Revenue Protection at Brighton

[Hadders]

Either don't bother with First Class at all, or don't declassify at all.
Personally, I favour the second option (along with reasonably priced tickets).

There's a history lesson in why the rear 1st class compartment is permanently declassified.

The 8-car class 700s had fewer standard class seats than the 8-car class 365s they replaced (fewer seats so more people could stand!)
But they had more 1st class seats! So the solution, to save bad publicity, was to declassify the rear 1st class compartment.

12-car 700s were not really an issue because there weren't many 12-car trains pre-class 700 introduction (12 car services only really operated in the peaks) but it was much more simple to declassify the rear compartment on all class 700 trains.

 

[rocrat]

Either don't bother with First Class at all, or don't declassify at all.
Personally, I favour the second option (along with reasonably priced tickets).

Provide plug sockets and tables in standard, and then this is reasonable.

No way I'd be using TL CBG-BTN (or at least to GTW) if they didn't have declassified 1st.

Not a chance in hell I'd pay 5x the price for a plug and table...

 

[Jan Mayen]

Not a chance in hell I'd pay 5x the price for a plug and table...

Agreed. While I would pay more for 1st Class, how much more would depend on what's offered.
The current Thameslink offering isn't worth much more. Maybe an extra 25%? Certainly not Five times the Standard fare.
However, this is probably for a separate thread!

 

[bubieyehyeh]

I wonder if the PIS would change with a reversal. Could it mean the message now shows at the front until it reaches the destination and when the new code is entered for the next journey?

I was in the declassifed 1st class rear section of a thamelink the other day, where the PIS though it was the first carriage, also the carriage loading screen wasn't showing other carriages, and it didn't have the declassified screen in the sequence.

 

[infobleep]

There's a history lesson in why the rear 1st class compartment is permanently declassified.

The 8-car class 700s had fewer standard class seats than the 8-car class 365s they replaced (fewer seats so more people could stand!)
But they had more 1st class seats! So the solution, to save bad publicity, was to declassify the rear 1st class compartment.

12-car 700s were not really an issue because there weren't many 12-car trains pre-class 700 introduction (12 car services only really operated in the peaks) but it was much more simple to declassify the rear compartment on all class 700 trains.

And yet they declassified the front compartment on some trains. Is that simple?

 

[Hadders]

And yet they declassified the front compartment on some trains. Is that simple?

This is nothing to do with the class 700 trains.

There have always been services that do not convey 1st class accommodation (eg Sutton loop services) and it is these services that have the front declassified as well.

 

[infobleep]

This is nothing to do with the class 700 trains.

There have always been services that do not convey 1st class accommodation (eg Sutton loop services) and it is these services that have the front declassified as well.

I know that is the case but you have trains with declassified first class at the front that look the same as others with first class at the front and they can depart from the same station with first class branding.

If one jumped on a train that was running late, they might incorrectly think they are on a train where the first class is declassified at the front. But this is way off what is happening at Brighton station.

 

[LCRTrainfan979]

Either don't bother with First Class at all, or don't declassify at all.
Personally, I favour the second option (along with reasonably priced tickets).

To be fair out of all trains, I would agree with you, because unlike many other first class seats across the Southeast, Thameslink actually put effort into making First Class better than standard class, where you get a nice table, plug sockets and an actually acceptable seat. So that is a case where paying a premium would offer some value for money, provided its not 5x more expensive
Compare that to Southern or GX where you get a cloth at the back of your seat, generally a smaller area, and maybe a door to separate you from the rest of the train (which isnt guaranteed, because the 377/1s dont seem to have it). I should also add that on class 377/3s, the full length tables are exclusive to first class, but many routes they are operate are declassified routes anyway (like suburban london service, or shorter distance coastway service like Bognor shuttles or Seaford services.
In general, there would be better case to declassify some first class on Southern, say if the first class compartment falls next to a gangway when that is in use, and people have to cross through it, particularly when the train divides.
However, an infinitely better idea would be to follow in the footsteps of southeastern and just scrap first class altogether.