Rail/tram pass

[LisaH]

Hi
A query about renewing my weekly season. I travel from Timperley (on the Manchester Metrolink) to Knutsford via Altrincham every day. I have a 7-day season which I cannot renew at Timperley, only Altrincham.
Usually because I'm disorganised I end up paying for the tram into Altrincham (£1.40) on Monday morning and renewing there.

Last week I attempted to renew on the Sunday evening.

However, I was told I could not retain my old pass which I needed for the tram home (as the new one wasn't yet valid and Metrolink, unlike Northern Rail, does issue tickets in advance of their start date.) I rang Metrolink who told me I should be able to retain my old pass but even after I put the Metrolink lady onto him the man in the ticket office refused to return my old ticket, saying I could not hold two at the same time according to the ATOC regulations.

The eventual solution was for Metrolink to give me a 'permission to travel' code - but I can't do that every week.

I realise the extra cost involved is small but is there any way I can renew my season ticket the night before and be able to travel home that evening?

 

[Monty]

Sounds like the clerical officer has got his wires crossed, if it's a seven day season or a monthly you should be allowed keep your old pass if it is still in date. I've known some annual seasons to be replaced outright. The old ticket being withdrawn and a new one issued before the old ticket expired, however they would be valid from the day of issue.

 

[barrykas]

Sounds like the clerical officer has got his wires crossed, if it's a seven day season or a monthly you should be allowed keep your old pass if it is still in date. I've known some annual seasons to be replaced outright. The old ticket being withdrawn and a new one issued before the old ticket expired, however they would be valid from the day of issue.

Strictly speaking, the clerk was correct in that you're only supposed to hold one season ticket (or Railcard for that matter) at a time...However, in such a case the clerk should use the "Lost Days" functionality on their TIS to extend the new ticket/Railcard accordingly.

Cheers,

Barry

 

[185]

Strictly speaking, the clerk was correct in that you're only supposed to hold one season ticket (or Railcard for that matter) at a time...However, in such a case the clerk should use the "Lost Days" functionality on their TIS to extend the new ticket/Railcard accordingly.

Cheers,

Barry

Correct. But they must advance date the new season ticket to commence at the point where the previous pass expires.

Are they allowed to withdraw a season ticket??! Good to hear that Metrolink did the right thing, as you should not be made to buy a ticket when you already hold (well, held) a perfectly valid one.

I would report Northern Rail to TfGM
http://www.tfgm.com/corporate/commenting_on_services.cfm?submenuheader=0

 

[yorkie]

LisaH -Welcome to the forum. Sorry you had this experience. It needs reporting. I will be happy to proof read a letter if you like. I'd send the letter to Northern, also report them to TfGM, and if Northern do not give a satisfactory response (including assurances that they will provide appropriate training & advice to their staff) then you can also take it to Passenger Focus, and ATOC. But give Northern/TfGM a chance to resolve it first.

 

[LisaH]

I rang Northern Rail at the time and to be fair they were extremely sympathetic and asked me to log a complaint which I have. I will let you know the response.

 

[Monty]

Strictly speaking, the clerk was correct in that you're only supposed to hold one season ticket (or Railcard for that matter) at a time...However, in such a case the clerk should use the "Lost Days" functionality on their TIS to extend the new ticket/Railcard accordingly.

Cheers,

Barry

I was aware of this function for annuals/monthlys but can you do this to weekly seasons also?

 

[34D]

Correct. But they must advance date the new season ticket to commence at the point where the previous pass expires.

That was what barry said (lost days functionality) wasn't it.

 

[barrykas]

That was what barry said (lost days functionality) wasn't it.

Not quite...You date it to start from the day of issue, entering the relevant number of "lost" days (1 in the OP's case, as they were renewing the day their existing ticket expired) to extend the expiry date.

You should also do it as a renewal, so "RENEWAL" gets printed in the "Start Date" field.

It's left as an exercise for the reader as to the reaction you'd get from Revenue Protection (especially those for a certain TOC that shall remain nameless) who'd forgotten the rule though!

 

[LisaH]

Well, Northern Rail Customer services replied telling me it was fine to keep my old ticket in these circumstances and to give the name of the area manager if I had a problem.

However, yesterday, I had another query about my ticket and handed over my ticket wallet to the same guy with an old ticket in it. This was taken from me - I asked for it back but was refused. I wanted to keep it (for reasons I won't go into but it wasn't essential that I did so) but asking the guy to speak to the area manager didn't help - he just said he was more aware of the rules than the area manager was. Afterwards I realised I really did need my old ticket as I wanted to claim for a delay - oh well, I didn't say that at the time but I am now dreading having the discussion again when I renew if I get the same guy (the others are fine!).....
Does anyone remember the 'That's Life' Jobsworth awards?

 

[ANorthernGuard]

Well, Northern Rail Customer services replied telling me it was fine to keep my old ticket in these circumstances and to give the name of the area manager if I had a problem.

However, yesterday, I had another query about my ticket and handed over my ticket wallet to the same guy with an old ticket in it. This was taken from me - I asked for it back but was refused. I wanted to keep it (for reasons I won't go into but it wasn't essential that I did so) but asking the guy to speak to the area manager didn't help - he just said he was more aware of the rules than the area manager was. Afterwards I realised I really did need my old ticket as I wanted to claim for a delay - oh well, I didn't say that at the time but I am now dreading having the discussion again when I renew if I get the same guy (the others are fine!).....
Does anyone remember the 'That's Life' Jobsworth awards?

I don't think he is a Jobsworth, just obviously a bit confused on the rules and regs, if he does it again just mention to him that you will once again be speaking to his boss as he either has not been briefed on the part of the knowledge he is lacking or being a touch over zealous, sadly common sense is not part of the training and if he thinks he really is smarter about the rules than his boss maybe you should ask him to consider going for promotion lol.

 

[northwichcat]

LisaH How much is the season ticket you buy?

Southern's website offers season tickets but doesn't like Knutsford-Timperley. However, if you try Knutsford-Brooklands it offers a £30.30 weekly ticket
http://tickets.southernrailway.com/sn/en/JourneyPlanning/SeasonMixingDeck That should be valid for your journey but I'm not sure if that might cost you more.

Answer to above given by 185 below so not a viable option.

Do you have much time between finishing work on Friday and the train departing Knutsford? If so it might be worth trying the ticket office there for a renewal. Knutsford has a smaller pool of ticket selling staff so you're less likely to get different responses off different staff.

 

[185]

Fare is
Knutsford to Timperley MTLK

7day season is £26.60

 

[bb21]

I rang Metrolink who told me I should be able to retain my old pass but even after I put the Metrolink lady onto him the man in the ticket office refused to return my old ticket, saying I could not hold two at the same time according to the ATOC regulations.

However, yesterday, I had another query about my ticket and handed over my ticket wallet to the same guy with an old ticket in it.

If I am correct to assume that you renew at the ticket office and not the gateline (if there were one), then I would just take the old ticket out of the wallet and keep it, then hand over only the photocard to the clerk and ask for a weekly season starting the following day. There is no requirement to hold an existing ticket with the photocard, and there is no difference AFAIK whether you do a new purchase or do a renew on a weekly season ticket.

Saves all that argument.

 

[northwichcat]

Fare is
Knutsford to Timperley MTLK

7day season is £26.60

OK the Southern site option won't work then unless there is another site that offers the Knutsford to Timperley MTLK ticket.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

not the gateline (if there were one)

There is no fixed gate line at Altrincham. Manual barriers are sometimes formed by G4S staff for both Metrolink and Northern Rail (but not the same staff on the same day doing both.) However, this is unlikely to be the case on a Sunday.

 

[185]

There is no fixed gate line at Altrincham. Manual barriers are sometimes formed by G4S staff for both Metrolink and Northern Rail (but not the same staff on the same day doing both.) However, this is unlikely to be the case on a Sunday.

Ohno they dain't. lol ....G4S are allowed no-where near Metrolink platforms... any barriers done on Metrolink stops are done by Metrolink PSRs.

G4S are welcome to stick to their own side of the station. Very, very welcome

 

[northwichcat]

Ohno they dain't. lol ....G4S are allowed no-where near Metrolink platforms... any barriers done on Metrolink stops are done by Metrolink PSRs.

G4S are welcome to stick to their own side of the station. Very, very welcome

So do Metrolink no longer contract any revenue protection duties to G4S then?

 

[185]

So do Metrolink no longer contract any revenue protection duties to G4S then?

Never did. Only Northern are that daft

Only contractors used by Metrolink were Carlisle for security assistance some years ago. Otherwise it is all done in-house.