Ride on north bound ECML

[Eurostar373]

I'm interested in the ride quality or lack of on the ECML northbound and possible reasons?

I was on an IC225 from Kings Cross on Monday afternoon and the train bounced and rocked and rolled pretty much most of the way north bound towards Newcastle.

I've just been over to Lille, Northern France on Eurostar, TGV to Arras and IC train sets to Bruges, the rides were a much smoother ride than on the ECML.

Is the poor ride on the ECML due to :-
Track quality
Maintenance
Classic line
Suspension on trains
Age of trains

I'd be interested to hear peoples views.

Thanks

 

[A-driver]

I only sign the kings cross to peterbourgh section of that line but I agree the ride quality has become very very rough in places recently. There has been a lot of rain lately and this causes rough rides as the ground under the rails becomes saturated and causes kinks etc. This is especially bad cross the fens but I have noticed some very rough bits near Barnet, Hatfield, wymondly etc.

Once it dries out a bit it should improve. Parts if it (like Barnet south junction and woolmer green) have always been rough though.

 

[LE Greys]

Lord Berkeley said almost exactly the same thing in Railway Magazine this month.

From what I remember of Eurostars on the same route, they rode as if they were on ice, so a lot may be down to the stock (and they were only doing 110 anyway, way below design speed). Otherwise, I'd say the line is getting a bit worn, but that's a non-expert opinion.

 

[jopsuk]

A friend was recently commenting about this (he was on an EC HST)- apparently on his train the 1st class crockery was going flying from tables.

 

[DaveNewcastle]

Hmmm. I've been a harsh critic of some of the crossovers and other pointwork on the ECML, the worst being Temple Hirst Jn and Colton Jn both in Yorkshire. However, I must say that at the moment, these two are in surprisingly good shape.

I hold onto my drink / plate / pen on some of the obvious curves, but I don't feel its as bad as, say, last winter, when there were various speed restrictions over Temple Hirst for about 6 months.

As for 'rocking and bouncing most of the way', I really don't understand . . . I've travelled Newcastle - London and back twice this week already. In comfort.

 

[Harbon 1]

Something to do with being on a IC225? They're not the comfiest of things around. They've had their troubled past, but are still rather uncomfortable, especially sat virtually on top of the bogie, trying to sleep

 

[Eagle]

220s aren't very smooth on the ECML either (Doncaster to York being probably the worst section).

 

[David Dunning]

How strange that this thread should be the first thing i see today because that's exactly what I was thinking about the run from Darlington to York yesterday.
Felt very rough in places , especially Thirsk and Tollerton

 

[Eurostar373]

Hmmm. I've been a harsh critic of some of the crossovers and other pointwork on the ECML, the worst being Temple Hirst Jn and Colton Jn both in Yorkshire. However, I must say that at the moment, these two are in surprisingly good shape.

I hold onto my drink / plate / pen on some of the obvious curves, but I don't feel its as bad as, say, last winter, when there were various speed restrictions over Temple Hirst for about 6 months.

As for 'rocking and bouncing most of the way', I really don't understand . . . I've travelled Newcastle - London and back twice this week already. In comfort.

Which ever way you put it the ride in particular on the northbound has been particularly uncomfortable on the last 2 trips I've taken. Quite a few jolts and lateral and vertical and that's not when crossing over points etc. At the end of October I was on a northbound 225 around the Northallerton area and I thought the carriage was going to take off at one point, it felt as if it was almost airborne, it was a fairly big jolt.

As per my OP last weekend I took a Belgian IC train from Lille to Bruges over classic lines and the ride was pretty smooth, and the same on a TGV from Lille to Arras rtn over classic lines I think, a really smooth ride, no cups sliding around or jolts etc.

My conclusion is that it must be be the rolling stock, would like to have ridden a regional eurostar on the ECML to see what the ride was like on that.

Roll on the Hitachi super express/IEP at some point in the future, hopefully that stock will be a little more comfortable.

 

[jon91]

Roll on the Hitachi super express/IEP at some point in the future, hopefully that stock will be a little more comfortable.

I'd like to agree but Hitachi's most recent attempt the Class 395 doesn't seem too popular with drivers with regards to ride quality.

In my opinion, IC225s are fine when the 91 is leading but juddery as hell when driven from the DVT. HSTs tend to be significantly better, saying that I was nearly launched across the vestibule once when leaving Doncaster, seemed that the rear power car had a bit more enthusiasm than the leading one causing one hell of a bump start and sending me flying...

 

[tsr]

373s do seem exceptionally smooth to me - having ridden them both on and off high-speed lines on a number of separate occasions. This is, however, just my opinion. In fact, they are so smooth that on one occasion, after a heavy lunch, I was violently ill onboard - something to do with the "gliding" effect

I suppose there is no harm in reporting any particularly rough patches of track to NR (these days, their procedures should be able to deal with it as necessary), but it would seem to me that if a 225 is bouncing up and down or side to side, it would be far more likely to be a train fault.

 

[wensley]

Colton North is bad on the fast lines, I also agree that Tollerton is a bit rough, but as with Longlands, Tollerton is really bad if you are crossing from Down Fast to Down Slow, or at Longlands from Down Slow to Down Fast! Always amuses me on a full and standing 185

 

[DarloRich]

I'm interested in the ride quality or lack of on the ECML northbound and possible reasons?

I was on an IC225 from Kings Cross on Monday afternoon and the train bounced and rocked and rolled pretty much most of the way north bound towards Newcastle.

I've just been over to Lille, Northern France on Eurostar, TGV to Arras and IC train sets to Bruges, the rides were a much smoother ride than on the ECML.

Is the poor ride on the ECML due to :-
Track quality
Maintenance
Classic line
Suspension on trains
Age of trains

I'd be interested to hear peoples views.

Thanks

not sure if you have noticed but it has rained quite bit in the North East/Yorkshire recently. Lots of the track bed has been underwater or waterlogged. That is going to affect the formation and disturb the ride quality.

And you can keep your IEP thanks. I will take the "uncomfortable" HST & 91/MKIV combo any day.

I personally have few issue with the ride quality on the ECML. Temple Hirst used to be quite bad, especially north to south it seemed in a 180, but it seems fine now.

 

[Wyvern]

This what thr RMT were trying to say, except they cocked it upc ompletely.

RMT understands that there is massive pressure to keep the ECML running from the government and the department of transport as they look to re-privatise the service. . . . . .. . .drivers reporting that they have concerns about rough riding and bangs underneath trains . . . .

This shocking picture highlights the reality on Britain's railways today, staffing and inspections have been cuts in the dash to save money and there is massive pressure right from the top of Government to keep services running at all costs regardless of the potential human cost.

They brought in a totally irrelevant broken rail. I really hate to see an important organisation like the RMT expose itself to ridicule.

http://www.railforums.co.uk/showthread.php?t=75646

 

[A-driver]

I personally feel that they need to change how rough riding is reported. If you report a rough ride then things tend to go into melt down - job stopped, trains cautioned at 5mph, huge delays and if no problem is found (or if it turns out to be the unit etc) then I find the driver ends up feeling pretty stupid. This can put off reporting rough rides, especially for newer less experienced drivers who feel they may be criticised for causing un-needed disruption.

I have often felt it would be better if you could report possible rough riding and ask for the train behind to run over at normal running speed and get a 2nd opinion like we do with controlled test stops with low adhesion.

Generally network rail dont like reports of rough rides as tey end up paying for the delays etc.

 

[Eurostar373]

not sure if you have noticed but it has rained quite bit in the North East/Yorkshire recently. Lots of the track bed has been underwater or waterlogged. That is going to affect the formation and disturb the ride quality.

And you can keep your IEP thanks. I will take the "uncomfortable" HST & 91/MKIV combo any day.

I personally have few issue with the ride quality on the ECML. Temple Hirst used to be quite bad, especially north to south it seemed in a 180, but it seems fine now.

Yeh I took a ride from Ncl to Kx on Thur 29 Nov and noticed the tracks seemed to be surrounded by water north of Darlo :roll: Tbh that was a pretty good ride down and was impressed we were only 20 mins late into KX, great job by EC and Networkrail.

The worst journey north bound was 29th October, before the recent heavy rains and the area around Northallerton was terrible.

As for IEP will keep an open mind until I take a ride on one, the 125's had their days in the 80/90's time to move on now.

I'd rather we had the 373's still running on the ECML, the ride on those trains is just so smooth on the CTRL.