Retro Railtours

[Jordy]

Coaches with aircon that therefore have no opening windows in the main saloon.

 

[theblackwatch]

What if the promoter doesn.t know what stock their operator/TOC will give them? West Coast can - and do - kick anything out on tours sometimes. The Retro tour last August was a prime example, 7 or 8 aircons in the set. Spitfire have also had several aircons, mainly FC, in the sets WCRC have supplied. I remember one coach in a Pathfinder 20 tour being an aircon too.

 

[33011]

I think this debate on whether aircons should be used on railtours all depends on what market the tour operator is aiming for.If they are just after cranks then the majority of cranks wouldn't want aircons but with that said most would still do the tour rather than missing out on their preferred traction.If they are aiming for normals who just want a decent day out then aircons shouldn't be a problem providing they are working correctly.Now again with that said some normals may want nostalgia and prefer older stock.The railtour market is a fickle one and no matter what tour operators do you will always find somebody that is not satisfied for what ever reason as sadly not everyone shares the same opinion.

 

[43034 The Black Horse]

Im not overly fussed whether it's Aircon or not, I just want it to work so it isn't a coffin car!

 

[1D53]

What if the promoter doesn.t know what stock their operator/TOC will give them? West Coast can - and do - kick anything out on tours sometimes. The Retro tour last August was a prime example, 7 or 8 aircons in the set. Spitfire have also had several aircons, mainly FC, in the sets WCRC have supplied. I remember one coach in a Pathfinder 20 tour being an aircon too.

West Coast seem to do this a lot. On the Flamboyant Tour last year it was meant to be Load 10 all standard Mk1's, a couple of days before it was changed to the Scarborough Spa rake, a load 13 with some firsts thrown in, still mk1 though.

 

[Techniquest]

Where is this curve? I can't picture it myself.

It's near Miles Platting. Coming from Ashton under Lyne, you get to Miles Platting Junction and curve off to the right and join the Oldham Loop at Brewery Sidings.

Those with a copy of the Baker atlas can find this curve on page 58, on the B1 section of that page. It's not a long curve by any means (1/3rd of a mile at the most I'd say), but I have to admit I'm surprised I didn't know about it before!

Hope this helps!

 

[alex57601]

Wasn't aware you'd done a customer survey, didn't see you in the front coach all day, certainly didn't ask me. Would have been nice to be introduced

I've no problems with aircons if its advertised - then its a choice to make - you expect coffins with Compass but most were expecting WCRC to operate the grid tour, we are obviously not all as informed as you are.

Ps, you still haven't said how WCRC were able to operate PV stock along the coast last year. I was sitting in it. Also, why we are not allowed to express opinions because "but it winds me up how some people talk as though they can do a better job, and often unappreciative of the efforts that some people go to to organise these trips." yet I haven't seen 57601Railtour Ltd operating a train yet any more than 87015Railtours. So how are you any better saying you prefer aircons and not listening to other arguments?

I did no customer surveys at all, and I did pass through your end a few times checking tickets, so I may have seen you but not recognised you - apologies.

My point was that not one passenger came up to me on the day and raised the issue of using air-cons. Whether James or the other stewards received feedback on this (i.e. through official lines of communication and not on forums) I don't know, but because nobody raised this issue with me and, to the best of my knowledge nobody else, I can only assume that the use of air-cons was no problem.

How WCRC got about it I don't know, must've got a one-off derogation providing certain things were done I assume, but it doesn't mean that everyone will be able to do it as the rule is PV stock are banned between Maryport and Carlisle.

And I didn't say nobody was allowed to express opinions, it is completely opposite. The point I was getting at was that if people care enough about a certain matter they should take it up directly rather than post on internet forums, and by the way how some people put their opinions across they sound as though they're the armchair expert sort. You wouldn't like me telling you how to run your business, so the same applies here.

The crucial point here is that the ONLY thing I am asking is that operators state whether they will use aircons or not. As long as it's advertised, I don't care if they do, because that will make it much easier to avoid, and much easier not to get involved in discussions with cretins like 'the voice of reason' (ha!) Alex who seems utterly incapable of understanding that a simple thing like informing on websites what stock will be used . will cause no hassle and be free.

Who are these thickos who can't understand this? Again I say, if aircons are so great, why not shout from the rooftops about it? A quick scan of the internet for people who style themselves as 'the voice of reason' reveals a load of nutters ranging from self-important little Hitlers to full blown fascists who believe their views should apply to everyone.

How rich!

But seriously, perhaps if you stopped peddling the same anti-air-con debate every time you find out a tour is booked to run with a rake of air-cons and being told the same reasons every time, then there will be no need to be having this debate. Most people only need this explaining once or twice and they're fine with it. You, on the other hand, seem to dismiss this and demand that promoters should advertise this as such without realising that things can, and do, change for what ever reason.

Time to put up or shut up methinks. It's getting boring now.

And with your last sentence, if you're suggesting that I am a fascist I find this very offensive and derogative.

The railtour market is a fickle one and no matter what tour operators do you will always find somebody that is not satisfied for what ever reason as sadly not everyone shares the same opinion.

That's it in a nutshell. Promoters do want to satisfy all of its passengers and work towards doing so, but as it is very often not possible to do so, they will work towards satisfying the majority and keep the peace. And the amount of people who I saw on the last tour would seem to suggest that they are happy to have air-cons rather than miss out as you say, and as I said earlier, I received no complaints about the use, so it strengthens the arguments.

Air-cons and PV stock all have their faults. Air-cons main weakness is if the air-con breaks down on a hot summer day, and PV stock if the heating breaks in the winter or if it's draughty. Simple fact of life.

West Coast seem to do this a lot. On the Flamboyant Tour last year it was meant to be Load 10 all standard Mk1's, a couple of days before it was changed to the Scarborough Spa rake, a load 13 with some firsts thrown in, still mk1 though.

I know of a few instances where Manchester Pullman FOs have been provided vice Mk1 FOs, which is a real headache as there are 6 less seats in a Manchester Pullman FO compared to a Mk1/Mk2 FO.

 

[Moodster020]

What are aircons?

Sealed up coaches, so you cant see or hear owt.

 

[Chester025]

Sealed up coaches, so you cant see or hear owt.

See???

20s dragging a Pendo around the Cumbrian Coast?

 

[alex57601]

See???

20s dragging a Pendo around the Cumbrian Coast?

Only if you sit next to a pillar.