Reform UK discussion

[ainsworth74]

Cycling is great exercise, and the best exercise is that that you do naturally as part of your daily routine because you'll always do it.

That was the main thing for me. I changed from driving to work to getting the train and that means I'm getting about a two mile walk in every working day.

But as you say, policies which encourage people getting out of their cars are very much not seemingly part of the Reform agenda!

 

[Railwaycat]

I’d go one step back, and fix the reasons why the number of people are becoming ill is increasing, and why it can often take longer to get fixed. Basically, on average the population needs to eat less and exercise more!

That is half the problem. I was sent to the out of hours surgery yesterday evening, of 5 people in that waiting room 3 (all looked in their 20's) were overweight (I would say obese). At the doctors today, a large percentage of the patients waiting were overweight. Watching scenes from 1979 and the early 80's in the series "Shifty" people seemed to be slimmer, and looking back that is how I remember those times.

 

[Bald Rick]

Though, part of that is due to the poverty we have to deal with as well which has driven some people towards cheap and cheerful highly processed food with all the consequences that brings with it.

Whilst that is some of it, in my experience there is little cheaper way of feeding yourself than buying fresh fruit and veg. Add in some meat, pasta and rice and you can comfortably make several dinners for a family for not much more than a tenner. I think the issue is more about conveneinece food (which is often highly processed), as people don‘t have the time / don’t want to / can’t be bothered to cook from scratch.

As one example a 20mph default urban speed limit as per Wales is a strongly pro-cycling policy

I find having to slow down through sleepy Welsh villages when on my bike highly annoying, especially when it’s on a nice downhill stretch!

 

[nw1]

Does Reform even have a policy on rail?

Not sure, one would guess they wouldn't be over-supportive.

 

[The Ham]

What I call "anti-pensionerism" has become quite a fashionable political line in the 2020s, and if I'm honest I suspect it's mostly taken by people who either a) are young - early 40s at the oldest - and a long way from pensionable age and/or b) have good private and/or company pensions that will keep them going. I'd like to see a little bit more empathy with pensioners who aren't quite so well off. Later life can't be easy for many - please let's not make it even more of a struggle.

I would suggest that there's a difference between being anti pensioners and being aware that the UK is seeing a significant increase in the number of people of retirement age and so things are likely to need to change.

A lot of the time, talk about benefits increasing or people are out of work due to illness is down to the fact that we have an aging population. However, it's not uncommon for this to be implied that this is people in their 20's not wanting to work and live off benefits and so "we" should make life for those on benefits harder.

The issue is, that often that means those in their early to mid sixties suffer, when the reality is it would be kinder to have a system which encourages a flexible start to your pension. For example, for those who have health issues they could have a pension from (say) 58

However conversely give tax insensitives to people to keep working up to (say) 72, as well as encouraging businesses to give those over (say) 60 the right to have unpaid leave (say) 1 week for those aged 60-62, 2 weeks for those aged 62-64, 3 weeks for those 64-66, 4 weeks for those aged 66-68, 5 weeks for those aged 68-70 and 6 weeks for those aged 70-72.

In doing so you'd give them the ability to keep going for longer, but still be able to enjoy more time doing things that they would like to do.

Free bus passes cost us a billion quid a year- and that's despite the scheme not ever being fully funded and operators having to take a significant haircut on top of that billion quid- but you can imagine the outcry if anyone ever tried to abolish ENCTS.

The crazy thing is it would only likely cost £11bn to give everyone unlimited free bus travel.

Most people live longer than the simple mean because (sadly) child mortality drags it down a lot. The median or even mode are probably better averages to use for this and would be higher. It is thus very likely that you will live beyond 80.

Indeed, one child dies aged 5, yet 29 other people live to 82 and the average age is 79.43.

I’d go one step back, and fix the reasons why the number of people are becoming ill is increasing, and why it can often take longer to get fixed. Basically, on average the population needs to eat less and exercise more!

Which is why we need to decorate now use of public transport:

That was the main thing for me. I changed from driving to work to getting the train and that means I'm getting about a two mile walk in every working day.

But as you say, policies which encourage people getting out of their cars are very much not seemingly part of the Reform agenda!

A classic example, those using public transport typical walk more than those using a car.

 

[ainsworth74]

Whilst that is some of it, in my experience there is little cheaper way of feeding yourself than buying fresh fruit and veg. Add in some meat, pasta and rice and you can comfortably make several dinners for a family for not much more than a tenner. I think the issue is more about conveneinece food (which is often highly processed), as people don‘t have the time / don’t want to / can’t be bothered to cook from scratch.

A very good and fair point!

 

[SuspectUsual]

https://x.com/ziayusufuk/status/1934635968759570913?s=46&t=_YJpC0NnDFgt_77zD1Eteg

Here’s Zia Yusuf with the latest bombshell from their BTEC DOGE operation at Kent council - the council spent £450k on external auditors last year, which apparently is “a racket”

Luckily there are lots of replies to his tweet pointing out that at 0.017% of turnover the audit costs are very competitive.

These people are just inciting division anywhere and everywhere they can. They’re evil

Link is to a tweet by Zia Yusuf, the text of which is:

If you’re furious about the way Kent County Council are spending your money, take solace in the fact that their ‘external auditors’ charged the taxpayer £450k for their services.

They’ll charge even more this year.

What a racket.

 

[Bald Rick]

Here’s Zia Yusuf with the latest bombshell from their BTEC DOGE operation at Kent council - the council spent £450k on external auditors last year, which apparently is “a racket”

Perhaps they would rather not have auditors in…

 

[Bletchleyite]

I find having to slow down through sleepy Welsh villages when on my bike highly annoying, especially when it’s on a nice downhill stretch!

You technically don't have to - the speed limit does not apply to bicycles. Probably a good idea though.

 

[ainsworth74]

Perhaps they would rather not have auditors in…

Well it does make it easier to award the right contracts to the right chaps if you've not got woke auditors peering over your shoulder...

 

[DerekC]

Perhaps they would rather not have auditors in…

Well it does make it easier to award the right contracts to the right chaps if you've not got woke auditors peering over your shoulder...

And I am sure they've got a mate who can look over the books for a few quid.

 

[Yew]

Here’s Zia Yusuf with the latest bombshell from their BTEC DOGE operation at Kent council - the council spent £450k on external auditors last year, which apparently is “a racket”

Luckily there are lots of replies to his tweet pointing out that at 0.017% of turnover the audit costs are very competitive.

These people are just inciting division anywhere and everywhere they can. They’re evil

Link is to a tweet by Zia Yusuf, the text of which is:

If you’re furious about the way Kent County Council are spending your money, take solace in the fact that their ‘external auditors’ charged the taxpayer £450k for their services.

They’ll charge even more this year.

What a racket.

How much has the DOGE department cost so far? Having two sets of Auditors seems like unnecesssary waste.

How long will it take right-wing types that acting like a mad axeman cutting budgets doesn't actually result in efficiency, you need to invest either time or money in improving ways of working.

 

[JGurney]

Bue we must always try and improve institutions

I think so myself, but populist thinking rejects the potential for incremental improvement.
As above, the populist concept of embedded conflict between supposed populance and elite leads to either the cynical and pessimistic view that improvement is impossible (summed up by the American expression 'It doesn't matter who you vote for, the government always wins') or to revolutionary theories that institutions must be destroyed and started again from scratch.

If you think class division doesn't exist in thic country, it does.

Yes, it does, but not in the simplistic two-class model associated with populism. There are a lot of gradations to social stratification. Populists tend to either try to ignore this, to exagerate the size or significance of their particular group, or to suggest that groups which don't fit their model don't count.

A typical non-Marxist populist approach seems to be on the lines of

'I speak for all the overlooked ordinary people.

Anyone with more money than me is a posho elitist not a hard-pressed ordinary person, so they don't count.

Anyone with less money than me is a workshy scrounger not a hard-working ordinary person, so they don't count.

Why aren't all the ordinary people flocking to my banner?'

 

[jon0844]

As far car washes are concerned, they've existed for quite a while. My local IMO car wash first opened in town 30-odd years ago and it had a lot of custom because it was different to the usual automated car wash normally found at petrol stations. There's clearly a market for it.

It's perhaps a little ironic that we used to have loads of automated machines to wash our cars, and they've almost all gone in favour of hand car wash places. Automation replaced with real jobs!

Even manual jet-wash places seem to have gone out of fashion (presumably because the profit per hour is just too low to warrant the space given up for it).

 

[nw1]

https://x.com/ziayusufuk/status/1934635968759570913?s=46&t=_YJpC0NnDFgt_77zD1Eteg

Here’s Zia Yusuf with the latest bombshell from their BTEC DOGE operation at Kent council - the council spent £450k on external auditors last year, which apparently is “a racket”

Luckily there are lots of replies to his tweet pointing out that at 0.017% of turnover the audit costs are very competitive.

These people are just inciting division anywhere and everywhere they can. They’re evil

Link is to a tweet by Zia Yusuf, the text of which is:

If you’re furious about the way Kent County Council are spending your money, take solace in the fact that their ‘external auditors’ charged the taxpayer £450k for their services.

They’ll charge even more this year.

What a racket.

"We don't need auditors. You can trust us, the Kent People's Populist Front".

 

[alex397]

More from Kent County Council. KentOnline is reporting this, based on an article from the Sun (rather than their own journalism), with a rather clickbait-y headline.

Reform’s Doge team reveals Kent County Council spent more than £24,000 on trampolining, bowling and cinema for illegal migrants​

https://www.kentonline.co.uk/kent/n...aims-kcc-spent-thousands-on-tv-licenc-325858/

An investigation by Reform UK has revealed the thousands of pounds an authority has been spending on illegal migrants.

The party’s Department of Government Efficiency team (Doge) conducted a probe into Kent County Council (KCC) after taking a landslide election victory.

It claims more than £24,000 has been spent on trampolining, bowling and trips to the cinema, according to an article published by The Sun.

It also found in 2022 at least £1,000 was paid out on TV licences, with further spending reported at both JD Sports and PC World.

The former chairman and now-appointed Doge leader, Zia Yusuf, told the newspaper: “For too long, British citizens have been prosecuted for not paying for a TV licence, yet asylum seekers are having theirs paid for by taxpayers.

“The old Tory regime at Kent County Council has a lot to answer for. Reform will fight for taxpayers.”

Nigel Farage’s party won control of the local authority in the May local elections – now taking up 57 of KCC’s 81 seats.

Since then, they have launched Doge, a team modelled on a similar initiative by the second Trump administration which is charged with identifying wasteful spending using cutting-edge technology.

All its members, who come from business, auditing and tech backgrounds, are working for free.


It was initially headed by tech entrepreneur Nathaniel Fried, however, he stepped down when Mr Yusuf resigned his position as party chairman.

At the beginning of the month, Mr Yusuf said KCC bosses had confirmed millions of pounds of financial irregularities.

Initial talks at County Hall revealed issues around £2.8million of public money – something reported by KentOnline last year.

He added that £190,000 was stolen through a council card, £150,000 was claimed through fake grants and £30,000 was paid to care providers fraudulently.

Kent County Council has been approached for comment.

As you would expect, the comments on my local Facebook residents group regarding this story are absolutely vile. I’ve reported some of the comments because some are calling for the death of the migrants.

One commenter has suggested that the leisure trips are for unaccompanied children, but I have not seen any evidence for this. Does anyone know if this is the case?

 

[nw1]

More from Kent County Council. KentOnline is reporting this, based on an article from the Sun (rather than their own journalism), with a rather clickbait-y headline.

Reform’s Doge team reveals Kent County Council spent more than £24,000 on trampolining, bowling and cinema for illegal migrants​

https://www.kentonline.co.uk/kent/n...aims-kcc-spent-thousands-on-tv-licenc-325858/



As you would expect, the comments on my local Facebook residents group regarding this story are absolutely vile. I’ve reported some of the comments because some are calling for the death of the migrants.

This is one of the things I most detest and fear about Reform and its supporters. The nasty, poisonous, populist aggression surrounding the movement. If there is a peer group which is a problem, it's the ultra-right-wing monsters who are calling for death of migrants. But, oh no, they're native-born British people, so they're entitled to make death threats I guess. They have "legitimate concerns", in ŧhe eyes of some on the populist right.

This is what I fear most about Reform and why I hate to think what sort of country we will become should they get in. Their whole attitude. The mindless, aggressive populism.

Reform is, in my opinion, a party for bullies and bigots. The moderate and measured right wing really should be voting Tory. Badenoch appears to be rather anti-immigration, so if you think there is too much immigration, the Conservative Party is a relatively sane and sensible choice.

 

[ainsworth74]

Oh no! How dare people asylum seekers be allowed to have fun! A terrible state of affairs!

More seriously I would note that according to Kent County Council's website their budget for 2025/26 is £2.6bn (excluding schools spending). So the £24,000 they spent on giving some people a nice trip to a bowling alley and whatnot is 0.00092% of the council's budget. So, er, I'm not entirely convinced it even counts as a rounding error in their budget to be quite honest...

 

[nw1]

More seriously I would note that according to Kent County Council's website their budget for 2025/26 is £2.6bn (excluding schools spending). So the £24,000 they spent on giving some people a nice trip to a bowling alley and whatnot is 0.00092% of the council's budget. So, er, I'm not entirely convinced it even counts as a rounding error in their budget to be quite honest...

FAKE NEWS

MAKE KENT GREAT AGAIN*



(*This was made in jest, but a quick internet search reveals that some of them have actually used that phrase when campaigning. Can't they even think up their own slogans rather than nicking the Donald's? Put it this way, I am glad I am not a Kent resident.)

 

[RailWonderer]

It's perhaps a little ironic that we used to have loads of automated machines to wash our cars, and they've almost all gone in favour of hand car wash places. Automation replaced with real jobs!

Even manual jet-wash places seem to have gone out of fashion (presumably because the profit per hour is just too low to warrant the space given up for it).

Automatic car washes scratch and dull the bodywork quite badly, and when some motorists started to realise this they abandoned them.

 

[styles]

While I don't wholly disagree that public bodies are guilty of large amounts of waste, and KCC is not in the best financial position, £24k is not going to make a dent in their ~£80m deficit. Those kind of savings require council-wide budget cuts or some very innovative revenue generation, or indeed, big council tax rises (~£90 per capita).

That's regardless of what I feel about paying for cinema trips for asylum seekers, or residents generally.

 

[Bletchleyite]

While I don't wholly disagree that public bodies are guilty of large amounts of waste, and KCC is not in the best financial position, £24k is not going to make a dent in their ~£80m deficit. Those kind of savings require council-wide budget cuts or some very innovative revenue generation, or indeed, big council tax rises (~£90 per capita).

That's regardless of what I feel about paying for cinema trips for asylum seekers, or residents generally.

The fix to the £24K is to allow asylum seekers to work while their application is being decided. Then they're paying into the tax system, not costing money.

I bet Reform doesn't support that though!

 

[jon0844]

Automatic car washes scratch and dull the bodywork quite badly, and when some motorists started to realise this they abandoned them.

Thus proving that automation isn't always a good thing.

We will find this with other things that get automated in the coming years and, just like companies that outsourced customer services, IT management and more to overseas businesses, there will become a time when the same companies see the advantage of bringing things back to as they were when the people decide they don't like what has happened.

 

[Oxfordblues]

Deleted

 

[Bletchleyite]

Automatic car washes scratch and dull the bodywork quite badly, and when some motorists started to realise this they abandoned them.

In your opinion.

I prefer automated myself. I also don't like organisations that pressure you to pay in cash (so they can evade taxes) and who are often involved in questionable immigration practices. The reputation of hand car washes in these regards is barely above that of "Turkish" barber shops and "American" sweet shops.

For clarity I obviously don't include in that proper manual valeting companies who will come round in a newish, well presented van and charge you £50 by card and generally do a seriously good job. Those are a reputable luxury if you really want to look after your car.

 

[styles]

I think the whole 'detailing' scene has demonished automatic car washes to a bizarre extent.

I don't doubt they could cause some scratches but I have noticed absolutely zero on my 11 year old car which is predominantly washed by automatic car washes for around 2 years now. I am really not sure the dulling argument stacks up either, and let's be honest, over the course of 10+ years, people are going to expect their motor to not look the same as the day it rolled off the forecourt.

I also don't doubt however that I could get a better finish from a mobile detailer.

If I had a classic car or something incredibly expensive I may take a different view, but I really don't think the majority of drivers take that view.

I am however, as @Bletchleyite says, concerned about some of the labour and trafficking practices of cheap hand car washes. The lad who runs our local automatic car wash has lived in this area for over 40 years since he was born here. That's not an anti-immigration slant, but I am confident he's running a legit business and paying his staff properly and doing background checks. And even then, there's very few staff because it's automatic. I think they only have 3 in total, including the owner.

 

[Railwaycat]

This while over 30% of UK female prison inmates have been incarcerated for not being able to afford the fine for evading the television licence fee. More ammunition for Reform I fear.

Really? Can you please direct us to the source of this information?

 

[styles]

According today's Daily Telegraph illegal migrants are being given free television licences. This while over 30% of UK female prison inmates have been incarcerated for not being able to afford the fine for evading the television licence fee. More ammunition for Reform I fear.

30% of UK female prisoners are in prison because they didn't pay their TV licence?

Have a day off.

Edit for clarity:

You cannot be sent to prison for failing to pay a TV licence fee, only for failing to pay a fine in connection with a conviction for not paying the fee—and the latest available figures for England and Wales show no one was jailed for this in 2020 or 2021. Women are more likely than men to be convicted of not paying the fee, but the number of men jailed since 1995 after failing to pay fines is twice the number of women.

Do a disproportionate number of women end up in prison for failing to pay TV licences? – Full Fact

Conservative leadership candidate Liz Truss has raised concerns over the number imprisoned, but since 1995 twice as many men have been jailed.

fullfact.org

Common sense should tell you that we don't have nearly a third of women prisoners there because they didn't pay for their TV licence.

 

[Railwaycat]

but I have noticed absolutely zero on my 11 year old car which is predominantly washed by automatic car washes for around 2 years now. I am really not sure the dulling argument stacks up either, and let's be honest, over the course of 10+ years, people are going to expect their motor to not look the same as the day it rolled off the forecourt.

I also don't doubt however that I could get a better finish from a mobile detailer.

Same here on my 15yr old white Citroen, I only have the programme one above basic wash (forget what it does) but I might try the most expensive (about 10 options!) one day just to see what it comes out like.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 17 Jun 2025 ==

30% of UK female prisoners are in prison because they didn't pay their TV licence?

Have a day off.

Edit for clarity:

Do a disproportionate number of women end up in prison for failing to pay TV licences? – Full Fact

Conservative leadership candidate Liz Truss has raised concerns over the number imprisoned, but since 1995 twice as many men have been jailed.

fullfact.org

Common sense should tell you that we don't have nearly a third of women prisoners there because they didn't pay for their TV licence.

Remember, he did read it in The Daily Telegraph (allegedly).

 

[alex397]

The KentOnline article I posted above on post #676 about the thousands being spent on ‘illegal immigrants’ has been updated, confirming that this money was spent on children.

https://www.kentonline.co.uk/kent/n...aims-kcc-spent-thousands-on-tv-licenc-325858/

However, Lib Dem leader Cllr Anthony Hook says the costs relate to child asylum seekers KCC has a legal responsibility to care for.


And it is money the authority will get back from the government.

But, the damage is done. The sound-bite headline of £24,000 spent on ILLEGALS having fun is already out there, being spouted by the ignorant to their friends, families, colleagues or anyone who will listen. And people will believe it, and not look into the fact it’s money spent on the wellbeing of children.
Will Yusuf send out a tweet adding this information? Maybe apologise for the misinformation? Somehow, i’m doubtful.

So, this confirms that the Reform Party don’t care quite so much about children as they might like to portray. I guess it depends on what sort of children….