

Be interesting to see if they were told that they could amend their ticket, subject to the fare difference, or whether they'd "need a new ticket". The two things are very different...

 

[najaB]

Be interesting to see if they were told that they could amend their ticket, subject to the fare difference, or whether they'd "need a new ticket". The two things are very different...

I suspect they took umbrage at the fact that they were being asked to pay anything at all, so the details may well have been lost on them.

 

[johntea]

This Rip Off Britain programme is basically people going on hoping the companies will be afraid because they've gone on TV, luckily they don't seem to really care

There was another episode a few weeks ago where someone was getting a huge mobile phone bill as they were sending smiley faces in text messages which were counting as picture messages but rather than query this at the first opportunity (You get a bill every month either electronically or through the post!) with the mobile provider they just let it carry on then went to this show

 

[Bletchleyite]

Virgin said they would have to buy new tickets

I hope they didn't as that is completely false.

The correct action if they just showed up at the station is to change the tickets for walk-ups with a £10 admin fee. Though if they were worth less than £10 that is not worth it.

If they thought about it a bit beforehand, they could possibly have changed them to new Advances for less.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

Do Virgin WC not allow advanced purchase passengers to amend their tickets for an admin fee (usually £10) ?. If not, it would seem that their policy is not the best industry practice.

It isn't "best industry practice" or anything like that. The Advance ticket T&Cs are mandatory. VT cannot make them stricter. So if a member of staff said they couldn't change them, they need retraining, but I expect as someone else said they just objected to having to pay anything (or their value was under £10).

 

[bramling]

Did anyone see the item on this morning's programme, having a pop at Virgin for not allowing a family with Advance tickets to travel home a few days early?

I wasn't really watching so missed the introduction, but apparently they were on holiday and had a message that another member of the family had been taken seriously ill, so they needed to go back immediately.

Virgin said they would have to buy new tickets, as the rules for Advance tickets mean no flexibility. I completely agree with their stance, otherwise they would have everyone rocking up with an urgent family crisis.

If it was that critical I wouldn't think twice about buying another walk up ticket - even if I had to use a credit card or overdraft.

What annoyed me most was that they went on national TV, on a programme focussing on flagging up unscrupulous traders or scams, and potentially giving Virgin bad publicity. Shame on them, no excuse for that.

So they bought the advance tickets, receiving a pretty hefty discount in return for being tied down, and then moved the goalposts.

That's a risk you take if you buy an advance.

Why should the TOC waive the rules for them? Otherwise no one would ever need to buy a walk-up priced ticket.

With Virgin on this one, 100%.

(Having said that I'm not a fan of the concept of advance tickets, if I had my way they would be abolished).

 

[jon0844]

What is it with Virgin and getting into the media?

I'm getting mixed up now but was it Jeremy Corbyn refusing to give up his seat for a disabled woman travelling earlier for a family emergency?

Sent from my HUAWEI MLA-L11 using Tapatalk

 

[urbophile]

£10 'admin charge' for changing the tickets seems like a rip-off. I can accept that it's legitimate to charge them the going rate for a new ticket. But how can it possibly cost £10 just to issue new ones? If that's the case, the TOC would lose money on the vast majority of local tickets that cost less than a tenner.

If the 'admin fee' is to discourage frivolous changes of plan, fair enough. But in that case you'd expect the company to exercise some discretion in the case of an emergency (and potential family tragedy) like this.

 

[SJN]

If they waited until the train arrived and asked the Train Manager then it would be new tickets as advances and amendments with £10 fee are not sold on board.

 

[Marklund]

£10 'admin charge' for changing the tickets seems like a rip-off. I can accept that it's legitimate to charge them the going rate for a new ticket. But how can it possibly cost £10 just to issue new ones? If that's the case, the TOC would lose money on the vast majority of local tickets that cost less than a tenner.

If the 'admin fee' is to discourage frivolous changes of plan, fair enough. But in that case you'd expect the company to exercise some discretion in the case of an emergency (and potential family tragedy) like this.

Meah. You pay the cheapest price, you accept the conditions.
Rail isn't alone in differing fare buckets, or pricing structure.

Book a Premier Inn at the Advance Purchase price, and see if you get the money back.

PR is all well and good, until everyone books at the cheapest non-refundable rate, and plays the family emergency card expecting a full refund.

 

[Starmill]

There are absolutely loads of reasons why I think Virgin branded railway companies provide a rubbish service and could do better. This isn't one of them. I can see no possible reason why their tickets could not have been amended to an off-peak fare. I have spent a lot of money amending VT Advance tickets myself recently, sometimes it is the cheapest option because of things you can't foresee or control. It's cheaper by far still to always book Advances where you can and occasionally amend than to always go off-peak (or if you want to travel at "peak" time on this route you can forget flexible tickets).

 

[urbophile]

I still don't see why people should have to pay the whole price of their new ticket. Upgrade yes, and pay the (substantial) difference - but if they are not going to use the advance ticket why should it not be taken into consideration?

 

[Phil.]

So they bought the advance tickets, receiving a pretty hefty discount in return for being tied down, and then moved the goalposts.

That's a risk you take if you buy an advance.

Why should the TOC waive the rules for them? Otherwise no one would ever need to buy a walk-up priced ticket.

With Virgin on this one, 100%.

(Having said that I'm not a fan of the concept of advance tickets, if I had my way they would be abolished).

"...then moved the goalposts".
Well, if they were to be believed - and one must always take people at face value until proven otherwise - the goalposts were not moved at a whim.

 

[6Gman]

I still don't see why people should have to pay the whole price of their new ticket. Upgrade yes, and pay the (substantial) difference - but if they are not going to use the advance ticket why should it not be taken into consideration?

Because then everybody would chance it on cheap Advance tickets.

 

[Bletchleyite]

Because then everybody would chance it on cheap Advance tickets.

Interestingly XC's Direct Award requires the abolition of the £10 admin fee for changing Advances - which allows exactly this practice. It seems like their take on it is not now obtaining money in advance - but simply more granular yield management by pricing each train at its own level - so change as many times as you like.

 

[Starmill]

Given they are only doing 10 weeks in advance at times they can't have been getting much benefit for their cash flow from that alone anyway.

 

[Gareth Marston]

Interestingly XC's Direct Award requires the abolition of the £10 admin fee for changing Advances - which allows exactly this practice. It seems like their take on it is not now obtaining money in advance - but simply more granular yield management by pricing each train at its own level - so change as many times as you like.

Those seat reservations will be an automated changing feed - you can play guess whose changed their mind as you travel and make up their life story
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

Because then everybody would chance it on cheap Advance tickets.

Should be a good source of extra revenue "Advance Upgraded to Off Peak Single" could be a new ticket type to help customers understand the railway better

 

[bramling]

"...then moved the goalposts".
Well, if they were to be believed - and one must always take people at face value until proven otherwise - the goalposts were not moved at a whim.

If it were me and that serious a family emergency, I think having to pay the cost of a new ticket probably wouldn't be my most pressing concern.

It's just one of those facts of life - a decision which has turned out to be a bad one.

Personally I avoid advance tickets because I value flexibility, which at times has meant I've probably ended up paying more than I might have needed to for certain journeys. I'd be pretty ****ed off, to be honest, seeing people getting the saving from an advance ticket and then treating it as an anytime - no matter how sensitive the circumstances.

 

[D6975]

If it were me and that serious a family emergency, I think having to pay the cost of a new ticket probably wouldn't be my most pressing concern.

It's just one of those facts of life - a decision which has turned out to be a bad one.

.

I agree.
I use advances a lot. But if I got a call saying my son was seriously ill, I'd be buying any ticket, rail, coach, bus whatever to get home. Any advances, booked accommodation, days left on rover tickets etc. would all be written off. Some things are more important than money.

 

[Marklund]

Interestingly XC's Direct Award requires the abolition of the £10 admin fee for changing Advances - which allows exactly this practice. It seems like their take on it is not now obtaining money in advance - but simply more granular yield management by pricing each train at its own level - so change as many times as you like.

I wonder if that means that once the seats in those fare buckets have gone, then you'd either have to pay more to move to a higher fare bucket, or choose another service, a la airline tickets