Refused Ticket Collection

[greyman42]

This whole thread has put me off ever switching to Chase.

 

[bubieyehyeh]

I think that's why it doesn't work for TOD collection from a ticket machine, but op was saying that the staff in the ticket office wouldn't issue the tickets since they couldn't verify that the card was correct since it doesn't have the number on it (and uses a virtual card number)
Honestly I just wish Chase had a way to turn off the virtual card number, I'd certainly do that if I could.

You can get in the app to show the physical card for some transactions, only one I've found is using TFL.

I don't know if it's just for established customers but whenever I buy online with Southern, I can collect at the TVM with any card. So a trial workaround for the Op would be to buy a ticket (just not an Advance) on Southern with the Chase card and try to collect it. If the collection fails, then the ticket would be fully refundable under what they used to call their Rainy Day Guarantee, and the Op could just purchase their intended ticket from the TVM, paying quite happily with their Chase card.

I bought some paper tickets at a southern ticket machine contactlessly last weekend on my chase card (not ToD)

Some businesses will insist on it being printed on the card. Just printing the last 4 is not a security risk, they're on all receipts anyway.

I suspect by not printing anything they save money, as they only need to encode the cards, not print things on them.

I'm sorry, but I'd not use Chase because of this. Other banks do virtual cards better.

I think Chase do it, to save having to replace the physical card, if the virtual card details are snatched/captured/leaked. I assume in that case they will change the virtual card details in the app.

 

[Llanigraham]

My NatWest debit card does, recently issued. The change was that the 'long number' is now on the 'back' of the card. It is supposed to be more secure.

My Starling Bank card is the same.

 

[mangyiscute]

This whole thread has put me off ever switching to Chase.

I will say besides the issue with collecting tickets I've found them great to use, the cashback is obviously nice to have and the app is good too - as long as you just have another bank account to purchase train tickets that need to be collected from you won't have any issues.

 

[Bletchleyite]

I will say besides the issue with collecting tickets I've found them great to use, the cashback is obviously nice to have and the app is good too - as long as you just have another bank account to purchase train tickets that need to be collected from you won't have any issues.

A credit card may be easier. Even if you don't use it often and never borrow on it, having one is prudent, as it allows you to carry on your life more easily if you ever have to stop your main debit card due to fraud.

But I have a big problem with Chase's obfuscation and attitude to it so I don't think they deserve my custom, however good they might be. They did something that was going to create a problem and didn't tell anybody. Non-lethal echoes of the Boeing 737 Max? No company that does that deserves anyone's business.

 

[yorkie]

This whole thread has put me off ever switching to Chase.

There is no issue if you either:

• Purchase e-tickets (which account for the vast majority of online purchases these days)
• Use a website which does not enforce 'same card' collection, e.g. our site!

 

[robbeech]

I think showing the Chase app with the correct card details and a matching transaction, together the booking confirmation email, should have been accepted as sufficient evidence.

Is a member of staff at a ticket office able / allowed to just print them regardless (for example if they use the mk1 eyeball and common sense as a security method) or do they still need to enter some data?

Isn’t the problem with Chase that a different card number is used online ? Nothing to do with a number being displayed on the card

One assumes this therefore is not an issue for “any card” collection then?

The way Chase deal with card numbers is essentially a security measure. By not having the card number on the card itself, and by using a virtual card number when used, it makes it much less likely for you to have your card details nicked. We should be encouraging heightened card security, not discouraging it.

So does the card itself not have a number at all? Or just not printed on it? I know online transactions from the account use a different number but I thought the card itself still had a number but it just wasn’t printed on the card. If (and only if) so, surely the security method here is tame as all you’re doing is preventing someone writing down or photographing the card number from your card. Most card security issues are done by contactless readers so what would be the difference here?

That's a very strange term. Maybe they were thinking of the term virtual card, which is at least understandable and in more common usage

Indeed, my business credit cards have physical cards and virtual cards. A person can have a physical card and as many virtual cards as they want.
For certain purchases (particularly for products being imported) we’ll create a dedicated virtual card for that series of transactions only which will be dissolved when the order / job is complete.

 

[Bletchleyite]

So does the card itself not have a number at all? Or just not printed on it?

The latter. The problem was that they gave a different number for online transactions (good idea) but didn't tell people that (grossly incompetent).

I know online transactions from the account use a different number but I thought the card itself still had a number but it just wasn’t printed on the card. If (and only if) so, surely the security method here is tame as all you’re doing is preventing someone writing down or photographing the card number from your card. Most card security issues are done by contactless readers so what would be the difference here?

Most card security issues involve the magstripe. You can't easily "clone" the chip via contactless or otherwise, and you can't spend more than £600 on contactless (6x£100) before it will ask for the PIN.

 

[James H]

There is no issue if you either:

• Purchase e-tickets (which account for the vast majority of online purchases these days)
• Use a website which does not enforce 'same card' collection, e.g. our site!

Equally, it's possible to pay via Paypal using a Chase card on some ticketing sites, which also ensures the ToD booking is set to 'any card'

 

[disunity]

To get £5.99 of cashback from chase (to offset the curve cost) you'd need to spend £599.

A better workaround might be to use paypal, or buy a gift voucher from the TOC and then use that to buy tickets.

If you get referred to curve, you will get £5 free after 5 transactions over £5. There was also free £15 when you join curve via snoop but I cannot find it anymore.

In reality, you don't need curve and just use another card for train tickets or use an any card ToD retailer or pay with paypal or gpay/apple pay.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 13 Dec 2023 ==

The latter. The problem was that they gave a different number for online transactions (good idea) but didn't tell people that (grossly incompetent).



Most card security issues involve the magstripe. You can't easily "clone" the chip via contactless or otherwise, and you can't spend more than £600 on contactless (6x£100) before it will ask for the PIN.

You can get the card's number and expiry via contactless*
*Depending on the card. Fails on some cards but succeeds on other.

For example, lifting details works on Monzo but it doesn't work on curve card for some reason.

Also, Chase and many others now give you the option to disable magstripe.

 

[Bletchleyite]

If you get referred to curve, you will get £5 free after 5 transactions over £5. There was also free £15 when you join curve via snoop but I cannot find it anymore.

In reality, you don't need curve and just use another card for train tickets or use an any card ToD retailer or pay with paypal or gpay/apple pay.

Google Pay shares the card number with the retailer and thus doesn't, unlike Apple Pay, guarantee an any-card collection. Just so people are aware.

 

[Wallsendmag]

Google Pay shares the card number with the retailer and thus doesn't, unlike Apple Pay, guarantee an any-card collection. Just so people are aware.

Apple Pay doesn't guarantee an any card collection, usually it just causes problems

 

[Bletchleyite]

Apple Pay doesn't gaurantee an any card collection, usually it just causes problems

It doesn't give the merchant the original card number so it can't be the correct card. If any merchant is implementing it assuming the number Apple give them is an actual card, then they're thick, given that unlike Chase it doesn't look like a card to the retailer, it's done under a separate option so they know full well it was used.

 

[Wallsendmag]

It doesn't give the merchant the original card number so it can't be the correct card. If any merchant is implementing it assuming the number Apple give them is an actual card, then they're thick, given that unlike Chase it doesn't look like a card to the retailer, it's done under a separate option so they know full well it was used.

I totally agree but that's what's happening

 

[Deafdoggie]

If any merchant is implementing it assuming the number Apple give them is an actual card, then they're thick,

Welcome to Britain's railways

 

[WoodHillsian]

Sorry to being this up again, but I foolishly bought a ticket on the GWR app with my Chase card and tried to print it at an unmanned TFW station. Luckily travel isn't until tomorrow, so if I go to a manned TFW station will the ticket office staff be able to print out the ticket, or should I just refund the ticket and buy another one with a different card?

 

[Bletchleyite]

Sorry to being this up again, but I foolishly bought a ticket on the GWR app with my Chase card and tried to print it at an unmanned TFW station. Luckily travel isn't until tomorrow, so if I go to a manned TFW station will the ticket office staff be able to print out the ticket, or should I just refund the ticket and buy another one with a different card?

If it's a walk up I'd be inclined to contact them and ask for a fee free refund saying why, then rebook. Save you the faff.

Some staff will do it, others won't. I know someone who got a prebooked ticket printed at a window this morning* with no cards or ID on him at all (he forgot his wallet and didn't have time to go back for it) but that isn't supposed to happen.

* Not Bletchley, to avoid them getting in trouble.

 

[yorkie]

If it's a walk up I'd be inclined to contact them and ask for a fee free refund saying why, then rebook. Save you the faff.

Either that, or ask the retailer to get it changed to "any card".

A solution in future (doesn't help this time round) is to use the forum's ticketing website; we allow any card collection. The commission also helps us to keep the forum free, and to avoid adverts being too intrusive, etc.

 

[James H]

GWR won’t change bookings to any card

 

[yorkie]

GWR won’t change bookings to any card

In that case, I'd say ask for a refund. If their policy isn't made clear, then this argument could be used to try to get out of paying the admin fee, but I don't know if that would be successful, or worth the effort.

It can be worth asking at a ticket office but with the backup of refunding the ticket, if they refuse to do it. Ticket offices are a complete lottery on issues such as like this; some will be helpful, some won't be. It may depend on the policies of the employer and potentially the attitude/helpfulness of the individual member of staff.

 

[James H]

If it's at all possible to get to a staffed ticket office today, I'd try that.

When I was in the same situation a couple of years ago (ticket bought from GWR paid with a Chase card) my local GTR ticket office sorted the problem immediately - I was ready to give a sob story and explain the whole saga but the clerk just printed the tickets without further ado.

 

[4COR]

GWR won’t change bookings to any card

That's certainly changed in the past year and a half or so - I've managed to get them to do it via Twitter when my card had been replaced between buying and collecting the ticket (and I only twigged when turning up prior to travel... )

 

[RJ]

This whole thread has put me off ever switching to Chase.

They’re no so bad. They threatened to ban me because I kept finding new ways to generate unlimited cashback through their debit card, then ended up slapping a £15 a month cap on earnings. The card and app is actually pretty good.

Working in a ticket office, a significant proportion of transactions nowadays is printing out TODs. People pay with Apple Pay then ignore the instruction to bring any physical card in order to print out their ticket. Where I work we pride ourselves on being helpful but elsewhere ticket offices will refuse to print them. Until the process catches up with contemporary technology, probably best to stick to using a tangible card to buy and collect the tickets.

 

[maniacmartin]

I have a Chase account. I really wouldn’t have a problem with them doing this if the page in the app made it clear that it is a virtual card number and shouldn’t be used for travel tickets and hotels.

Chase could solve this issue by blocking transactions from online rail ticket issuers on the virtual cards, but then that might annoy people who want to buy e-tickets.

It’s sad they they’ve but a workaround in for TfL contactless but nothing else - quite a London-centric view and I guess the development team at all in London so that’s all they think matters.

 

[WoodHillsian]

I have a Chase account. I really wouldn’t have a problem with them doing this if the page in the app made it clear that it is a virtual card number and shouldn’t be used for travel tickets and hotels.

Chase could solve this issue by blocking transactions from online rail ticket issuers on the virtual cards, but then that might annoy people who want to buy e-tickets.

It’s sad they they’ve but a workaround in for TfL contactless but nothing else - quite a London-centric view and I guess the development team at all in London so that’s all they think matters.

I had no problem last night - called at a staffed ticket office and they printed it off without demur. I'll definitely avoid using Chase for this in future though

 

[Bletchleyite]

This whole thread has put me off ever switching to Chase.

I'm certainly not a fan of theirs because of the obfuscation involved in this. Monzo (though it's not as good as it was) and Starling may be a better bet if you want one of those app only banks.

 

[James H]

It’s sad they they’ve but a workaround in for TfL contactless but nothing else - quite a London-centric view and I guess the development team at all in London so that’s all they think matters.

The Chase help article on this subject suggests they really don't understand a) how ToD works b) that not all tickets are available as e-tickets

I'm very happy with the ~£350 cashback I've made since being a Chase customer though.

There are currently better details for rail tickets (Uber) so I haven't used my Chase card for rail tickets for some time. But if I did I would be sure to do it via Paypal or Apple Pay which ensures that 'any card' collection is possible.

 

[Red Rover]

Can’t staff override the standard issuing process if they think it’s genuine?

 

[Bletchleyite]

Can’t staff override the standard issuing process if they think it’s genuine?

I know one did for my friend on Monday but I'm not sure they are supposed to do so. And do all TISs even allow them to?

 

[Red Rover]

You can have instances when people are collecting tickets and they haven’t paid for them, company credit cards used for staff travel and the like, surely people use their heads in situations.
Rules are for the obedience of fools and all that.