Quality/Length of Sleep

[Huntergreed]

I've recently been curious about the topic of sleep (particularly how the length of sleep can impact upon the quality of it), and am curious to see the opinions of the forum.

Multiple sources including the NHS and CDC cite that the ideal amount of sleep per night is 7 or 8 hours or more for a fully grown adult:

NHS (https://www.nhs.uk/live-well/sleep-and-tiredness/self-help-tips-to-fight-fatigue/)

How much sleep you need.

Everyone needs different amounts of sleep.

On average: Adults need 7 to 9 hours

and the CDC recommend 7 hours (https://www.cdc.gov/sleep/about_sleep/how_much_sleep.html)

Age Group Recommended Hours of Sleep Per Day:

Newborn 0–3 months 14–17 hours (National Sleep Foundation)

Infant 4–12 months 12–16 hours per 24 hours (including naps)

Toddler 1–2 years 11–14 hours per 24 hours (including naps)

Preschool 3–5 years 10–13 hours per 24 hours (including naps)

School Age 6–12 years 9–12 hours per 24 hours

Teen 13–18 years 8–10 hours per 24 hours

Adult 18–60 years 7 or more hours per night

61–64 years 7–9 hours

65 years and older 7–8 hours

I try to get a good seven hours per night, but I often find that my natural circadian cycle tends to the later hours (I often don't feel 'tired' until midnight, and sometimes well beyond, meaning if I have commitments in the morning, I often feel tired and have difficulty feeling awake and energised when I do wake). I could (and probably should) adjust this through deliberately going to bed and waking earlier than I normally do, and I imagine my natural sleep cycle would adjust accordingly.

I'm curious about the sleeping patterns/trends noticed by members on here.

How much sleep do you get per night and do you find this is adequate to feel fully energised for the day ahead?

Where does your body's natural circadian cycle lie? Do you tend towards an early or late bedder? I assume that most people will probably be around 10-11PM as this will align with the typical working day, though I may be wrong!

Have you ever had to manually adjust your sleeping pattern to suit your lifestyle better? How difficult was this and what were the challenges?

Has your sleeping pattern changed as you've grown up, have you tended earlier as your age increased? (I think this is common above the teenager stage).

I'm particularly interested in this as I imagine the availability of mobile devices will have pushed the average bedtime (particularly for younger age groups such as teenagers) back quite significantly, and working in a school this is often very noticeable! Some pupils I have don't go to bed until around 2AM!

 

[Gloster]

What about a ’I get way below the amount of advised sleep (say three hours on a good night)’ for those of us who fit this description? You could also have a way too much option. And don’t tell me to see a doctor: they have tried everything and can only advise sleeping pills, which I may finally be forced to resort to. They are critical of the only thing that I ever found that worked: two bottles of red wine taken with food just before bed.

 

[duncanp]

I have suffered from insomnia all my adult life, and nothing I have tried seems to solve it on a long term basis.

A few years ago I tried the Sleepio App, and whilst that worked initially, some other external pressure or event comes along which knocks your system off balance again.

To say nothing of the stress caused by COVID and all the restrictions, which meant that during lockdown there was no defined routine to the day.

I am retired now, but find that getting up and going to bed at the same time each day, even at weekends, helps the quality of sleep.

Some people genuinely need less sleep than others, so it is not worth worrying about how many hours sleep you get. The quality of your sleep is just as important as the quantity.

 

[GS250]

If there is no pressure to get up the next day then I usually get 7-8 hours of broken sleep. Usually wake up every couple of hours although get back to sleep pretty quickly most the time. Occasionally....I'll only wake up a couple of times during the night. I feel fine during the day with the above.

However...

Pretty convinced now I suffer from a fair amount of anxiety relating to sleep. If I know I've got to be up the next day, then it can hamper my ability to get to sleep, stay asleep or not wake up too early and be unable to get back to sleep. Been on several sleep studies etc and all apparently okay. Has it affected my life? Well, I guess its held me back from certain things such as early get ups for railtours etc. No point in booking anything if you know you are gonna be knackered off 2h sleep the next day. It's also had an effect on what type of job I do. Flexi hours, remote = yes please. However I've generally been able to live a decent life. I just don't commit myself to anything that involves early get ups. Mental issue? Definitely. What's the fix? Really not sure.

 

[Bletchleyite]

I find adjusting back very hard. I'm currently on sleeping from about 1-2am to 9am and could do with taking it back to 11/midnight-7 ish for work! One thing I do find works is a "drowsy" antihistamine like cetirizine for knocking me out quickly but not making me feel groggy when I wake up like proper sleeping pills do.

I find about 7 hours works. Below 6 and I'm groggy, below 5 and I'm not in a good state at all. Too much and I'm groggy again.

 

[zero]

During winter, I usually go to bed around 8pm as I start to feel sleepy once it gets dark. Then I wake up around 4am which suits me very well as it means I can get a lot more personal things done when I am refreshed, before starting work, instead of having to do them when I am tired after work.

In summer I also prefer to wake up when the sun comes up, but as it's light until later in the evening I sometimes don't do that.

 

[ChrisC]

During the last few years, since I retired, I seem to have settled into a very regular sleep pattern which varies very little, even when I’m away on holiday. I tend to go to bed between 10pm and 11pm. I then often read or listen to the radio for for a time, but usually I am asleep well before midnight. I regularly wake up at some time between 6am and 7am. Therefore I usually get around 7 hours sleep.

I always used to have real problems getting to sleep on the first night away from home especially if staying in a hotel. I remember some nights in a hotel when I haven’t slept at all. This doesn’t seem to happen these days but that could be that I now have numerous stays away from home each year and have got used to sleeping in different locations. Although I always wake up before 7am, sometimes on dark winter mornings it is very tempting to just lie there. I always make a point of not staying in bed beyond 8am as it could become a habit. I feel much better later in the day when I have got out of bed earlier. Although I’m still only in my mid 60’s I think my days of getting up at 5am to get the first train for long day out and not returning much before midnight are perhaps over.

 

[trebor79]

Recently I've really started struggling with sleep and have really bad insomnia at times. I can go to bed around 11pm and not manage to sleep until well after 4am, and I'm usually awake by 0630 due to kids etc.
Strangely I don't tend to feel drowsy the day after, but usually manage to get a good sleep that night.

I used to always get 8 hours solid, not sure what's changed. Seems to be a slight correlation with coffee consumption but I'm not convinced as I never drink coffee after midday. I've recently started taking the Nytols that you have to get from a pharmacist, but I find they only work as a prophylactic - if I go to bed, lie tossing and turning for a few hours and then take one it doesn't work.
A work mate gate me one of his prescription tablets once (Zopidex or something like that it was called). That worked! Although it was quite comical when I got out of bed the next morning as I couldn't walk straight and my legs felt like they were made of lead for a few minutes!

 

[bspahh]

Sleep happens when lots of different things shut down in your body and brain, so there are lots of causes of insomnia.

There are a few of these causes like restless leg syndrome and sleep apnoea, where there are good therapies, and others where there are not.

Traditional "sleeping tablets" will make you sleep, but might not make you feel refreshed in the morning. They are now usually only prescribed for a week or so. They don't fix the underlying cause, and are addictive, so you can become dependent on them.

Good sleep hygiene (described by the Papworth Sleep Clinic here) might not cure insomnia, but the only side effects are to your social life.

Bad sleep can combine with anxiety and depression, with a vicious circle, which can be hard to escape.

 

[nlogax]

It's about quality over quantity here. Insomnia has been an intermittent problem that has caused me a lot of problems over the years. I've been tracking my sleep over several years with smartwatches + Fitbits and I've tried multiple things to improve the quality of my sleep, ultimately I've come to some conclusions that work really well for me.

- Exercise or activity during the day is the best way to maximise ability to get to sleep and overall sleep quality.
- A weighted blanket is great during winter.
- Good blackout curtains are essential especially during late spring and summer.
- The room to be as cool as possible. Needless to say I sleep much better north of the border in the height of summer.
- iPad or phone playing storm or rain tracks from Spotify at a quiet volume. Or a quietly burbling podcast about something in which I'm not wholly invested.
- An occasional pre-bedtime whisky can work wonders

Further to that if I need to be anywhere near on top of things the next morning then no heavy boozing the night before and no relying on melatonin / Tylenol PM / Nytol / other drug of choice.

 

[ChrisC]

- iPad or phone playing storm or rain tracks from Spotify at a quiet volume. Or a quietly burbling podcast about something in which I'm not wholly invested.

I’ve found a speech based radio station can help. Something like Radio 5 Live, Radio 4 or even LBC. I set the timer for 60 minutes and have the volume very low so that I really have to concentrate to hear it. Usually I go to sleep within about 15 minutes but it can be a bit annoying if the content of the programme was interesting and I wanted to hear the end!

 

[jfollows]

I usually go to sleep around 10pm and have no problem falling asleep, but often wake up in the night, after about 6 hours and often get up and do some things before going back to bed again.
I read in bed and listen to news on the radio until I feel like going to sleep.
If I know I have to get up for something in the morning, even if it's relatively unimportant and doesn't matter all that much, my sleep is much worse in anticipation of an alarm or an early start.
I usually sleep better when I haven't drunk alcohol during the day also.

 

[Shimbleshanks]

Since I had a dose of Covid in early 2020, I've noticed that while I sleep a long time, I often wake up feeling unrefreshed, so I often will have a nap during the day to catch up. (I'm self-employed and work from home so I can get away with it.) I also have trouble sleeping on my back and turn over on my side - the end result of which is I wake up with massive earache too.

 

[birchesgreen]

I usually go to bed at 9pm (and fall asleep around 10-ish) and get up at 6am though frequently i wake around 5.

Having the curtains open at night and having a ticking clock next to the bed i find helpful.

 

[Richard Knight]

I would advise before reaching for sedative medication or regular alcohol to combat insomnia, that other Sleep Disorders are eliminated first. Snoring, pauses in breathing, weight gain, restless legs or regular leg movements during sleep? Ask your GP to refer for Home Sleep Testing (most Centres should be able to do this). Check your Epworth Sleepiness Score, scores >11 should be actioned, especially in a Safety Critical Role. Primary Insomnia suffers are not tired and are difficult to treat.

 

[Jimini]

One thing we’ve found in the past year or so that’s had a great effect on how we feel in the mornings is a Lumie alarm clock. Being gently woken up by soft light rather than jolting awake to an alarm really does make a positive difference in the mornings.

To answer the original question, I’d say I’m in the eight hour / midnight through 0800 camp.

 

[lkpridgeon]

If my body got it's way I'd be in bed about 1730 to sleep for 1800 and it tends to prefer two rest periods over sleeping straight through (1800-2300, 0100-0600) otherwise I'm not as refreshed the next day.

I aim for 1900-0500 but this oft leads to waking up at around 22/2300 and not being able to get back to sleep until around 0100.

 

[_toommm_]

I currently work nights, which obviously doesn’t bode well with a healthy sleep pattern; so I usually sleep for a good eight hours from 10:00 to 18:00 (I work 19:30-07:00).

I find it quite easy adjusting back to being awake in the days, a I work five days in a row, and my last shift has me finishing at 04:30. I’ll just stay awake after that, go about my business, which is normally some sort of leisure travel for pleasure, then I’ll sleep most of Saturday to re-adjust back to nights.

 

[Bald Rick]

Without question what affects the quality of my sleep more than anything else is booze - if I’ve had anything more than one glass of wine or beer then I don’t sleep as well. If I’ve had more than about 3 or 4 I will be dead to the world, but not actually sleep very well, ie the ‘restorative’ part of the brain function being done while sleeping doesn’t work properly.

In terms of getting to sleep I find that reading for 10-20 minutes helps enormously. More often than not I’ll fall asleep mid-read. It has to be paper based though, reading on a screen doesn’t work anywhere near as well.

 

[Annetts key]

I’ve always been someone who falls asleep late into the night/early morning (Typically midnight - 01:00).

Oh and before smartphones, iPads and suchlike, there were good fiction novels to read by torch light (you know, from them places called libraries)…

I used to be able to fall asleep and get between eight and nine hours sleep and feel fine. But could cope with going to school, college or work even if I only got six hours.

Now after working rotating round the clock shifts for many, many years, things are not so easy.

The trouble is, the shifts reinforce going to sleep late at night. After a late turn, by the time I get home and do everything needed before going to bed, it’s around midnight or slightly later.

After a night turn, I try to go to sleep as soon as possible when I get home, so that I fall asleep before the noise of ‘normal’ people gets going in the daytime. But this means that when I finish the run of nights, I’m awake until around 04:00 in the morning before I fall asleep That messes me up for a few days.

And nowadays, after getting up early for an early turn, if I sit down or worse, lie down when I get home, I often fall asleep. Then wake up hours later. Which means when I do go to bed, I can’t fall asleep early…

Even if I did not go to sleep early, when I was younger, getting up for an early turn was not as difficult as it is now. Lack of sleep nowadays when on early turn is now a hazard I have to take seriously.

Sunlight does not bother me in terms of falling asleep. But I find it very hard to change my sleep pattern to cope with getting up early in the morning. Especially for an early turn shift. And it’s even worse in winter, due to it being pitch dark in the morning.

Over the last few years, waking up in the night has become a problem. I used to be able to go to toilet, get back into bed and fall asleep almost immediately. its not so easy now. My brain finds something to think about and I therefore find it difficult to fall asleep again. So I put on some audio of someone softly chatting that I can listen to. That sometimes helps. But not always. And it sometimes takes over an hour.

 

[route101]

I have noticed when I'm off work and stay in I find it hard to resist an afternoon nap. I try and go to bed before 11 pm for a 6 am wake up. I know when I have not had enough sleep, I have faint fuzzy headache.

 

[Trackman]

About 6-7 hours for me, depends on the shifts.
Like yesterday, went to sleep at 01:30 and was up at 06:00 as bright as a button.
Thing is, after about 4 days of this it creeps up on me so I need a early night or a lie-in, or catch up when I'm off work.
Mrs Trackman normally works splits and is up at 03:30 on working days, comes home then has a nap to catch up on her sleep before the next shift. All habit I guess.

 

[alexf380]

I think I would say I don't get enough sleep, even though I am asleep for between 7 and 8 hours each night, I often find myself waking up to go to work still tired, and will be yawning and feeling groggy for a good hour or so afterwards. Thankfully my shifts at work all start between 06:30 and 08:00 so there's not too much change from day to day. At the other end of the scale, if I've nothing to do one day then I have been known over-sleep and then also feel fatigued. There is no happy medium!

 

[DarloRich]

what is this sleep you speak of?

I go to bed any time between 10pm and midnight. I fall asleep anytime between 1 am and 2 am. I am up at 0700 everyday. If I get 6 hours I class that as a fantastic night. I can (and often do) run on 5 hours and can function for a few days on 4 hours or less. You get used to it.

I am sure it is not good for me ( both physically and mentally) but I just don't sleep. I never have. Please don't suggest anything, I have tried it all and am sick of quackery. Nothing has ever worked, even sleeping tablets!

I feel i have a good routine: screens off an hour before sleep, no phones in the room, no tv, good curtains, good bed, right temperature, reading time in bed etc etc. it seem to make no difference if i go straight from playing football manager to bed or stop an hour before! Funnily I sleep better if someone else is there whereas most people say the opposite!

 

[Jimini]

what is this sleep you speak of?

I go to bed any time between 10pm and midnight. I fall asleep anytime between 1 am and 2 am. I am up at 0700 everyday. If I get 6 hours I class that as a fantastic night. I can (and often do) run on 5 hours and can function for a few days on 4 hours or less. You get used to it.

I am sure it is not good for me ( both physically and mentally) but I just don't sleep. I never have. Please don't suggest anything, I have tried it all and am sick of quackery. Nothing has ever worked, even sleeping tablets!

I feel i have a good routine: screens off an hour before sleep, no phones in the room, no tv, good curtains, good bed, right temperature, reading time in bed etc etc. it seem to make no difference if i go straight from playing football manager to bed or stop an hour before! Funnily I sleep better if someone else is there whereas most people say the opposite!

Have you tried necking a bottle of brandy?

 

[Annetts key]

Funnily I sleep better if someone else is there whereas most people say the opposite!

Having a dog sleeping on your legs does encourage you not to wriggle…

 

[DarloRich]

Have you tried necking a bottle of brandy?

drinking is VERY bad for sleep! It simply turns your brain off. Your body does not rest/refresh. And i don't like Brandy

Having a dog sleeping on your legs does encourage you not to wriggle…

How dare you. You cant call her that

 

[johntea]

I'm certainly more a night owl than a morning person, luckily my current workplace are flexible so I can do 10AM - 6PM otherwise I'm very unproductive

When I was younger I used to have occassions in the day when I would zone out then 'jolt' back awake, went to see the GP but they found nothing out of the ordinary

I still can't go to the cinema as I find myself falling asleep after so long no matter how good (or bad) the film is!

 

[lxfe_mxtterz]

The nature of my work means I tend to go to bed around 1 am on a typical day (providing I speed walk home from the station, run an extraordinarily brief shower, and quickly and forcibly shovel a dinner down my throat).

I do all this with the intention of trying to get a decent amount of sleep each night (i.e. around seven hours), as usually I'll need to be up again the next morning at 8 am - although sometimes as early as 5 am, depending on my shifts.

I do all this, but I'm still tired...

Constantly tired.

I don't know why I'm always tired, but often I spend the first few hours at work in a sort of "zoned-out", energy-lacking daze. Admittedly, I get better throughout the day, and interaction with people certainly gives me the energy I lack initially - I tend to feel "at my prime" and most productive during the evening, before the tiredness starts to kick in again and everything falls off a cliff.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 4 Jan 2023 ==

When I was younger I used to have occassions in the day when I would zone out then 'jolt' back awake, went to see the GP but they found nothing out of the ordinary

I still can't go to the cinema as I find myself falling asleep after so long no matter how good (or bad) the film is!

I'm exactly the same here, if it's uncontrollably dozing off for a few seconds and then "jolting" awake you're referring to. Was never really sure if it was a cause for concern - or even if anyone else was affected by it (I've personally never seen it happen to anyone else).

It happens at all times of day, usually on public transport - on the way to work, on the way back from work, on the way to the shops. It also happens, as you say, when watching a film (either at home or the cinema), even if I'm enjoying the film, and then I get incredibly frustrated that I've missed parts of it!

What I've learnt to do is to lift one foot off the ground and concentrate on keeping it there. Trying to distract myself with my phone or the newspaper on the seat next to me never works - this is evidenced by the number of times I've embarrassed myself and dropped my phone whilst dozing off, to the amusement of my fellow passengers.

 

[Ashley Hill]

Shift work with irregular hours does nothing for my sleep pattern. Going to bed on a Sunday at 1800 to get up again at 2300 often having not slept at all is quite usual. Getting home Monday at 0800 I generally try and grab a couple of hours but then suffer the same problem again at 1800 of going to bed tired but worrying about not sleeping again. By the time my body clock has adjusted to this it’s Thursday and you’re now starting at 0300 in the morning having gone bed at 2000 Wednesday night.
Earlies I generally cope with ok and lates mean a decent lay in.
Only on middle turns do I get a reasonable number of hours sleep.
When I’m off the next day a good few pints the night before ensures a really good sleep (well for me anyway,Mrs H would disagree ).