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Rail industry preparing for national strikes

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Signal_Box

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I agree, but what I’m saying is you strike you lose any pay raise you may get. You work to rule, no rest day work, mo favours you don’t lose money but the pain is still felt on Sodor Island and can be sustained if required over a long period.
 
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The Planner

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Also, we've been told any patriae must be paid for by ourselves through T&C changes etc, funny how many other government paid roles have increases including those on the railway such as NR level 1-4 and LU!

There's money available, just not for 'lower grades'
What band 1-4 payrises? I need to ring payroll for mine to be backdated...
 

jamesst

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Hmmm; I'm relying on the rail to get me from Liverpool Airport back to Bolton after 7pm on a Friday. News of possible strikes isn't good, I hope if that happens we get tons of notice so rooms can be booked etc as the bus/coach service at that time is non-existant.

However, I don't think this would affect Merseyrail? If not it would help matters; can anyone confirm?

It will affect Merseyrail the same as every other toc.
If Sandhills box is covered then you've got pretty much 90% of the network open. However the extremities (Hunts Cross, Chester, Ellesmere Port) will be more at risk as these come under different boxes.
 

Signal_Box

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Band 4 covers those in TDA roles as well doesn’t it not really big fat cats !

Brand 1 and to an extant 2 yes, but 3 and 4 I don’t think their the big buckets paying jobs.
 

Dai Corner

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If there is not a Yes mandate, there will be no Pay Rises for many many years, a no vote is a licence for us to be walked all over, and emotionally blackmailed by NR. Yes, we're not badly paid, but will that still be the case in 10 years. We've already had a freeze for 2 years, now into our 3rd. RPI is at 11%, even if they offered that (which is unlikely) it still doesn't make up for no RPI rise in 2020/21. We have still lost out.
How much would you lose out if the Government decided that a 12 hour railway was enough for most of the country and that was all they were going to fund?
 

Signal_Box

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There’s 24/7 signal boxes with no service after about 2200, okay there are sometimes possessions but they can be taken prior to the box closing and handed back after it’s reopened, as long as no points need switching etc or trains in or out.
 

Signal_Box

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How much would you lose out if the Government decided that a 12 hour railway was enough for most of the country and that was all they were going to fund?

I say most of the country needs a 24/7 railway for freight traffic.
 

choochoochoo

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The government are desperate to save money, they're not going to give in on a strike. With the railway struggling to win commuters back after covid, a strike would only make more WFH and weaken the railways position still further.

The way I see it is the Government want people back in offices (so their wealthy donors/stakeholders can reap rent).

If a strike encourages WFH, it's the government's loss more than the railway's.
 

Siggy1980s

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The way I see it is the Government want people back in offices (so their wealthy donors/stakeholders can reap rent).

If a strike encourages WFH, it's the government's loss more than the railway's.
Very good point, and not one I'd considered. Add to that, the Green Agenda.
 

furnessvale

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Never going to happen. We have this thing called freight.
I am a firm believer in the use of rail for freight. I am also well aware that the railway carries around 10% of the nations freight.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: ==

Would there be replacement bus services if it went ahead?
There already is a national replacement bus network which is normally far better than anything the railways provide when they do lay buses on!
 

Dr Hoo

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Would the railways still have the [freight] Traffic it it had to pick up all the costs of signalling for 12hrs a day?
A very interesting question.

Less than 1% (yes, one percent) of Network Rail's income is normally from freight. See NR Accounts.
 

choochoochoo

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There already is a national replacement bus network which is normally far better than anything the railways provide when they do lay buses on!

Are you sure ? Most rail replacement buses I've been on tend to get lost on the route.
 

ExRes

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The way I see it is the Government want people back in offices (so their wealthy donors/stakeholders can reap rent).

If a strike encourages WFH, it's the government's loss more than the railway's.

It's also your loss when the office blocks in your town become squalid, empty eyesores, local unemployment rises and the council loses its income
 

choochoochoo

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It's also your loss when the office blocks in your town become squalid, empty eyesores, local unemployment rises and the council loses its income

It's everyone's loss - Hence it's the government's loss
 

furnessvale

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Are you sure ? Most rail replacement buses I've been on tend to get lost on the route.
Exactly my point! Official rail replacement services are often a joke. I am referring to the national network of bus and coach services who will be only too glad to hoover up displaced railway passengers, as indeed will road hauliers for the freight now the driver shortage has receeded.
 

choochoochoo

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Exactly my point! Official rail replacement services are often a joke. I am referring to the national network of bus and coach services who will be only too glad to hoover up displaced railway passengers, as indeed will road hauliers for the freight now the driver shortage has receeded.
But that'll be a nightmare for the green agenda unless you see a fleet of electric vehicles on the horizon ?

And the additional road traffic in congested areas will be even more of a nightmare ?
 

Drogba11CFC

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Meanwhile, I'd better see if I can move my holiday forward a few days.

Current plan is:
3/6 & 4/6: Porthmadog & WHR
5/6: FR & Machynlleth
6/6: TR & Bala
7/6: BLR & Shrewsbury

Revised contingency plan:
1/6: Birmingham
2/6: BLR & Bala
3-4/6: TR, Porthmadog and WHR
5/6: FR & Machynlleth
 

furnessvale

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But that'll be a nightmare for the green agenda unless you see a fleet of electric vehicles on the horizon ?

And the additional road traffic in congested areas will be even more of a nightmare ?
Correct on both counts but can you see a conservative government being seen to lose this one?
 

Class 170101

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Mark my words there will NOT be strike vote for signallers, action short of maybe but definitely a NO to strike.
Action short of a strike will do enough damage in places as we have already seen on this board, with instances of Blea Moor Box and Huddersfield Workstation (at York ROC) being uncovered for periods of time in recent weeks.
 

philthetube

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There already is a national replacement bus network which is normally far better than anything the railways provide when they do lay buses on!
only if you cancel most of the countries regular services though, someone needs to drive them, maybe the signallers could be trained.:D
 

Robertj21a

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A very interesting question.

Less than 1% (yes, one percent) of Network Rail's income is normally from freight. See NR Accounts.
Wow!

If the income really is just 1% then most people will wonder why freight is much of a concern. Just dump it and concentrate on the major, profitable, passenger routes.
 

AlterEgo

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People in general can’t see beyond the end of their own nose, nor do they care about anyone other than themselves.

Rail workers don’t need or want sympathy from “the public” the government don’t care what the public think either way so why do rail workers need support from the public ?
They do actually. Striking is effective when you’re causing maximum disruption, highlighting the essential nature of the job you do and bringing pressure to bear on people who make decisions. Unfortunately now for the railway, it is effectively nationalised and the government calls all the shots with revenue risk. This changes the playing field significantly because the government can just keep on taking the hit as long as the politics look good. And the politics don’t look especially good for the railway, which is much less relevant to National productivity than it was five years ago.
 

birchesgreen

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It's also your loss when the office blocks in your town become squalid, empty eyesores, local unemployment rises and the council loses its income
Its ok no one cared when places like Erdington became squalid eyesores full of empty premises as jobs and money were concentrated in the city centre instead. Now i notice a lot of new places opening up near here recently as more money / time is being kept local.

The world changes, as does the economy and society, the railway industry will have to adapt like everyone else.
 

Mag_seven

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Funny how the railway wasn't allowed to use the furlough scheme which kept millions of the population employed.

It had in effect its own furlough scheme with the taxpayer keeping it open throughout the pandemic (this despite the hostile environment created with "essential travel only" messages and the stigmatisation of public transport with compulsory mask wearing).

Jobs have still been lost though through the industry wide voluntary severance programme.
 

Agent_Squash

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People often forget the railway isn’t just 0904 Manchester Oxford Road to Hull or whatever. It’s the millions of tons of freight that is carried every day that I think the government really cared about, not keeping “key workers” moving they couldn’t care less about key workers

Agreed about the government not particularly caring about key workers - but equally the railway did receive far more support than road and air transport. They were fully intending to use this as a negotiation ploy.
A strong work to rule mandate it much more powerful and scary to a understaffed industry. A strike can be planned and resourced over many many months if required. A work to rule is a much more uncomfortable concept especially for those who will have to stand next to full time staff.

A work to rule would be more supported by the travelling public I imagine. It’s easy to blame striking rail workers as a passenger - shortage of train crew, on the other hand, becomes very much the TOCs taking the blame…

Funny how the railway wasn't allowed to use the furlough scheme which kept millions of the population employed. People seem to forget about that.....which is paid for by the gov!

Isn’t remaining in work at 100% pay better than 80% pay furloughed? The fact still remains that rail got more direct support than any other method of transport.

Everyone is being hit by the cost of living crisis. The railway risks biting the hand that feeds it too much and returning to decline.
 

66701GBRF

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Isn’t remaining in work at 100% pay better than 80% pay furloughed? The fact still remains that rail got more direct support than any other method of transport.
That depends on your circumstances and situation doesn't it? If you rely on the extra 20% and/or do lots of overtime then yes, remaining at work was probably best. If you only do the minimum, then 80% for doing absolutely nothing while avoiding the stress and hassle of the job (including the shift work and commuting) is quite an attractive position....particularly as some companies topped up to 100% anyway.
 
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