Rail Replacement buses during Transpennine Route Upgrade

[61653 HTAFC]

I would have thought that the bus stops opposite the library and opposite Tesco would have been used instead, therefore less chance of low bridging.

They usually are. I was replying to a post about an RRB driver who got lost!

 

[sjm77]

I answered the same questionnaire and made it perfectly clear that rail replacement buses are the scourge of society and will be avoided at all costs by myself. Disgusting things.

 

[Watershed]

I answered the same questionnaire and made it perfectly clear that rail replacement buses are the scourge of society and will be avoided at all costs by myself. Disgusting things.

Would you prefer the railway to say "tough luck, get lost" to passengers when there are blockades? Obviously it's not ideal but wherever possible, trains are diverted to provide a train service for as many people as possible.

 

[Class 170101]

You'll get the better coaches, and general service, if you pay appropriate rates. Many TOCs pay low but expect the best.

Do TOCs cover their costs on Rail Replacement with compensation from NR? I've seen it suggested on this board that they don't get all their costs covered by NR compensation regime.

 

[YorksLad12]

Cottingley should be directed to use the Leeds City 51/52 services instead, then the RRB's can skip Cottingley thus allowing a faster Leeds > Morley run. As for Marsden and Slaithwaite (Slawit), the stops along the A62 - Peel Street for Marsden and Hollins Row? for Slaithwaite are ideal enough.

The 51 & 52 don't run close to Leeds Station. Better to beef up the 55/55C, extend to Morley and divert through Leeds Station Interchange outbound. Then you could reasonably take out the Morley stop as well; Morley Station is where the trains go, which isn't all that close to where people want to go. Running non-stop between Leeds and Batley would save a bit of time as well. You could similarly run non-stop between Mirfield and Huddersfield, as Deighton has services on Leeds Road. You'd need to do something about ticket acceptance, of course...

 

[6Gman]

Would you prefer the railway to say "tough luck, get lost" to passengers when there are blockades? Obviously it's not ideal but wherever possible, trains are diverted to provide a train service for as many people as possible.

They're really not though are they?

All too often hiring in a coach is chosen over a diverted rail service, largely on the issue of cost.

 

[Dr Hoo]

Would you prefer the railway to say "tough luck, get lost" to passengers when there are blockades? Obviously it's not ideal but wherever possible, trains are diverted to provide a train service for as many people as possible.

They're really not though are they?

All too often hiring in a coach is chosen over a diverted rail service, largely on the issue of cost.

Could @6Gman give some instances in relation to Transpennine? For example recent works at Miles Platting have seen extensive diversions via the Calder Valley and/or to/from Manchester Piccadilly. The biggest issues on Transpennine are the large number of important intermediate stations that get missed out in most feasible diversionary scenarios. These obviously have to be served by road transport.

 

[Towers]

It's up to the rail company to specify any particular requirements. The bus/coach operator will only supply what has been requested.

This has to be balanced against what is available; again, the options are often limited these days due to the accessibility regs.

 

[Class 170101]

Could @6Gman give some instances in relation to Transpennine? For example recent works at Miles Platting have seen extensive diversions via the Calder Valley and/or to/from Manchester Piccadilly. The biggest issues on Transpennine are the large number of important intermediate stations that get missed out in most feasible diversionary scenarios. These obviously have to be served by road transport.

Buses will inevitably have to be provided for local stations BUT what it does do is save the number of buses required as through passengers (say between Leeds and Manchester) don't have to be catered for in the number of passengers to be carried on buses and therefore requiring fewer buses. Note at this time whilst covid is still raging a shortage of rail staff will also be faced by the bus industry in terms of a shortage of bus staff for the same reason. It should also be pointed out that some bus drivers have left the industry to become HGV drivers so the fewer buses needed the better.

 

[Dr Hoo]

Buses will inevitably have to be provided for local stations BUT what it does do is save the number of buses required as through passengers (say between Leeds and Manchester) don't have to be catered for in the number of passengers to be carried on buses and therefore requiring fewer buses. Note at this time whilst covid is still raging a shortage of rail staff will also be faced by the bus industry in terms of a shortage of bus staff for the same reason. It should also be pointed out that some bus drivers have left the industry to become HGV drivers so the fewer buses needed the better.

I entirely agree. But another poster seemed to allege (two weeks ago) that some buses were being run for through passengers in preference to diversions, on cost grounds.

Details of this allegation are still awaited, I believe.

 

[Class 170101]

I entirely agree. But another poster seemed to allege (two weeks ago) that some buses were being run for through passengers in preference to diversions, on cost grounds.

Details of this allegation are still awaited, I believe.

Costs of course can be as cheap as they like but if the bus drivers don't exist it doesn't fly.

 

[darloscott]

Northern are still using Arriva Road Transport for their rail replacement, though I believe the contract is coming up for renewal shortly!?
In my area, North East, we have recently seen an increase in the number of coach operators from further afield (as far as Manchester!) as the local companies have struggled to cover their own work never mind additional rail work. The staff shortages are hitting everyone in different ways… we’ve recently done a lot of last minute work for Northern due to crew shortages.

 

[lincolnshire]

Northern are still using Arriva Road Transport for their rail replacement, though I believe the contract is coming up for renewal shortly!?
In my area, North East, we have recently seen an increase in the number of coach operators from further afield (as far as Manchester!) as the local companies have struggled to cover their own work never mind additional rail work. The staff shortages are hitting everyone in different ways… we’ve recently done a lot of last minute work for Northern due to crew shortages.

I asked the question a while since about the contract coming up for renewal and know one seemed to know anything then? May be some one on here may know whats happening with the contract between Arriva and Northern Trains?

 

[darloscott]

I asked the question a while since about the contract coming up for renewal and know one seemed to know anything then? May be some one on here may know whats happening with the contract between Arriva and Northern Trains?

Have to say it’s just bits and pieces I’ve heard from the coordinators who are usually the same lads we always work with.

 

[markymark2000]

Northern are still using Arriva Road Transport for their rail replacement, though I believe the contract is coming up for renewal shortly!?
In my area, North East, we have recently seen an increase in the number of coach operators from further afield (as far as Manchester!) as the local companies have struggled to cover their own work never mind additional rail work. The staff shortages are hitting everyone in different ways… we’ve recently done a lot of last minute work for Northern due to crew shortages.

All contracts are up for renewal at the minute I believe. Mostly due to the change from operations from franchising to management contracts. I think Northerns was just up for renewal. Last I heard was that they were expecting announcements a while back but nothing developed.

There are a lot of times with operators travelling a long distance to do Rail work. There was a firm from Birmingham doing Llandudno Junction to Holyhead. A Luton firm doing Kettering to Leicester. It's not good. I don't think many operators know how to get onto rail work, I know i've spoken to two firms who didn't know how to sign up for rails. The sad thing is that there is a lot which could be done to improve availability but seemingly TOCs don't want to adapt their requests according to demand. Some firms are taking it upon themselves to put smaller vehicles out simply because they know they won't be used but this does come at a risk of course.
At 2am, is a 53 seater really needed, could it be requested as a 30 seater since that would open up the use of Ilesbus and the Iveco Connect bus. Could some small service buses start being used on shorter runs or those where the average journey time is relatively low. There is stuff which can be done, I think there is just a reluctance to change but that is due to how things are in the rail industry.