Reports that HS2 Euston terminus may be delayed/cancelled

[d70g]

HS2 shambles as it’s revealed £60billion high speed rail project may not go to central LONDON

HS2 bosses are weighing up a scaling back of the project — including delaying its Euston terminus to 2038 or scrapping it altogether.

Last week, the Department for Transport warned of “tough decisions” for the scheme in the coming weeks.

One ex-HS2 employee said: “There are a number of options for getting the costs down and none of them are very nice.

“Either you scrap Euston, or you have to slow down the whole project and hope inflation comes down.”

BBC News have picked this up - Chris Mason states govt not denying the story. The journalist has strong links to government sources (despite the reputation of his employers) - does this make any sense, what with the current financial climate?

 

[MadCommuter]

Changing at Old Oak is going to make using the line, far less appealing. In reality, passengers will nearly always need some kind of onward connection from Euston, but ideally, the maximum amount of journey miles should be completed at high speed on a single train. Adding barriers to the journey, will reduce its attractiveness.

 

[Sad Sprinter]

BBC news reporting an article in the Sun tomorrow that HS2 will now terminate at Old Oak Common.

I predict this thread will be split into a "What other ways can HS2 serve London" thread in Speculative Ideas

 

[800001]

The Sun! Wouldn’t believe a word that rag writes plus they quote Andrew Gilligan who has briefed against it ever since the concept came up.

Far too much work ongoing around Euston and towards Old Oak for them to pull plug.

 

[JonathanH]

BBC news reporting an article in the Sun tomorrow that HS2 will now terminate at Old Oak Common.

Is it reporting what will be done with the large hole in the ground next to Euston station?

 

[TheManOnThe172]

Why stop the descoping process after one ludicrous change? They could save even more by making it single track.

 

[LOL The Irony]

BBC news reporting an article in the Sun tomorrow that HS2 will now terminate at Old Oak Common.

An article in the sun? OK then...

 

[JonathanH]

Far too much work ongoing around Euston and towards Old Oak for them to pull plug.

Doesn't that depend on what the cost of putting down tools, paying off the contracts and making the site safe is relative to completing the work?

If the former is cheaper than the latter it is still possible. Probably not at the point of no return yet, particularly with an empty piggy bank.

Report on the radio just sounds like options are being considered as to how to descope or delay the project by pushing elements back in the light of inflationary pressures on the budget.

 

[d70g]

To be fair, any decision of this type would still achieve the main aim of HS2 - increasing capacity on the southern half of the WCML (I'm also a little dubious of the source, by the way). But hardly condusive to passenger patronage.

 

[MadCommuter]

This harks back to the early days of Eurostar 'whizzing through France and the tunnel' to then crawl through Kent.

 

[Facing Back]

That last few miles of track and the station is so expensive I can see why it would be a target to the bean counters. I really really hope that this doesn't happen and we end up spending squillions building a line to the suburbs - it would be such a shame.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 26 Jan 2023 ==

This harks back to the early days of Eurostar 'whizzing through France and the tunnel' to then crawl through Kent.

Indeed. We eventually got HS1 but it took a lot of time and effort.

As a londoner for 20 years who moved back to his northern roots, I was saddened when the link between HS2 and HS1 was shelved. I had visions of getting on a train in Manchester and getting of in Amsterdam. Shelved for good reasons but I'm still going to be flying rather than changing trains. As a big fan of HS2 I live in fear of further and continual descoping.

 

[the sniper]

I predict this thread will be split into a "What other ways can HS2 serve London" thread in Speculative Ideas

Could they end up taking the Heathrow Express paths to get them into Paddington instead...?

 

[JonathanH]

That last few miles of track and the station is so expensive I can see why it would be a target to the bean counters. I really really hope that this doesn't happen and we end up spending squillions building a line to the suburbs - it would be such a shame.

It sounds like some part of the project needs to be cancelled to make good a hole in the budget, caused by inflation.

Euston is an easy target because everything else on the initial phase needs to be delivered from the start. Euston already happens later, so might be finished in 2038, rather than 2033, for example. It then becomes a question as to whether building bits of HS2 north of where Phase 1 finishes is more important than building Euston.

 

[pokemonsuper9]

BBC news reporting an article in the Sun tomorrow that HS2 will now terminate at Old Oak Common.

I mean wasn't it intended to terminate there in the short-term until Euston is ready?

 

[zwk500]

We've been cross threaded!

Reports that HS2 Euston terminus may be delayed/cancelled

HS2 shambles as it’s revealed £60billion high speed rail project may not go to central LONDON HS2 bosses are weighing up a scaling back of the project — including delaying its Euston terminus to 2038 or scrapping it altogether. Last week, the Department for Transport warned of “tough...

www.railforums.co.uk

 

[MadCommuter]

I'm sure this isn't possible, but no way that Paddington couldn't take some HS2 trains? I'm sure it's full to capacity, but do we need the new proposed open access paths?

 

[Facing Back]

It sounds like some part of the project needs to be cancelled to make good a hole in the budget, caused by inflation.

Euston is an easy target because everything else on the initial phase needs to be delivered from the start. Euston already happens later, so might be finished in 2038, rather than 2033, for example. It then becomes a question as to whether building bits of HS2 north of where Phase 1 finishes is more important than building Euston.

Perhaps it is too early to tell whether parts "need" be cancelled but I agree financial pressure is enormous.

I also agree that the Euston link is discreet. I'm just not ready to give up on chunks of the scope as yet

 

[Jimini]

Tomorrow's front page:

 

[zwk500]

I'm sure this isn't possible, but no way that Paddington couldn't take some HS2 trains? I'm sure it's full to capacity, but do we need the new proposed open access paths?

There's no track from HS2 to Paddington. It would be an act of lunacy to pull Euston now considering how much has already been done.

 

[45669]

I don't suppose many users of HS2 will actually be going to Euston. They'll be going to various parts of London and southern England, and many of these destinations will still be accessible from Old Oak via the Elizabeth Line, GWR main line, etc. If they're flying off to foreign parts, they will change straight onto Heathrow Express.

So although it would be a shame if Euston is cancelled, it might not be quite such a disaster as it appears.

No doubt others will have differing views. But whatever happens, Old Oak is no longer the Old Oak that I got thrown out when trainspotting c.1958!

 

[JonathanH]

I'm just not ready to give up on chunks of the scope as yet

No, it is sad, but now inevitable, that it will end up just being a link from Old Oak Common to Birmingham due to budget cutbacks.

If it gets cut back now, I don't see the country ever being able to afford to build the rest.

A four platform station at Old Oak Common isn't going to be able to handle the same level of service that a ten platform station at Euston and a four platform station at Old Oak Common could have done.

 

[Nym]

Not content with being the laughing stock of Europe, now they want to build a line to London that doesn't go to London...

 

[Hophead]

Euston was descoped to 10 platforms, which are expected to handle around 17 trains an hour, as I understand it. I think that Old Oak Common will have 6 (certainly less than 10). So what would be the realistic maximum HS2 tph from terminating there?

 

[zwk500]

A four platform station at Old Oak Common isn't going to be able to handle the same level of service that a ten platform station at Euston and a four platform station at Old Oak Common could have done.

OOC is going to have 6 platforms for HS2, and they've already dug the hole that big...

I don't suppose many users of HS2 will actually be going to Euston. They'll be going to various parts of London and southern England, and many of these destinations will still be accessible from Old Oak via the Elizabeth Line, GWR main line, etc. If they're flying off to foreign parts, they will change straight onto Heathrow Express.

So although it would be a shame if Euston is cancelled, it might not be quite such a disaster as it appears.

If you're going to various parts of Southern England then continuing to Euston and either getting the Victoria line or Thameslink is going to be more attractive than changing onto Crossrail and changing again. Especially if they tart up Phoenix way.

 

[ScotGG]

Hard to see this country in anything other than (badly) managed decline.

 

[SynthD]

Ridiculous, wishful, gleefully doomladen reports, but not likely. I don’t think this government would do something so visible to a project the public are aware of.

 

[the sniper]

There's no track from HS2 to Paddington.

There's no tunnel from Old Oak Common to Euston yet, either!

 

[Facing Back]

Not content with being the laughing stock of Europe, now they want to build a line to London that doesn't go to London...

I don't believe it will happen!

 

[zwk500]

There's no tunnel from Old Oak Common to Euston yet, either!

No, but there is at least a set of engineering drawings for it.

 

[Facing Back]

I don't suppose many users of HS2 will actually be going to Euston. They'll be going to various parts of London and southern England, and many of these destinations will still be accessible from Old Oak via the Elizabeth Line, GWR main line, etc. If they're flying off to foreign parts, they will change straight onto Heathrow Express.

So although it would be a shame if Euston is cancelled, it might not be quite such a disaster as it appears.

No doubt others will have differing views. But whatever happens, Old Oak is no longer the Old Oak that I got thrown out when trainspotting c.1958!

I will absolutely be going Euston.