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Reserved seat in non platformed carriage

norbitonflyer

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Currently in the last car of a 10 car IEP. The seat opposite me were reserved from St Erth to St Austell - two stations at which only the first six carriages are on the platform.
Shouldnt the seat reservation system take account of short platforms?
 
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misar

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Not unless the train had an unlikely formation preventing access between the platform and seat at either end of the jourey.
 

43096

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Currently in the last car of a 10 car IEP. The seat opposite me were reserved from St Erth to St Austell - two stations at which only the first six carriages are on the platform.
Shouldnt the seat reservation system take account of short platforms?
That's why trains have gangways...
 

Russel

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Currently in the last car of a 10 car IEP. The seat opposite me were reserved from St Erth to St Austell - two stations at which only the first six carriages are on the platform.
Shouldnt the seat reservation system take account of short platforms?

Why?
 

TheLastMinute

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Shouldnt the seat reservation system take account of short platforms?
Even if it did, there's no guarantee that the unit will be the right way round on the day. So if it did put all the passengers for a short station in Coach A, but Coach L was lead, all the seat reservations would be at the wrong end rather than just a percentage.
That's why trains have gangways...
Not between two 5-car IETs coupled together there isn't. OK, in the OP's case that isn't relevant but there are a number of GWR stations served by IETs that are less than 5 coaches long.
 

Russel

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Because carrying heavy luggage through four coaches of a crowded train, twice, isn't a terribly enjoyable experience?

There is no guarantee the unit will be facing the right way to ensure this doesn't happen even if something is put in place...

Besides, even if a system was put in place to prevent it, people tend to crowd the same small section of platform and get on the train at the closest door and walk through the train to their reserved seat anyway.

Not saying I don't agree with the point raised by the OP, just that in reality it's not really a big issue and the number of people actually effected is going to be minimal, there are much bigger fish to fry.
 

renegademaster

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if (destination.platformLength <train.length -3) reservation.coach = "D";

I hope I receive the royalties from the LNER IT department promptly
 

D1537

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On 2 x Class 185 TPE services that serve short platforms, they only reserve seats in one unit (coaches A/B/C) and this is always the leading unit (which is the one that is always platformed). This is done by swapping the coach letter window stickers around when it reverses. You can't fail with analogue technology!
 

Parallel

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You might get people using split tickets too, which usually reserve the same seats throughout the journey. The reservation destination shown is not always the end destination for the passenger.
 

yorkie

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Currently in the last car of a 10 car IEP. The seat opposite me were reserved from St Erth to St Austell - two stations at which only the first six carriages are on the platform.
Shouldnt the seat reservation system take account of short platforms?
No; it's not really practical to do that.

However, for any savvy/experienced passengers who have a preference regarding their seats, the forum's ticketing site has a seat selector!
 

Russel

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Because a passenger might fairly reasonably expect to be able to leave the train at their destination.

I've never been on a train where a carriage that isn't going to fit on the platform hasn't had numerous audio and visual announcements stating just that.
 

Adoarable

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This thread has reminded me of a journey my wife and I made from Paddington to St Ives a few years ago.

We had reservations on the IET from Paddington to St Erth in coach J. It was supposed to be a 2x5-car train but there was some disruption on the day and it was replaced by a 9-car train.

Because of the disruption the train was also delayed, and arrived at Paddington 10 minutes after it should have left, by which time there were hundreds of people waiting to board it.

We walked to coach J, and a lot of people boarded before us at our door, which was the rearmost standard-class door of the reformed train. It was only once we were on board that we discovered that all the reservations had been cancelled, every seat was taken, and the aisle was crammed.

After many hours standing, and then sitting separately, we made it to St Erth. Coach J is not platformed so we had to move through the train just to alight at the rearmost platformed door.

The footbridge is at the other end of the platform so we were at the very back of the queue to slowly make our way to the bay platform for the shuttle service to St Ives. We saw the shuttle leaving from the footbridge and had to wait another half an hour.

Our delay repay request was denied on the grounds that the minimum connection time between the two services was met. (We appealed successfully.)

All of that is to say, yes it would be passenger-friendly for seat reservations to be assigned with some consideration of the relevant platform lengths.
 

Snow1964

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All of that is to say, yes it would be passenger-friendly for seat reservations to be assigned with some consideration of the relevant platform lengths.
I have had seat reservations on GWR where your assigned carriage is not one that fits in platform at boarding station.

Now if other seats were all reserved I could understand it, but had to walk through two carriages with negligible reservations.

However, for any savvy/experienced passengers who have a preference regarding their seats, the forum's ticketing site has a seat selector!
Thats ok for regulars, but not very useful if trying and encourage new customers to use the railway or try visiting somewhere new.
Manually selecting a seat to override a sub-optimal seat allocation that a not very well thought through system allocation would do, shouldn't really be necessary

That's why trains have gangways...
Yes, but what's the point of zonal marks on platforms, if you expect passengers to board in different coach to where seats are. Should not be trying to increase aisle congestion.

Its all smacks of not putting customer first, no attention to detail, just doing something easy instead and ignoring the side effects
 

Falcon1200

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All of that is to say, yes it would be passenger-friendly for seat reservations to be assigned with some consideration of the relevant platform lengths.

A most unpleasant journey for you, glad you were compensated. I had a similar experience in 2023, the day after Glastonbury finished - Not a good time to be travelling on GWR.

The seat reservation/short platform issue however could only be resolved if every set was always the right way round, which cannot be guaranteed.
 

voyagerdude220

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Avanti do specifically disable reservations at Haymarket for the rear 2 carriages of their trains at Haymarket incase it's an 11car train with the rear 2 unable to be reserved to/from Haymarket (coaches J and K towards Edinburgh/ B and A towards Preston.)
 

D1537

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Avanti do specifically disable reservations at Haymarket for the rear 2 carriages of their trains at Haymarket incase it's an 11car train with the rear 2 unable to be reserved to/from Haymarket (coaches J and K towards Edinburgh/ B and A towards Preston.)
How do first class passengers reserve a seat on trains where J and K (or even just K) are the only FC carriages?
 

voyagerdude220

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How do first class passengers reserve a seat on trains where J and K (or even just K) are the only FC carriages?
They can't.
Similarly you can't reserve bike spaces on Southbound Avanti trains from Haymarket.
 

norbitonflyer

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Even if it did, there's no guarantee that the unit will be the right way round on the day. So if it did put all the passengers for a short station in Coach A, but Coach L was lead, all the seat reservations would be at the wrong end rather than just a percentage.

Not between two 5-car IETs coupled together there isn't. OK, in the OP's case that isn't relevant but there are a number of GWR stations served by IETs that are less than 5 coaches long.
There did seem to be some confusion in the system, as the screens at Penzance showed coach A to be the sixth coach when in fact it was the rear one (ie the rear unit was the opposite way round to what the departure screen at Penzance showed)
Yes, all the stations we called at could take at least six carriages - are there any on the Cornish main line thatb are shorter than that? - and the train was not at all crowded.
On 2 x Class 185 TPE services that serve short platforms, they only reserve seats in one unit (coaches A/B/C) and this is always the leading unit (which is the one that is always platformed). This is done by swapping the coach letter window stickers around when it reverses. You can't fail with analogue technology!

Wouldn't have worked in this case, as the first class would have been at the wrong end (that is, redesignating the sixth coach as Coach A would have put all the standard class reservations in 1st Class
I've never been on a train where a carriage that isn't going to fit on the platform hasn't had numerous audio and visual announcements stating just that.
Oh, it did, the guard blaming a "design flaw" for the need to wait until a station if you found yourself in the wrong half of the train.
Because carrying heavy luggage through four coaches of a crowded train, twice, isn't a terribly enjoyable experience?
Quite. Or the person could have impaired mobility.

In fact the reservations between St Erth and St Austell were never used - we had the table to ourselves for the entire journey .

)
 

Fokx

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On 2 x Class 185 TPE services that serve short platforms, they only reserve seats in one unit (coaches A/B/C) and this is always the leading unit (which is the one that is always platformed). This is done by swapping the coach letter window stickers around when it reverses. You can't fail with analogue technology!
Until there's a platform reversal :lol:
 

Starmill

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I've never been on a train where a carriage that isn't going to fit on the platform hasn't had numerous audio and visual announcements stating just that.
Sounds like you haven't been on very many trains with a short platform to me. This happens all the time. For example on 185s the SDO information says that you need to be in the front five coaches at Wakefield Kirkgate platform 3, but it's actually the front four coaches only that open. Or on Northern its very common that you don't get that information at all until it's too late to move forward, or more likely the information system is switched off completely.
 

D1537

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Until there's a platform reversal :lol:
Yes, I'm not sure how it works exactly if there's a reversal in the middle of the journey, but I think that only happens during engineering work (i.e. trains that call at Leeds and go via Castleford).
 

Starmill

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ie the rear unit was the opposite way round to what the departure screen at Penzance showed
This happens all the time on GWR. I wouldn't take what their screens say the coach formation is as true.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: ==

Yes, all the stations we called at could take at least six carriages - are there any on the Cornish main line thatb are shorter than that? - and the train was not at all crowded.
Saltash, St Germans, Lostwithiel, there are probably quite a few.
 

D6975

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I've never been on a train where a carriage that isn't going to fit on the platform hasn't had numerous audio and visual announcements stating just that.
I have, several times. I have been in a 6 car 185 where the rear unit has had no announcements whatsoever more than once.
 

D1537

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I have, several times. I have been in a 6 car 185 where the rear unit has had no announcements whatsoever more than once.
Ditto, although in my experience (mostly on the Redcar-Manchester axis) announcements about short platforms have always been made at the stations before boarding. Of course, at large busy stations such announcements may be lost in the fog, so to speak.
 

John Hardee

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This happens all the time on GWR. I wouldn't take what their screens say the coach formation is as true.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: ==


Saltash, St Germans, Lostwithiel, there are probably quite a few.

You have Hayle and Menheniot (along with Platform 3 at Par) as well in Cornwall

Also, Saltash in the UP direction towards Plymouth is only Front 2 due to the position of the Signal.
 

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