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Relocation of Stranraer

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brad465

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If Scotland can justify Reston, it could justify this.
If they can justify Reston, they can justify reopening the entire Port Road route from Dumfries to Stranaer directly. Looking at Reston on a map the locals in Wellington, Cullompton and several other station campaigns must be wondering "why can't we get the Scottish authorities invovled?"
 
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HSTEd

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.....plus lighting, drainage, disabled access, etc.
Well if its a simple platform you can just have a ramp for both normal and disabled access.

There is also already a suitable power supply because the platform will be adjacent to the preexisting streetlights heading towards the existing station. With a short platform (local door operation) you probably only need a single streetlamp to meet the illumination requirement.

As for drainage, given where it is it seems unlikely to flood, given its only a few metres from the sea, and if the sea floods it the line is likely closed anyway!

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: ==

If they can justify Reston, they can justify reopening the entire Port Road route from Dumfries to Stranaer directly. Looking at Reston on a map the locals in Wellington, Cullompton and several other station campaigns must be wondering "why can't we get the Scottish authorities invovled?"
Well the cynical answer is that Reston was built to use it as a customs checkpoint after Scottish Independence.
 
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Meerkat

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What is the current station and approach line built on - is it likely to fall apart any time soon and force a decision?
Havent charter operators caused a fuss before about any rationalisation— do they have regulatory ability to block such things?
IMO the move Stranraer station to Girvan seems the best use of public funds.
 

D6130

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What is the current station and approach line built on - is it likely to fall apart any time soon and force a decision?
Havent charter operators caused a fuss before about any rationalisation— do they have regulatory ability to block such things?
IMO the move Stranraer station to Girvan seems the best use of public funds.
IIRC, the station is built on a wooden pier approached by rail along a stone-built causeway. I suspect that the condition of that pier will force a decision in the not-to-distant future..
 

Stathern Jc

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An interesting article this morning on the BBC News Website:
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cr57yql31e9o

Provisional plans have been unveiled for the potential development of a new railway station in Stranraer.

Network Rail wants to relocate the existing platform away from a former terminal on the East Pier which saw the last ferry leave nearly 15 years ago.

Architects have produced options for two sites - both of them closer to the town centre and linked to a new mobility hub.
Also:
....... added that, having spoken to charter train operators, the distance from the station to the town was a major concern whereas a facility nearer the centre could "bring value" to the area.
This suggests an aspiration for something more than a "Sprinter Bay", which sounds hopeful for the wider use of the Stranraer Line.
Other than a graphic impression of one of the two initial proposals there aren't any clear details, other than the site being at the waterside rather than near the town centre as marked in Post No 1 above. Presumably more available on the NS Website which I haven't yet explored.
 

Bletchleyite

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An interesting article this morning on the BBC News Website:
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cr57yql31e9o


Also:

This suggests an aspiration for something more than a "Sprinter Bay", which sounds hopeful for the wider use of the Stranraer Line.
Other than a graphic impression of one of the two initial proposals there aren't any clear details, other than the site being at the waterside rather than near the town centre as marked in Post No 1 above. Presumably more available on the NS Website which I haven't yet explored.

That seems a very positive idea. Appears to have a fair bit in common with Wrexham General in terms of creating a station that looks decent even if it's basic and cheap to build. The pics do look like a simple single platform station, but it has a shelter and a usefully sized car park.

The line is never going to be a goldmine, but it also has something in common with making Fishguard actually useful?
 

Gloster

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It looks as though the options are either on the current line immediately north of the Cairnryan Road bridge on the site of the old car unloading area or a on a short bit of new line curving round westwards alongside Cairnryan Road and Port Rodie. What is the betting that the cheaper first option is preferred if anything does get done.
 

Baxenden Bank

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How much would a short platform at the landward end of the pier, a bus shelter and some painted markings for a car park cost, ultimately?
Barrow Haven (a rebuild) cost £1.3m, one replacement platform (60m).
Bow Street cost £8m, one platform, 110 space car park, bicycle storage and a bus & coach "interchange".
Portway Park and Ride cost £5.8m, one platform (126m / 5 car), accessible from existing adjacent car park.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: ==

Looking at the designs. Does it need a car park, does it need a clock tower to 'anchor it to the town'. What is the most basic facility required? A platform (lit etc) then build up from that to the money available and specification actually required not desired. Any second hand West Yorkshire ones available soon? Cottingley, fell off the back of a lorry mate!
 
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kkong

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The render on the BBC News article suggests that the proposal is based on Network Rail's "HubStation".

https://www.hub-station.com/

HubStation is a blueprint for a new model of modular, environmentally sustainable, community focused and highly adaptable transport hubs.

NextGen Community Railway Stations

Community | Eco | Modular
 

ainsworth74

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Looking at the designs. Does it need a car park, does it need a clock tower to 'anchor it to the town'. What is the most basic facility required? A platform (lit etc) then build up from that to the money available and specification actually required not desired. Any second hand West Yorkshire ones available soon? Cottingley, fell off the back of a lorry mate!
Without a car park I reckon it's doomed to failure. It's still not exactly in the town centre so making it accessible to people who want to drive to the railhead and then park seems vital to me. Otherwise you'll be leaving a lot of traffic on the table. Also not sure I'd just pooh pooh the clock tower concept. There's nothing wrong with trying to design public infrastructure to actually be appealing rather than just brutally functional. Stations are rather famous for being attractive buildings not just functional boxes. Now, obviously, cold hard reality might make such things unaffordable once it comes down to brass tacks but we might as well at least start of ambitious!
 

HSTEd

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If you just moved to the landward end of the pier there seems to be plenty of already established concrete to put a car park on.
 

zwk500

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Havent charter operators caused a fuss before about any rationalisation— do they have regulatory ability to block such things?
Depends whether they are regularly using things. However it should be reasonably easy to leave a section of track down the pier with a ground frame to allow a Charter to shunt into for a couple of hours while everybody goes for a pint/chippy/loo break or whatever.

The optimum solution would be something that allows the pier to be released for some useful activity. Potentially curving the line round sharply (the speed penalty wouldn't be too consequential) to build a station on the old blue hut (ferry check-in or customs?) just by the Port Rodie Car Park, with the pier access road coming off the roundabout to avoid a level crossing to access the pier. Bonus points if a runround line can be squeezed in on the station side as well for the odd charter to red-pen. I expect NR are looking at the waterfront location to ease the curve as much as possible - will be interesting to see how their designs consider access to the pier.

The big question is what you could do with the pier. Depending on the condition of the pier housing probably isn't sensible at that location, the town is unlikely to support a major entertainment/retail development there, but equally the existing facilities suggest there's not demand for a marina to be dug out of the former parking lane area.

(Extremely vague sketch, red = railway, yellow = road, green = car parking)
1770218732855.png
 

ainsworth74

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If you just moved to the landward end of the pier there seems to be plenty of already established concrete to put a car park on.
Well quite. I can't imagine it would cost a lot to rehab that into a functional car park. The advantages of a large car park must surely outweigh any possible costs.
 

Baxenden Bank

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Without a car park I reckon it's doomed to failure. It's still not exactly in the town centre so making it accessible to people who want to drive to the railhead and then park seems vital to me. Otherwise you'll be leaving a lot of traffic on the table. Also not sure I'd just pooh pooh the clock tower concept. There's nothing wrong with trying to design public infrastructure to actually be appealing rather than just brutally functional. Stations are rather famous for being attractive buildings not just functional boxes. Now, obviously, cold hard reality might make such things unaffordable once it comes down to brass tacks but we might as well at least start of ambitious!
I don't disagree but you should start from the basic station and add to it (with justification for each element) not start at the top and trim down.

If the site chosen is one north of Cairnryan Road, on the existing alignment (again why move the track without justification of the cost) there is Port Rodie parking 200m away (to the car park mid-point not nearest edge). A shiny new car park and bus facility would be better looking (hopefully!) and that bit closer so more convenient but is the extra cost justified for the probable small extra benefit? If there were no parking nearby now you would definitely want to provide some if at all possible.

It was as much the 'modular' concept which caught my interest. East Grinstead was rebuilt in 2012 to a new modular concept, to reduce future costs through standardised design etc. How many were actually built based on that modular design?
 

zwk500

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I don't disagree but you should start from the basic station and add to it (with justification for each element) not start at the top and trim down.

If the site chosen is one north of Cairnryan Road, on the existing alignment (again why move the track without justification of the cost) there is Port Rodie parking 200m away (to the car park mid-point not nearest edge). A shiny new car park and bus facility would be better looking (hopefully!) and that bit closer so more convenient but is the extra cost justified for the probable small extra benefit? If there were no parking nearby now you would definitely want to provide some if at all possible.
The justification of the cost would be that by moving the station closer to the rest of the town you shift the catchment area by 200m to stimulate greater use of the railway. The current line is on the edge of the town, swinging it in a bit more central is going to be worth something (the question is how much).
It was as much the 'modular' concept which caught my interest. East Grinstead was rebuilt in 2012 to a new modular concept, to reduce future costs through standardised design etc. How many were actually built based on that modular design?
Uckfield, on the next branch over, was also using that modular design I think. not sure about how many others.
 

styles

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It would save a 10 minute walk, but at quite a significant expense which I'm not really sure is justifiable. To put it another way - I don't believe it would change any rail travel habits. Those who want to go to the town and currently use the train from even the next nearest station (over an hour away) will continue to do so; those who want to go to the town and don't currently use the train will continue not to.
 

Bletchleyite

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Those who want to go to the town and currently use the train from even the next nearest station (over an hour away) will continue to do so; those who want to go to the town and don't currently use the train will continue not to.

It might be easier for those going FROM the town though, particularly if they don't want to leave their car parked somewhere with such a dodgy feel as an abandoned port or would like to walk to the station (as it's not a big town).

Stranraer is likely far more of an origin than a destination passenger-wise. Without the ferry there are few reasons to want to go there.

Not dissimilar, in a way, to how Bletchley's on the face of it slightly inconveniently located entrance isn't actually inconvenient for most as it's on the side where most people live and is mostly an origin rather than a destination. People do not take the train to Bletchley to go to the rather miserable town centre, they take the train FROM Bletchley, mostly to London.
 

zwk500

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It would save a 10 minute walk, but at quite a significant expense which I'm not really sure is justifiable. To put it another way - I don't believe it would change any rail travel habits. Those who want to go to the town and currently use the train from even the next nearest station (over an hour away) will continue to do so; those who want to go to the town and don't currently use the train will continue not to.
It's borderline, although if the charters want to use it, I think that building a new platform with runround loop and holding siding might justify the cost if it let the connection down the pier be removed entirely and railway liabilities on the pier ended.
 

styles

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It might be easier for those going FROM the town though, particularly if they don't want to leave their car parked somewhere with such a dodgy feel as an abandoned port or would like to walk to the station (as it's not a big town).

Stranraer is likely far more of an origin than a destination passenger-wise. Without the ferry there are few reasons to want to go there.

Not dissimilar, in a way, to how Bletchley's on the face of it slightly inconveniently located entrance isn't actually inconvenient for most as it's on the side where most people live and is mostly an origin rather than a destination. People do not take the train to Bletchley to go to the rather miserable town centre, they take the train FROM Bletchley, mostly to London.
Oh I agree it would be more convenient to relocate it.

I just don't believe the cost benefit analysis will ever stand up to do it.

It's not a very highly used station and it's a short walk to the station.
 

AlastairFraser

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The big question is what you could do with the pier. Depending on the condition of the pier housing probably isn't sensible at that location, the town is unlikely to support a major entertainment/retail development there, but equally the existing facilities suggest there's not demand for a marina to be dug out of the former parking lane area.
Warehouses for freight forwarders using Cairnryan? It's only 15 mins away from any part of the current port, also the land could be sold cheap to encourage development and provide local jobs.
 

D6130

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From what I have heard, the pier has had little or no maintenance since the ferries ceased to run and the wooden section at the seaward end is rapidly deteriorating. Any future plans would have to exclude the pier I would think.
 

fandroid

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The BBC are reporting that there are now plans to move Stranraer station away from the disused ferry terminal. I've only been there once, but it was after the ferries had been moved to Cairnryan. The current station looked to be a bleak inconvenient and uninviting place.


Provisional plans have been unveiled for the potential development of a new railway station in Stranraer.
Network Rail wants to relocate the existing platform away from a former terminal on the East Pier which saw the last ferry leave nearly 15 years ago.
Architects have produced options for two sites - both of them closer to the town centre and linked to a new mobility hub.
The project - which it is hoped could be delivered for under £5m - would be based on a new modular design concept to deliver a modern and visually-attractive building, and support local regeneration.
Stranraer railway station with tracks running to a grey structure over one set of tracks and a sign saying Welcome to Stranraer
Image source,Billy McCrorie
Image caption,
The community has campaigned to move the station after the ferry terminal it served closed in 2011
The current station is located on a pier at Stranraer harbour.
In 2011, the ferry terminal was relocated along the coast at Cairnryan leaving the facility "feeling remote from the town centre".
 

Peter Mugridge

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Gloster

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Perhaps a business case could be made for reinsting the rail/sea connection by doing that?

Cairnryan did have a railway from 1941 to 1959 and it might be technically possible to rebuild it at not too astronomical cost. However, the junction was just outside of Stranraer, so you would go all that way south before heading north again. Access from the north would involve leaving the Stranraer line at somewhere like Pinwherry or Barrhill and some quite impossible gradients. It is a non-starter.
 
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