Request stop justice?

[Flamingo]

Were you a guard under BR at all? If so, was it any different back then? Was there more respect shown generally?

It's all very depressing, but it is the state of the nation today annoyingly, no-one cares about anyone but themselves now and knows the cost of everything but the value of nothing. :cry:

No, I'm newer than that, but according to the old and bold, it has changed & not for the better...

 

[Solent&Wessex]

Just a rhetorical question really, but any insights welcome - what would the TOC Customer Services do if fare paying & byelaw complying passengers complained about guards letting the people you describe 'get away' with this behaviour on the grounds that this was making their journey uncomfortable, i.e. they (the TOC) are neither providing the legitimate passenger with 'customer service' nor 'putting (legitimate) customers first' ? I wonder if there is a chance that if enough people threaten to (or actually do) stop using the trains because of such encounters the TOC would change their policy.

Strange you mention this, as this issue has reared it's head recently at my TOC. As I understand it, First Class passengers were complaining that a) The guard wasn't checking tickets in FC as often as they should and some folk were quite obviously Standard passengers without FC tickets, b) FC was being de-classified whether needed or not, c) When or if the guard did come down they were simply asking people to move, irrespective of how long they had been sat there. At the same time Standard passengers were complaining about lack of space, no seats, First Class being too rigorously enforced etc etc etc.

The response was to come up with a scheme where the Guard would personally invite SC passengers to sit in FC seats, but not announce it as declassified and not make a fuss about it. Thus keeping SC passengers happy, and similarly not having to pay out refunds to FC passengers (as FC was never technically declassified, the SC passengers were there at the Guards discretion).

Surprisingly it didn't work too well as in most cases the SC passengers just invite themselves in anyway before the Guard gets there.

Seperately, I must say that I am starting to adopt the attitude of Flamingo and co. I used to be particularly keen, but was basically told by management "look we know you are right and correct, and the ticket wasn't valid, but people have been complaining and the complaints figures for the company [mostly about overcrowding I suspect but that is expensive to fix] are too high, so if you think someone is going to complain, just let it be".

 

[AndyLandy]

Seperately, I must say that I am starting to adopt the attitude of Flamingo and co. I used to be particularly keen, but was basically told by management "look we know you are right and correct, and the ticket wasn't valid, but people have been complaining and the complaints figures for the company [mostly about overcrowding I suspect but that is expensive to fix] are too high, so if you think someone is going to complain, just let it be".

My concern with that is what happens when it starts to become known that if you kick up enough fuss, you'll get away with it? Where is the incentive to buy travel tickets, if you can just make a fuss and threaten to complain and get away with a free ride?

For sure, many of us wouldn't dream of travelling without a valid ticket, but there's always the issue of "keeping honest people honest"

 

[Buttsy]

My concern with that is what happens when it starts to become known that if you kick up enough fuss, you'll get away with it? Where is the incentive to buy travel tickets, if you can just make a fuss and threaten to complain and get away with a free ride?

For sure, many of us wouldn't dream of travelling without a valid ticket, but there's always the issue of "keeping honest people honest"

One hopes that it never gets to that stage, but if enough people start doing it, TOCs seeing a fall in revenue will actually consider helping out the guard/conductor and provide some form of security staff where the problems are most prevalent.

There is always the thing of getting TOCs to actually back up guards when complaints are recieved from those who have not paid for a ticket when they were able to before boarding the train and actually tell these people 'where to go'...

 

[Solent&Wessex]

My concern with that is what happens when it starts to become known that if you kick up enough fuss, you'll get away with it? Where is the incentive to buy travel tickets, if you can just make a fuss and threaten to complain and get away with a free ride?

For sure, many of us wouldn't dream of travelling without a valid ticket, but there's always the issue of "keeping honest people honest"

One hopes that it never gets to that stage, but if enough people start doing it, TOCs seeing a fall in revenue will actually consider helping out the guard/conductor and provide some form of security staff where the problems are most prevalent.

There is always the thing of getting TOCs to actually back up guards when complaints are recieved from those who have not paid for a ticket when they were able to before boarding the train and actually tell these people 'where to go'...

I have to say that my comments relate mainly to people with invalid tickets, rather than no tickets at all. Support in that area is better (as long as you don't delay a train by more than 3 minutes). It is the people with Advance tickets on the wrong train / no railcards / invalid split tickets etc who take exception to having to pay more that complain.

I chucked a bloke off at a stop once and he said he was going to complain and see I got sacked, as it wasn't his fault he had no money and he had to get home. I asked him to please complain, as then we would have his name and address to report him to court for fare evasion. Surprisingly I never heard a thing about it.