Refund or delay repay?

[BlueFox]

I was planning to use the return part of a Kendal to Carlisle ticket yesterday, but when I found out about the derailment and closure of the line I decided not to travel.

I live in Carlisle, so a Kendal to Carlisle return ticket might seem to be an odd one to have, but it's the result of a trip to the lake district by bus a few weeks ago, which I ended at Kendal, and I got the train home from there. I bought a return ticket so I could make a similar trip, but in reverse, at a later date.



The National Rail website says this: "If your train is cancelled or delayed and you choose not to travel, you are entitled to a full refund."

Could I still do that even if I've already used the outbound ticket?


Can I claim using the delay repay system instead?

The websites to make a claim ask which train you were on and how long you were delayed. I can't answer these questions as I didn't make the journey.

If I can claim, it would be with Transpennine or Virgin. Which of those companies would be the best to claim from?

 

[AlterEgo]

You're due a refund from the retailer for the unused portion of the ticket (50% refund if you didn't use the return portion at all).

You need to contact the retailer. You will need to send them the unused portion. Where did you buy the ticket?

 

[gray1404]

In order to claim delay repay then you need to have actually made the journey concerned. You are entitled to a refund without an administration fee if the train you plan to take is delayed or cancelled and you decide not to travel. You would obtain this by returning the ticket to the retailer you purchased it from. However, when calculating a refund they take into account any travel that has already taken place using the ticket. AlterEgo has said above that it is a 50% refund. I guess this is better then them merely giving the difference between a single and a return.

As the return portion is valid for a month could you keep it to use on another occasion?

 

[BlueFox]

Thanks for the replies.


The ticket is still valid, until Friday. I might not have the chance to use it by then.


The ticket cost £16.50, so I would expect to get a refund of £8.25.


I bought the ticket from Red Spotted Hanky. I just went through the refund thing on their website.
Their system says I should get £6.50 - the full ticket price, minus a £10 admin fee. This is despite me choosing the drop down box that says I want the refund due to "service disruptions & cancellations".
Their system is obviously not set up to give refunds on just the return part only, and charges the £10 fee regardless of the reason for the refund.

They expect me to send it by registered post, so with the cost of postage, the bus fare to get to the post office, the time I waste doing it and the chance they'll get the refund wrong, it hardly seems worth the effort.

 

[gray1404]

You do not need to use the refund form on their website. You can simply enclose a covering letter with the ticket and expressly state that the NRCoC say that no admin fee should be charged in these circumstances. I would state the specific train that I wanted to travel on which was delayed or cancelled too if you happen to have this. Furthermore, they cannot insist you send the ticket though registered post. You could simply send it second class and chances are they will still receive it.

Refund Administrator
Red Spotted Hanky
Web Support
PO Box 6136
Wolverhampton
WV1 9RL

Remember, you have 28 days from the date your ticket expires to send the ticket into them as well so do not be making a special trip to the Post Office. Surely though there is a post box near you that you can use if not sending it through recorded delivery.

I do personally do the above. If you have any problems you can report RSH to Transport Focus.

I notice this too on other Webtis powered sites that when you select the options for a refund and then select service disruption/train cancelled as the reason that it still applies a £10 admin fee incorrectly.

http://www.redspottedhanky.com/images/1526/original/refund-guide.png

http://www.redspottedhanky.com/frequently-asked-questions/train-ticketing/refunds/

This refund guide on RSH incorrectly states that the customer is required to obtain confirmation of the delay from the TOC concerned. This is totally incorrect.

 

[AlterEgo]

You do not need to use the refund form on their website. You can simply enclose a covering letter with the ticket and expressly state that the NRCoC say that no admin fee should be charged in these circumstances. I would state the specific train that I wanted to travel on which was delayed or cancelled too if you happen to have this. Furthermore, they cannot insist you send the ticket though registered post. You could simply send it second class and chances are they will still receive it.

Refund Administrator
Red Spotted Hanky
Web Support
PO Box 6136
Wolverhampton
WV1 9RL

Remember, you have 28 days from the date your ticket expires to send the ticket into them as well so do not be making a special trip to the Post Office. Surely though there is a post box near you that you can use if not sending it through recorded delivery.

I do personally do the above. If you have any problems you can report RSH to Transport Focus.

I notice this too on other Webtis powered sites that when you select the options for a refund and then select service disruption/train cancelled as the reason that it still applies a £10 admin fee incorrectly.

http://www.redspottedhanky.com/images/1526/original/refund-guide.png

http://www.redspottedhanky.com/frequently-asked-questions/train-ticketing/refunds/

This refund guide on RSH incorrectly states that the customer is required to obtain confirmation of the delay from the TOC concerned. This is totally incorrect.

All of this is accurate except the Transport Focus bit.

RSH aren't a TOC or NRE and therefore Transport Focus have no jurisdiction. They're just a ticket retailer, much like a high street travel agent.

Never ever buy tickets from RSH. They're a cowboy operation that insist on you doing the legwork to prove cancellations. An appalling operation, which was set up by ex-TOC employees. I can't say much more in an open forum.

 

[gray1404]

Interesting. I had always assumed Transport Focus could take it up because on their webform at http://www.transportfocus.org.uk/contact/complaint/ Under the question: Who is your complaint with? Please select from dropdown list.... RHS is listed along with the likes of Rail Easy and takethetrain.co.uk

So if you get your ticket from a TOC website and have problems then you could take the complaint to TF for sure then?

Who issues the required authority and permission for RHS to issue train tickets? Surely there are certain conditions and service standards they have to adhere to in order to be allowed to continue doing so.

 

[BlueFox]

Never ever buy tickets from RSH.

Unless you've still got vouchers from the days when they used to give them away in their fantasy sports competitions, and regular giveaways in newspapers. I've still got around £50 worth left.

 

[AlterEgo]

Interesting. I had always assumed Transport Focus could take it up because on their webform at http://www.transportfocus.org.uk/contact/complaint/ Under the question: Who is your complaint with? Please select from dropdown list.... RHS is listed along with the likes of Rail Easy and takethetrain.co.uk

So if you get your ticket from a TOC website and have problems then you could take the complaint to TF for sure then?

Who issues the required authority and permission for RHS to issue train tickets? Surely there are certain conditions and service standards they have to adhere to in order to be allowed to continue doing so.

It must have changed then. TF used to never deal with any ticket retailers that weren't TOCs - back in the days when they were called Passenger Focus. I'll defer to more recent experience.

 

[yorkie]

The ticket cost £16.50, so I would expect to get a refund of £8.25.

But you did make use of the outward portion, which by itself would have cost £13.60, so you paid £2.90 extra for a return, therefore is it not £2.90 you are claiming for, if requesting a refund?

Delay Repay is different; for a delay on the return portion only is based on half the cost of a return (unless you are delayed by 2+ hours then it's the full cost of a return).

Their system says I should get £6.50 - the full ticket price, minus a £10 admin fee. This is despite me choosing the drop down box that says I want the refund due to "service disruptions & cancellations".
Their system is obviously not set up to give refunds on just the return part only, and charges the £10 fee regardless of the reason for the refund.

Yes, RSH are in the wrong here as there should be no admin fee. However if you are only claiming for the return portion then I believe you are due less than the £6.50 they are offering.

 

[AlterEgo]

But you did make use of the outward portion, which by itself would have cost £13.60, so you paid £2.90 extra for a return, therefore is it not £2.90 you are claiming for, if requesting a refund?

Abandoned journeys don't use the normal refund rules. Ordinarily, most Off Peak Return return portions have a nominal value of one pound, but if you abandoned your return this would be patently unfair.

Standard practice is to refund half the value of the ticket regardless of the ticket type, if it is a return.

The NRCoC simply say that the refund may "reflect any use you have made of the ticket".

 

[yorkie]

Abandoned journeys don't use the normal refund rules. Ordinarily, most Off Peak Return return portions have a nominal value of one pound, but if you abandoned your return this would be patently unfair.

Standard practice is to refund half the value of the ticket regardless of the ticket type, if it is a return.

The NRCoC simply say that the refund may "reflect any use you have made of the ticket".

That's nice to hear, though I understand some retailers make take it literally and deduct any use that had been had.

I agree it's unfair (though only because the cost of some singles compared to returns is unfair... but that's another subject!) but I've been told this in the past.

It will be interesting to see if RSH apply the standard practice or take a more literal, unfair interpretation...

Is the standard practice procedure documented anywhere, or is it a bit like the Break of journey issue?

 

[causton]

Last time I did a refund in similar circumstance... I didn't, as we did take the literal approach and the refund value was -£9.00, with the £1 refund and £10 admin fee taken off! Perhaps my manager was just being a bit heartless at the time, or that policy might be more common than thought