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Railcards to go up by £5

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Peter Mugridge

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The increase would be less than 10p per week.

Which if the holder is spending sufficient money on rail travel to justify a £30 per year card, is simply lost in the noise of other day-to-day expenditure.

Which particular financial pressures are disabled people under that the other railcard eligible persons aren't, that justifies them being given a 10p per week allowance?
Yes, it would be a trivial additional sum.

The media is full of stories about disabled people complaining at costs and additional difficulties; there's also been the recent high profile instances of disabled travellers being let down by the assistance process - that alone makes it politically very difficult to put the price up at the moment.

Politics doesn't go by if it's only an extra 10p a week; it goes by the risk of adverse headlines.
 
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infobleep

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I reckon I'd pay up to about £200 pa for a "National Railcard". Possibly even more if it was by monthly direct debit and/or allowed peak time use.



Monzo already do.
I did have my annual season ticket but in the end the savings over the Network Railcard weren't working out enough as I didn't travel between 9:30 am and 10 am enough or travel to arara covered by a Gold Card but not a Network Railcard. There was so the £2 bus fares, which meant some of my journeys now switched to being by bus.

Gold Cards do offer no minimum fare during the week but most of my tickets are over £13 with a Network Railcard discount.

If they offered a nation wide discount card that worked for people who haven't been lucky enough to have a partner/girlfriend/be married etc, I would go for it, providing it paid for itself.
 

thedbdiboy

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The short answer is they just don't.

The longer answer is probably that RDG (or its predecessors) probably don't want to offer the discounts to those users as it would diminish the first class product, or that they don't want the discount to be used for peak/commuting travel in 1st, or the like.
RDG has no direct authority in the decision making role in Railcard pricing, it administers the scheme under which they are managed. In terms of the legal construction of the scheme, decisions are the collective responsibility of the participating TOCs based on votes and subject to a benchmarking regime against inflation. It is the TOCs' opinions on things like potential dilution that matter - indeed anyone that has worked inside ATOC/RDG would not get far by trying to tell the TOCs what they should do. In practical terms the Government holds all revenue risk, so it ultimately it's a DfT/Treasury decision to approve, and these days they are the ones that have to be satisfied with the numbers. As noted elsewhere Railcards haven't gone up for more than 10 years so the current price is well below the theoretical permitted maximum.
 

infobleep

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RDG has no direct authority in the decision making role in Railcard pricing, it administers the scheme under which they are managed. In terms of the legal construction of the scheme, decisions are the collective responsibility of the participating TOCs based on votes and subject to a benchmarking regime against inflation. It is the TOCs' opinions on things like potential dilution that matter - indeed anyone that has worked inside ATOC/RDG would not get far by trying to tell the TOCs what they should do. In practical terms the Government holds all revenue risk, so it ultimately it's a DfT/Treasury decision to approve, and these days they are the ones that have to be satisfied with the numbers. As noted elsewhere Railcards haven't gone up for more than 10 years so the current price is well below the theoretical permitted maximum.
Of course full duty hasn't gone up in more than 10 years either. I won'er what the theoretical permitted maximum of fuel duty would be?

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Good luck with chasing an unpaid debt of a few quid in a cost efficient manner. It wouldn’t be possible or worth it.
Well Norrhern were prosecuting people for not paying an additional £2....

Whilst they didn't class it as an unpaid debit, it was a small amount they hadn't paid.

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may be worth buying early if a retailer has a discount offer like trainline did this time last year - 30% off.
I got my Network Railcard in July this year so early renewal would need to be worthwhile.

I didn't get a good discount in July, only £5 off but I couldn't wait.

I wonder if their will be any good discounts just before March and the price rise next year.
 
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dciuk

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Do we know if this proposed £5 increase would apply to local railcards which are currently priced lower than the standard £30 and in some cases have had a price increase more recently that the "national" railcards
 

John R

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Well Norrhern were prosecuting people for not paying an additional £2....

Whilst they didn't class it as an unpaid debit, it was a small amount they hadn't paid.

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Somewhat different as they would not be able to instigate criminal proceedings to recover a railcard debt.
 

Edvid

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The upcoming price increases are now publicised on the Railcard website.

Railcard Prices Information​


After being frozen for over a decade, the price of most 1-year and 3-year Railcards will increase on Sunday 2 March 2025. Railcard customers save an average of £158 a year* - over 4 times the new price of a 1-year Railcard.
  • The 1-year 16-17 Saver, 16-25 Railcard, 26-30 Railcard, Family & Friends Railcard, Network Railcard, Senior Railcard, Two Together Railcard and Veterans Railcard will be £35
  • The 3-year 16-25 Railcard, Family & Friends Railcard, Senior Railcard and Veterans Railcard will be £80
  • The Disabled Persons Railcard will remain at its current price of £20 for a 1-year Railcard and £54 for a 3-year Railcard
 

1D54

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Absolutely no problem with this at all. There were concerns that senior may go to 65+ and that hasn't materialised and £80 for a three year card is a bargain, i saved £400 in year one and that is taking my £75 cost off.
 

Mark J

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Not content with rising the price by £5, reducing the discount from 34% to 33.4%. I can forsee the value of the Railcard will be further decreased with what can only be the next step.

Raising the minimum spend.

I reckon this will occur in the next year, or two.
 

1D54

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I use the amount of trains i do simply because of the discounts i can get and i bet i am not alone. You can't raise the minimum spend because there isn't one to start with and if they were going to introduce such a counter productive measure why didn't they do it today?
 

vinnym70

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I've noticed Greater Anglia are now offering a Club 50 railcard valid for over 50s: https://www.greateranglia.co.uk/club-50

Receive 20% savings on Off-Peak & Advance fares online
Get 10% savings on Off-Peak & Advance fares at the station
All for £20 Per year

Not sure if it's new or if I've not noticed it before but it seems an odd offer but there's no mention of a minimum spend after discount like a Network Railcard.
 

Mark J

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I use the amount of trains i do simply because of the discounts i can get and i bet i am not alone. You can't raise the minimum spend because there isn't one to start with and if they were going to introduce such a counter productive measure why didn't they do it today?
It would be undesirable to do everything in one go.

I'm sure we will eventually be told 'minimum spends haven't increased in over a decade', for what will be their flimsy justification for doing so.

The Network Railcard mimimum spend was brought in at £10, in 2002.

Later raised to the current £13, in 2009.
 

Titfield

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Absolutely no problem with this at all. There were concerns that senior may go to 65+ and that hasn't materialised and £80 for a three year card is a bargain, i saved £400 in year one and that is taking my £75 cost off.

Trainline from time to time has done a 30% off the price of a railcard promotion. My three year card purchased just over a year ago cost me £49 for 3 years. Ar £16.34 per annum I reckon that is very good value for money and more than paid for itself on just one journey.
 

1D54

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Ah sorry. I didn't realise there was a minimum spend on the Network Railcard.. Let's just hope it doesn't spread to other versions.
 

OscarH

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Not sure if it's new or if I've not noticed it before but it seems an odd offer but there's no mention of a minimum spend after discount like a Network Railcard
It's been around a good while. There's also a ScotRail version

Ah sorry. I didn't realise there was a minimum spend on the Network Railcard.. Let's just hope it doesn't spread to other versions.
There already is for 16-25 and 26-30! It's less onerous than the network railcard one at least, only applying before 10am
 

1D54

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It's been around a good while. There's also a ScotRail version


There already is for 16-25 and 26-30! It's less onerous than the network railcard one at least, only applying before 10am
So without derailing the thread too much why are certain railcards valid for travel before 10:00 and others aren't?
 

JonathanH

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So without derailing the thread too much why are certain railcards valid for travel before 10:00 and others aren't?
The 16-25 and 26-30 restrictions are essentially to prevent the railcards being used for short journeys in the peak, and therefore cannibalising revenue, while still allowing use for longer journeys, more likely to be discretionary.

The other peak restrictions are because the railcards are intended to stimulate off peak travel, not cut the cost of peak time commuting.
 

OscarH

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So without derailing the thread too much why are certain railcards valid for travel before 10:00 and others aren't?
I think just historic reasons and terms agreed at individual times.

There isn't much sense to why older people should be given more lenience than young (except in the SE where their restriction is complete time restriction rather than min fare, which is worse (though finishes slightly earlier at 09:30)). Or why 16-25 get a holiday from the minimum fare in summer, and are allowed on sleepers, but 26-30 doesn't.

It's all a right mess, but any change would almost certainly be for the worse with more restrictions.
 

Bletchleyite

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The 16-25 and 26-30 restrictions are essentially to prevent the railcards being used for short journeys in the peak, and therefore cannibalising revenue

The impression I had was that it was more about getting those people to buy season tickets rather than creating booking office queues. Nowadays of course pretty much nobody eligible for one of those ever buys a ticket from a booking office (aside from Merseyrail), and Northern's Advances being available on almost every train removes that restriction for them, and it really doesn't seem to bother them.
 

Haywain

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though finishes slightly earlier at 09:30
There isn't even that consistency - for Senior and Family Railcards the validity starts when Off Peak tickets become available, so that can depend on which destination you have selected and which direction you're going!
 

OscarH

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There isn't even that consistency - for Senior and Family Railcards the validity starts when Off Peak tickets become available, so that can depend on which destination you have selected and which direction you're going!
Yes of course, I was thinking of two together. Not sure how I could forget that it's that insane rule! Good fun for anything selling tickets to implement too
 

Mcr Warrior

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There isn't even that consistency - for Senior and Family Railcards the validity starts when Off Peak tickets become available, so that can depend on which destination you have selected and which direction you're going!
That's only in the London and South East areas, yes?
 

Hadders

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There isn't much sense to why older people should be given more lenience than young (except in the SE where their restriction is complete time restriction rather than min fare, which is worse (though finishes slightly earlier at 09:30)). Or why 16-25 get a holiday from the minimum fare in summer, and are allowed on sleepers, but 26-30 doesn't.
Actually there is.

Take Stevenage to London Terminals. Anytime Day Return £27.30 (railcard £18.35). 7-day season £117.30.

16-25 and 26-30 railcards allow younger people, at the start of their careers and generally with less money than their 60+ counterparts, to benefit from cheaper travel to work. They get a greater discount than even the annual season ticket affords and are able to pay daily for their commute.
 

Watershed

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Yes, apparently discounted commuting is acceptable across the rest of the network.
Or indeed in the L&SE area as long as your journey also extends beyond that area. From a rational perspective there's no good explanation as to why a Peterborough to London commuter should benefit from discounted fares whilst a Huntingdon to London one shouldn't.
 

ChrisC

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I use the amount of trains i do simply because of the discounts i can get and i bet i am not alone. You can't raise the minimum spend because there isn't one to start with and if they were going to introduce such a counter productive measure why didn't they do it today?
Before I was eligible for a Senior Railcard most of my longer distance rail journeys were booked well in advance using cheaper advance tickets. I would do plenty of research to find the cheapest tickets sometimes resulting in taking slower trains or less direct routes. Getting a railcard has for me brought flexible walk up off peak tickets down to a more acceptable level and I now very rarely use advance tickets. I much prefer paying on the day and having flexibility during my journey regarding which train I can travel on. The railway is actually getting far more income from me since I‘ve had a railcard than it did previously.
 

CyrusWuff

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Or indeed in the L&SE area as long as your journey also extends beyond that area. From a rational perspective there's no good explanation as to why a Peterborough to London commuter should benefit from discounted fares whilst a Huntingdon to London one shouldn't.
Historical reasons that the industry has never sought to review is the short answer.

Huntingdon marks the NSE/InterCity boundary on the ECML, Manningtree on the GEML, Northampton/Wolverton on the WCML, Didcot on the GWML and Bedwyn on the Berks & Hants.
 
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