Railjets in Germany

[FlyingPotato]

In September I'm travelling on railjet between Vienna and Innsbruck
This train goes through Germany but doesn't stop

Given the issues with Germany
How likely will this train be delayed in Germany

It's important as I'm connecting onto another train in Innsbruck (wait time is 40) minutes. The train is going to Venice and I can't really miss it

The main questions are will this railjet be likely delayed and should I get an earlier one to be safe

 

[Austriantrain]

In September I'm travelling on railjet between Vienna and Innsbruck
This train goes through Germany but doesn't stop

Given the issues with Germany
How likely will this train be delayed in Germany

It's important as I'm connecting onto another train in Innsbruck (wait time is 40) minutes. The train is going to Venice and I can't really miss it

The main questions are will this railjet be likely delayed and should I get an earlier one to be safe

The railjet services from Vienna to Innsbruck via the German „corridor“ (as we call it) do get delayed, but normally rarely more than 10 to 15 minute, and not all of it is DB’s fault, delays happen within Austria as well.

However, the German section is a bit more prone than the Austrian one to longer delays for various reasons; diversions via the inner-Austrian route happen on occasions.

On balance I would say that you should be fine. If you are really worried, take the railjet the hour before (they are hourly, the one from Vienna at 7:28 gives you 1h40 minutes of connecting time) and if it is on time, you could take a stroll through Innsbruck, which is a lovely place.

 

[LNW-GW Joint]

My last two trips on the route (not this year) involved delays, from (1) infrastructure failure in Austria (power failure) and (2) engineering works in Germany causing single line working.
The latter also affected Munich-Innsbruck-Italy EC services, so don't be surprised if your connection is late.
Train type doesn't matter.
Innsbruck is indeed a good place for a break, with some nice eateries near the station.

 

[nwales58]

If you are relying on catching EC85 I would either leave extra time in Innsbruck or accept that I might get to Verona 2 hours late on the same ticket but then have to pay again to get to Venice. The local R/RV cost EUR 10 walk up fare, 1-2 per hour, but nothing after 2041 until the last at 2222. There's little point in using the Frecce for that distance due to cost and compulsory reservations.

OeBB do not seem to hold connections.

Last Autumn I was on EC163 which ran via Rosenheim due to work around Kitzbühel. About 15' late due to the chocolate flake sleeper replacement work around Traunstein. Klagenfurt connection missed at Salzburg but conductor sure that it would be held at Bischofshofen. It was not. So arrived Bad Gastein 2 hours late. Assitance at Bischofshofen was a man reading the same public information on his mobile phone as you can.

The Austrian and German approach is that you sort yourself out and make a claim for additional costs.

 

[rvdborgt]

Innsbruck should give assistance on the new Brenner compulsory reservation but don't expect more. The Austrian and German approach is that you sort yourself out and make a claim for additional costs.

There are no compulsory reservations on the Brenner route ECs. They're recommended though. If you're travelling on Interrail, there's a mandatory supplement for the Italian part of the route, but it's valid for the whole day and not tied to a specific train.

 

[ABB125]

There are no compulsory reservations on the Brenner route ECs. They're recommended though. If you're travelling on Interrail, there's a mandatory supplement for the Italian part of the route, but it's valid for the whole day and not tied to a specific train.

Does this mean that you can do a return trip in a day only paying for one supplement?

 

[nwales58]

There are no compulsory reservations on the Brenner route ECs ...

Thanks. Memory fade. Corrected.

 

[30907]

Does this mean that you can do a return trip in a day only paying for one supplement?

Doubt it, but you can test-book the ticket on the OeBB site

 

[Richard Scott]

In September I'm travelling on railjet between Vienna and Innsbruck
This train goes through Germany but doesn't stop

Given the issues with Germany
How likely will this train be delayed in Germany

It's important as I'm connecting onto another train in Innsbruck (wait time is 40) minutes. The train is going to Venice and I can't really miss it

The main questions are will this railjet be likely delayed and should I get an earlier one to be safe

I would check before you go. There's engineering works between Linz and Salzburg, I believe, that have just started and going on for a month. These can cause huge delays so factor in a bigger connection time. Check with OEBB.

 

[Austriantrain]

I would check before you go. There's engineering works between Linz and Salzburg, I believe, that have just started and going on for a month. These can cause huge delays so factor in a bigger connection time. Check with OEBB.

The works that you mention are between St Pölten and Linz and there are adapted schedules in operation. Based on past experiences, these should work well.

 

[Richard Scott]

The works that you mention are between St Pölten and Linz and there are adapted schedules in operation. Based on past experiences, these should work well.

Ok, couldn't quite remember what they said whenI was there last week. Based on experience last week, should work quite well didn't translate into reality on affected routes.

 

[Austriantrain]

Ok, couldn't quite remember what they said whenI was there last week. Based on experience last week, should work quite well didn't translate into reality on affected routes.

Wasn’t in effect last week yet, started this week.

Yes, there are also works between Linz and Salzburg but those will be going on for years. They will indeed sometimes affect reliability- I think last week ETCS was introduced on part of the route, there might well have been signaling issues.

Based on what I saw last week, 15 minutes delay seems to have been the norm. I am sure that some trains were more delayed. On a 40 minute connection on Innsbruck, I would say that the probability of making it will be between 90 and 95%. If that is not high enough, the OP should take an earlier train.

Even that is not 100% secure though; yesterday e.g. the German corridor was blocked again and trains were diverted - that will result in a 100 minute delay.

 

[Richard Scott]

Wasn’t in effect last week yet, started this week.

Yes, there are also works between Linz and Salzburg but those will be going on for years. They will indeed sometimes affect reliability- I think last week ETCS was introduced on part of the route, there might well have been signaling issues.

Based on what I saw last week, 15 minutes delay seems to have been the norm. I am sure that some trains were more delayed. On a 40 minute connection on Innsbruck, I would say that the probability of making it will be between 90 and 95%. If that is not high enough, the OP should take an earlier train.

Even that is not 100% secure though; yesterday e.g. the German corridor was blocked again and trains were diverted - that will result in a 100 minute delay.

I know as I was there but there were others on other parts of the network causing significant delays.
Just saying to the OP worth checking before you go. I'd rather leave an hour or so earlier than risk a 90% chance. That's my choice, other people may feel differently.

 

[Austriantrain]

I know as I was there but there were others on other parts of the network causing significant delays.
Just saying to the OP worth checking before you go. I'd rather leave an hour or so earlier than risk a 90% chance. That's my choice, other people may feel differently.

The problem is that the only thing you can gather from checking beforehand are planned timetable alterations - such as those in effect for the next few weeks.

Unfortunately though, delays are not announced in advance

 

[Richard Scott]

The problem is that the only thing you can gather from checking beforehand are planned timetable alterations - such as those in effect for the next few weeks.

Unfortunately though, delays are not announced in advance

Agree, which is why I'll always factor in a larger safety margin, if I can, if there are infrastructure works going on. Whether OP chooses to do that, or is even able to, is now up to them.

 

[FlyingPotato]

Thanks for responding all
Shall ponder and decide


One other question, on the fourth of September is RJX 63 from Munich to Budapest running as I've seen conflicting information

 

[Austriantrain]

Thanks for responding all
Shall ponder and decide


One other question, on the fourth of September is RJX 63 from Munich to Budapest running as I've seen conflicting information

According to ÖBB it’s running to a modified timetable and ending at Kelenföld station.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 14 Aug 2023 ==

Thanks for responding all
Shall ponder and decide

Note that if you miss your connection in Innsbruck, you can - as another poster has pointed out - take the next EC to Verona two hours later and regional services from there to Venice. None of these trains are compulsory reservation (but the EC might be very full).

 

[FlyingPotato]

I have a ticket on 63 to Kelti is it still valid or not

I'm new to European rules

 

[30907]

I have a ticket on 63 to Kelti is it still valid or not

I'm new to European rules

If the train number is the same, you're fine (apart from ending up at a different station).
If it has changed, you are also fine as you will be able to travel on the nearest service (or possibly any train that day?), but you may have lost your reservation (if you made one).

 

[Austriantrain]

Case in point for this thread: there was a severe incident on the German part of the route the day before yesterday and the line is still restricted with single-line working. inner-Austrian trains could not run yesterday and every second train got diverted via Zell am See, incurring a 90-minute delay (the others were cancelled)

From today and probably until Friday, only every second train runs on the German corridor, the others have a RRB.

Munich - Vienna - Budapest railjet do not run from Munich to Salzburg; instead, local trains need to be used.

 

[daglondon]

I recently travelled on several Railjet services within Austria, including one over the German corridor. Delays seemed to be routine, some of them small, others more considerable. Dwell times at stations seemed to be long as well, up to ten minutes, even on services already running with delays. The contrast with Westbahn trains was striking. There was certainly no dawdling at stations there. Indeed, if you weren't near the door as the train pulled in, it was touch and go whether you'd make it off at all.

 

[Austriantrain]

I recently travelled on several Railjet services within Austria, including one over the German corridor. Delays seemed to be routine, some of them small, others more considerable. Dwell times at stations seemed to be long as well, up to ten minutes, even on services already running with delays. The contrast with Westbahn trains was striking. There was certainly no dawdling at stations there. Indeed, if you weren't near the door as the train pulled in, it was touch and go whether you'd make it off at all.

Yes, unfortunately punctuality of ÖBB services - while not nearly as bad as in Germany - is nothing to write home about at the moment, although it strongly depend on which line.

Although WESTbahn trains are less punctual as well now that they run over German metal too But their trainsets are excellent for rapid passenger exchange and they do driver dispatch too. Thankfully, ÖBB habe now ordered the same sets for the slower services on the Westbahn, which are really interregional services for which the RJ sets are very unsuited.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 18 Aug 2023 ==

I recently travelled on several Railjet services within Austria, including one over the German corridor. Delays seemed to be routine, some of them small, others more considerable. Dwell times at stations seemed to be long as well, up to ten minutes, even on services already running with delays. The contrast with Westbahn trains was striking. There was certainly no dawdling at stations there. Indeed, if you weren't near the door as the train pulled in, it was touch and go whether you'd make it off at all.

At what stations did you experience those extended Dwells?

 

[Richard Scott]

Yes, unfortunately punctuality of ÖBB services - while not nearly as bad as in Germany - is nothing to write home about at the moment, although it strongly depend on which line.

Although WESTbahn trains are less punctual as well now that they run over German metal too But their trainsets are excellent for rapid passenger exchange and they do driver dispatch too. Thankfully, ÖBB habe now ordered the same sets for the slower services on the Westbahn, which are really interregional services for which the RJ sets are very unsuited.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 18 Aug 2023 ==



At what stations did you experience those extended Dwells?

Know this is a question for someone else, so sorry fir jumping in, but Linz seems particularly bad when I've been there.

 

[Austriantrain]

Know this is a question for someone else, so sorry fir jumping in, but Linz seems particularly bad when I've been there.

Interesting. Longer dwells are planned in Vienna Hbf, Salzburg, sometimes Innsbruck and Feldkirch. Linz is usually a relatively smooth operation, although the booked two minutes can turn into three or four if there is heavy passenger exchange.

It might have to do with the ongoing works you mentioned towards the west of Linz and the fact the the Linz - Wels line is extremely congested (in fact, a lot of the works are for four-tracking it).

In general, the Budapest - Vienna - Munich/west of Austria are the worst for delays for a variety of reasons. Trains from Prague towards Graz are often delayed too, as are those from Italy and Croatia. The inneralpine services Graz - Linz/Salzburg/Innsbruck are hit and miss. And never plan to use an ICE! The rest (not much really) is usually decent…

 

[RailWonderer]

As the topic is delays on DB/OBB, I'm doing Vienna - Salzburg early November on the Railjet, is the situation likely to improve by then? It's 2h30 assuming no delays, what is the reliability on this route if anyone knows?

 

[paul_munich]

As the topic is delays on DB/OBB, I'm doing Vienna - Salzburg early November on the Railjet, is the situation likely to improve by then?

that Austrian trains using the German shortcut are getting delayed every now and then?
it its not that there is total chaos 24/7, operations on these to stretches Salzburg-Rosenheim, and Rosenheim-Kiefersfelden are very smoothly most of the time, it is a high-performace through beautiful landscape.
The Austrians have a line between Salzburg and Tyrol, if it is getting to much for them they could stay on ÖBB soil...

 

[FlyingPotato]

As the topic is delays on DB/OBB, I'm doing Vienna - Salzburg early November on the Railjet, is the situation likely to improve by then? It's 2h30 assuming no delays, what is the reliability on this route is anyone knows?

Done it twice, no delays, but if the train was coming from Budapest there could be delays occurring in Hungary

 

[Austriantrain]

As the topic is delays on DB/OBB, I'm doing Vienna - Salzburg early November on the Railjet, is the situation likely to improve by then? It's 2h30 assuming no delays, what is the reliability on this route is anyone knows

Don’t worry too much about it because of this thread. You are very likely to be more or less on time.

If you want it to be more secure, use WESTbahn or one of the slower ÖBB RJ, which both are highly punctual, or the faster rjx services at the odd-hour (5:28, 11:28, 13:28 etc) which start in Vienna (airport and main station) - the 7:28, 9:28 and those at even-hours come from further along and are more prone to delay).


== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 20 Aug 2023 ==

that Austrian trains using the German shortcut are getting delayed every now and then?
it its not that there is total chaos 24/7, operations on these to stretches Salzburg-Rosenheim, and Rosenheim-Kiefersfelden are very smoothly most of the time, it is a high-performace through beautiful landscape.
The Austrians have a line between Salzburg and Tyrol, if it is getting to much for them they could stay on ÖBB soil...

Well, the WESTbahn CEO has recently stated in an interview - after starting to run trains to Munich and via Germany to Innsbruck and so being able to compare - that he is very glad to deal much more with ÖBB infrastructure than with DB infrastructure.

In reality though, you are right, mostly it works very smoothly and the corridor section in Germany has no higher share in causing delays to the inner-Austrian trains than the Austrian route.

Indeed, DB trains starting from Munich and going towards Austria are probably among the most consistent DB long-distance trains around right-now.

It’s just that the infrastructure in case of problems is much less resilient than comparable one in Austria (bi-directional signaling implemented much, much later - is it fully done yet? - and very much fewer crossovers). And constant restrictions and closures for renewals - which is a good thing of course, but seems to drag on by far too long.

 

[paul_munich]

It’s just that the infrastructure in case of problems is much less resilient than comparable one in Austria (bi-directional signaling implemented much, much later - is it fully done yet? - and very much fewer crossovers). And constant restrictions and closures for renewals - which is a good thing of course, but seems to drag on by far too long.

no, and there are no plans for a nation wide upgrade to bi-direction signaling, not even the corridor line is fully bi-directional.

 

[Austriantrain]

no, and there are no plans for a nation wide upgrade to bi-direction signaling, not even the corridor line is fully bi-directional.

Thank you!