Question- ticket validity from Birmingham to Milton Keynes

[sunday]

Hiya

Am currently on the London Midland 8:33 service from New Street, changing at Rugby for the 9:20 service onwards to Milton Keynes. My company booked the ticket for me, off peak return on London Midland services only. The ticket was booked on London Midlands site and I have a print out of the booking which clearly states that the ticket was booked with this journey in mind (they did a journey planner search and booked the cheapest they could).

The guard has just been around and told me that my ticket is not valid but he will not valid but he will not charge me this once. I pointed out the print out from London midland and that their website offered the ticket as being valid. He stated that the website is not always right and that it is the passengers responsibility to check validity, I'd have thought that being sold the ticket after searching for a journey would qualify as checking validity but as I'm shattered and he wasnt trying to charge me so I didn't bother arguing.

Two questions:

1) Was the ticket valid?
2) If it is not then what are the passengers rights if they are missold tickets online or in person?

 

[yorkie]

From Avantix Traveller:

Birmingham N St (BHM) to Milton Keynes C (MKC)

SVR - OFF-PEAK R LMR
00042 - LDN MIDLAND ONLY

1 Adult @£ 18.50 = £ 18.50
__________
£ 18.50

Standard Class Return
From : 0418 BIRMINGHAM STNS

Restriction : SK
Mondays to Fridays

Valid on any London Midland
service scheduled to arrive
London Midland terminals at or
after 1000

Not valid for travel on
northbound London Midland
services timed to depart
London Terminals before 0845
or on any northbound London
Midland service timed to
depart any other station
before 0845.
Break of journey is not
permitted except to change
trains at an intermediate
station or to access station
facilities.

Saturdays, Sundays and Bank
Holidays

By any London Midland service.

--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

1) Was the ticket valid?

Yes (according to Avantix Traveller)

Next time ask the guard the following questions:
"What is the validity code of this ticket, and what does the restriction say?"
(You can check this on the National Rail website)

Did the guard look it up on his machine?

2) If it is not then what are the passengers rights if they are missold tickets online or in person?

You were not missold in this case but if in any doubt obtain reservations (where available), and bring itineraries provided when booking, and anyone in possession of such documents is highly unlikely to be charged anything, and if anyone tries it, say as far as you are concerned you are adhering to the contract, and you are not parting with any more money so they'll have to issue an Unpaid Fares Notice, which you will be contesting. Then post here and ask us for advice. Providing we confirm that you were valid and/or you have sufficient documentation to prove that you were adhering to the contract, then my advice would probably be to 'appeal' the UPFN.

If the guard is still on the train it may be worth asking him to look up the restriction and what it says on his machine as I would be interested to know.

If he did not look it up on his machine, then I suggest he's making it up. If he started telling me about my responsibilities I would politely but assertively remind him of his responsibilities!

 

[sunday]

Changed trains now, I don't know if as it was the first leg and I was changing it wasn't a ticket he encounters often? He certainly didn't look it up, just marked my ticket and handling circled the bit that says off peak return?

Ah well, not to worry. Was a little perplexed by the whole thing but as long as I know that it's valid I don't mind.

 

[island]

"The website is not always right"? Then how on earth are passengers meant to know? This ought to be reported to London Midland in order for some retraining to be scheduled.

 

[gordonthemoron]

the website is always right

 

[Deerfold]

the website is always right

Or if it's not it should not be the passenger's responsibility to work that out! If it is wrong the guard should be contacting someone in their company to contact the ticket-issuing site.

 

[Ferret]

the website is always right

That's the funniest thing I've ever read on here!!!

Anyway, I never realised hitting a couple of buttons on Avantix was that hard! Basic stuff...

 

[swt_passenger]

the website is always right

As they insist on the National Rail OJP, whatever staff may believe:

Ticket validities
The ticket that you have selected may require you to travel at specific times of the day, days of the week or on a specific route. Our Journey Planner will have already taken this into account with the selection that you have made and will only have shown tickets that are valid for the selected trains.

Permitted Routes
The ticket that you have selected may require you to travel via a specific route. Our Journey Planner will have already taken this into account with the selection that you have made and will only have shown tickets that are valid for the selected trains

 

[Kingsbury Jn.]

the website is always right

Not always. A few months ago I booked a (Saturday) day return from Marston Green To London Euston, London Midland only (for cheapest option). It required a change at Birmingham International for a train to Euston. However, when I collected the tickets, the leg from BMI was a Virgin Trains service, despite the ticket being marked LM only! A call to the LM helpline confirmed that the ticket would not be honoured on that service and gave me an alternative LM one to use. The chap on the phone was at a loss to explain how the journey had been generated but thanked me for bringing it to their attention.

 

[Ferret]

Not always. A few months ago I booked a (Saturday) day return from Marston Green To London Euston, London Midland only (for cheapest option). It required a change at Birmingham International for a train to Euston. However, when I collected the tickets, the leg from BMI was a Virgin Trains service, despite the ticket being marked LM only! A call to the LM helpline confirmed that the ticket would not be honoured on that service and gave me an alternative LM one to use. The chap on the phone was at a loss to explain how the journey had been generated but thanked me for bringing it to their attention.

Much like the numerous instances of East Coast superbreak tickets being bought with reservations for any old train regardless of operator! Doh!

 

[bb21]

Not always. A few months ago I booked a (Saturday) day return from Marston Green To London Euston, London Midland only (for cheapest option). It required a change at Birmingham International for a train to Euston. However, when I collected the tickets, the leg from BMI was a Virgin Trains service, despite the ticket being marked LM only! A call to the LM helpline confirmed that the ticket would not be honoured on that service and gave me an alternative LM one to use. The chap on the phone was at a loss to explain how the journey had been generated but thanked me for bringing it to their attention.

However if you boarded the Virgin service then they can't charge you as you have a reservation which forms part of your contract with the railway. The only thing the guard can do is to issue you a free replacement and do a TIR.

 

[Kingsbury Jn.]

However if you boarded the Virgin service then they can't charge you as you have a reservation which forms part of your contract with the railway. The only thing the guard can do is to issue you a free replacement and do a TIR.

Unfortunately there were no reservations generated for the VT service. I only discovered that it was a VT service when I collected the tickets from the TVM and rechecked the itinerary.

 

[wintonian]

However if you boarded the Virgin service then they can't charge you as you have a reservation which forms part of your contract with the railway. The only thing the guard can do is to issue you a free replacement and do a TIR.

You’re forgetting one thing; apparently it is the customer’s responsibility to check validity.

Just hand over your name and address and accept the unpaid fees notice and contest it.

 

[bb21]

I would still expect it to be honoured if you have the itinerary to hand, particularly if it had your booking reference on which matched the one on your ticket, and expect the guard to do a TIR.

 

[wintonian]

I agree!

I was thinking about if the itinerary/ reservations weren’t accepted.

 

[DaveNewcastle]

I would still expect it to be honoured if you have the itinerary to hand, particularly if it had your booking reference on which matched the one on your ticket, and expect the guard to do a TIR.

Yes. If the journey complies EXACTLY with the itinery offered by the booking site and you can produce printed copies of that itinery plus the corresponding tickets and are travelling EXACTLY in accordance with that itinery, then a TIR is the appropriate permit to travel.