Random Question regarding British Rail power sockets.

[flypie]

In the 80s I remember some BR trains had power sockets with an unusual pin arrangement. Does any have any pics or know the specification?

 

[D1511]

Do you mean the two pin shaver sockets?

 

[Ediswan]

Some unusual plugs and sockets here: https://www.plugsocketmuseum.nl/British2.html

Uncommon British plugs and sockets

Maybe the Walsall style, with the pins rotated 90 degrees ?

 

[flypie]

Do you mean the two pin shaver sockets?

No they were 3 pin I think the live & Neutral were rotated through 45 degrees/

 

[D1511]

Maybe the Walsall style, with the pins rotated 90 degrees ?

Any ideas why Walsall gave its name to sideways plugs?!

 

[flypie]

Some unusual plugs and sockets here: https://www.plugsocketmuseum.nl/British2.html

Maybe the Walsall style, with the pins rotated 90 degrees ?

Could be 24.

 

[Helvellyn]

In the 80s I remember some BR trains had power sockets with an unusual pin arrangement. Does any have any pics or know the specification?

Maybe for vacuum cleaners in depots and to stop people plugging other things in?

 

[flypie]

Maybe for vacuum cleaners in depots and to stop people plugging other things in?

That is what I assumed. I was just wondering if they were 240v. I wonder what devices they would have been worried about users plugging in.

 

[Dr Hoo]

Any ideas why Walsall gave its name to sideways plugs?!

They were made by the Walsall Electrical Company in, err, Walsall. The company was founded in 1892.

 

[D1511]

They were made by the Walsall Electrical Company in, err, Walsall. The company was founded in 1892.

Thank you, but I'm sure you can guess the next question.......why did they think sideways was a good idea? Surely the cable of whatever you plugged in it would stick out sideways and it wouldn't be possible to place them side by side, but they would need to be positioned one above the other instead. Seems like a pretty daft concept altogether......unless there is some logical railway-related reason for this rotated configuration that someone could enlighten me about? Thanks in advance

 

[Dave W]

Thank you, but I'm sure you can guess the next question.......why did they think sideways was a good idea? Surely the cable of whatever you plugged in it would stick out sideways and it wouldn't be possible to place them side by side, but they would need to be positioned one above the other instead. Seems like a pretty daft concept altogether......unless there is some logical railway-related reason for this rotated configuration that someone could enlighten me about? Thanks in advance

It's not the plug that's sideways, each of the pins is rotated through 90 degrees. Compare image 13 in the link with a standard 3 pin plug.

I question the point of this to an extent - it just makes items with this plug less usable if there's no equivalent socket - but there are clearly some applications - the link itself refers to dialysis machines. I wonder if critical equipment such as this was wired to plugs of the Walsall design to ensure they could be used with a dedicated supply, or similar reasons (purely guessing, though).

 

[Rescars]

That is what I assumed. I was just wondering if they were 240v. I wonder what devices they would have been worried about users plugging in.

I assume this was to discourage anyone apart from authorised staff using the supply for anything else, or overloading it. A standard 3-pin socket would surely have attracted all sorts of abuse once its existence had been noticed. From the H&S perspective, the hazards of trailing mains cables in passenger areas in trains in service are self-evident. As to what might have been plugged in, the possibilities are endless, especially with an extension cable. Who knows? Tape players? Hair curlers? Travel irons? Back in the Travellers-Fare / Maxpax era, an opportunity to plug in your own electric kettle might have proved just too tempting.

 

[2192]

Some unusual plugs and sockets here: https://www.plugsocketmuseum.nl/British2.html

Maybe the Walsall style, with the pins rotated 90 degrees ?

We had type 3 & 6 (like normal 13amp but with round earth pin) in one power station apprentice training school I worked at, allegedly to stop theft of plugs. This was OK until they stopped making them and we needed more!

 

[dosxuk]

I question the point of this to an extent - it just makes items with this plug less usable if there's no equivalent socket - but there are clearly some applications - the link itself refers to dialysis machines. I wonder if critical equipment such as this was wired to plugs of the Walsall design to ensure they could be used with a dedicated supply, or similar reasons (purely guessing, though).

It's not about restricting where the equipment can be used, but restricting what the socket can be used for.

In the case of a dialysis machine, it's pretty important nobody unplugs it so they can run the floor cleaning machine, or to charge their phone. By making the socket only compatible with a limited number of pieces of equipment, you ensure that those sockets are always available for that equipment.

In less critical environments, like on the railway, it's about making sure that only authorised users can use the socket. It may be that the socket is only provided for specific uses, not general use - like a hoover on a train or a battery backed supply; or that it's availability needs to be guaranteed; or that you just don't want the general public using your electricity.

The use of non-standard connectors is far from restricted to the railway, in fact it's surprisingly common outside domestic and office environments. There's one in particular that most people are familiar with - the 16A 240V IEC60309 connector. It has hardly any additional current carrying ability than a standard 13A connector, but are extremely common for a wide variety of uses.

 

[Clarence Yard]

When I was on the ODM in the 1980’s, Reyrolle plugs and sockets were common for both 110v (S&T & PW equipment) or 240v (depots) - much more durable than standard plugs and sockets or variants thereof.

 

[John Webb]

......The use of non-standard connectors is far from restricted to the railway, in fact it's surprisingly common outside domestic and office environments. There's one in particular that most people are familiar with - the 16A 240V IEC60309 connector. It has hardly any additional current carrying ability than a standard 13A connector, but are extremely common for a wide variety of uses.

These IEC connectors are also reasonably weather-proof and don't need extra protection if used out of doors compared to a 13A plug and socket. Quite a bit more robust as well, as the plug pins are contained within a shroud so less likely to be bent out of place. Additionally they are colour-coded and keyed differently for various voltages so it's not possible to plug a 110V appliance into a 240V supply, for example.

 

[dosxuk]

These IEC connectors are also reasonably weather-proof and don't need extra protection if used out of doors compared to a 13A plug and socket. Quite a bit more robust as well, as the plug pins are contained within a shroud so less likely to be bent out of place. Additionally they are colour-coded and keyed differently for various voltages so it's not possible to plug a 110V appliance into a 240V supply, for example.

Actually, most of the cheaper ones are not suitable for outdoor use, having little protection against water ingress. There are things they are better at than the 13A plug, but there's plenty of them in cupboards, offices, and other internal spaces, with equipment that gets plugged in once when it's installed and then never touched, pulling only a few amps, where none of those advantages are needed.

 

[AndrewP]

There were also plugs with T pins that I recall.

Another common use was where the output voltage was not reliable so anything plugged in could be fried and there could be complaints and other issues. Bad enough in the past but now when everything needs to be plugged in!!!!