Prosecution? What will happen next

[Flamingo]

I don't think it would make any difference, if anything commission might encourage some guards to charge the more expensive fare as they will get more money.

 

[SETCommuter]

On a slightly separate note - Is it correct procedure for an employee of a TOC to tell a member of the public they will lose their job ?

 

[Flamingo]

On a slightly separate note - Is it correct procedure for an employee of a TOC to tell a member of the public they will lose their job ?

Explain?

 

[sheff1]

What is there to explain ? If the person did indeed say what was reported in the OP then of course that is not the correct procedure.

 

[Flamingo]

Ok, I thought he was referring to a poster on here.

 

[SETCommuter]

I was referring to the OP

 

[RJ]

On a slightly separate note - Is it correct procedure for an employee of a TOC to tell a member of the public they will lose their job ?

A good way of dealing with these delightful individuals is to report them to their management, ideally with video evidence. Short of that, remind them that they are a ticket inspector who doesn't actually have the power to action this nature of threat. All they can do is file reports and defer to colleagues who have more authority than them. Staff like this need to be reported as they are a let down to the grade and to industry as a whole.

I've lost count of the amount of times I have been reported and told I'll lose my job/never work for the industry again. I go by the book and take steps to ensure the errant inspector is properly put in their place by their superiors.

When I was a ticket inspector, I was pleasant in demeanour to everybody, even those I was enforcing the rules against. I can't stand the authority obsessed cretins in the grade.

 

[leytongabriel]

In the old days (lol),especially as a young person, you'd probably get turfed off the bus or train for having no ticket and have to walk home unless it was pouring with rain and you met a kindly fellow who 'didn't want to catch you doing it again'. This was far more sensible than imposing a fine or penalty on somebody with no money and no ID. Rather like with policing, standardising everything and attaching paperwork to it removes the capacity for making commonsense judgements and it's often the robotic nature of responses that most infuriates the travelling public and leads to the kind of lack of support for revenue protection staff that has been mentioned.

 

[Flamingo]

In the old days (lol),especially as a young person, you'd probably get turfed off the bus or train for having no ticket and have to walk home unless it was pouring with rain and you met a kindly fellow who 'didn't want to catch you doing it again'. This was far more sensible than imposing a fine or penalty on somebody with no money and no ID. Rather like with policing, standardising everything and attaching paperwork to it removes the capacity for making commonsense judgements and it's often the robotic nature of responses that most infuriates the travelling public and leads to the kind of lack of support for revenue protection staff that has been mentioned.

You have just given two entirely opposite scenarios and said both would have happened in "the good old days". Which are you referring to when you say "This was far more sensible"?

 

[RJ]

In the old days (lol),especially as a young person, you'd probably get turfed off the bus or train for having no ticket and have to walk home unless it was pouring with rain and you met a kindly fellow who 'didn't want to catch you doing it again'. This was far more sensible than imposing a fine or penalty on somebody with no money and no ID. Rather like with policing, standardising everything and attaching paperwork to it removes the capacity for making commonsense judgements and it's often the robotic nature of responses that most infuriates the travelling public and leads to the kind of lack of support for revenue protection staff that has been mentioned.

At the end of the day, each ticket inspector has the power of discretion. Some don't like using it because they as an individual do not want to seem weak and must lord all powers vested in them and more over the passengers. These types don't deserve any support, not from the BTP, other passengers or their managers when complaints are made against them. They're simply in the wrong job.

You can't just turf people off trains these days. Ticket inspectors may not have the physical strength, or legal right to do this. As soon as that passenger refuses to move, realistically there is nothing the ticket inspector can do in the immediate term. They can try and phone for help. They can make announcements in the hope that other passengers will become impatient and do the dirty work for them. Or they can have the train halted and delay proceedings whilst the police make their way to the train.

What you describe with respect to taking details and issuing notices is a laid down, civilised procedure. Implemented with some degree of intelligence and support, it can be effective in ensuring the fare is eventually collected. You do get the numbskulls who can't work with procedures however - for example, the numerous inspectors who have called the police and told them outright lies in order to get one over on me. All these malignant people do is delay hundreds of other passengers, waste police time and generate heaps of paperwork for their colleagues. However they do this, not only because they lack the compentency to handle situations appropriately, but because they feel they can do so with complete impunity. In all cases, these staff refuse to take my details and issue a TIR/UFN, even when I have stated I'm willing to provide them - they would far sooner do it your way and inconvenience scores of other people. It's all very well having archaic views on how to deal with fare disputes, but times have changed and people should learn how to adapt. As a passenger, it is far more infuriating to be delayed because a guard doesn't want to dispatch the train until a fare dispute is resolved, than it is to see them handling the situation tactfully without causing disruption.

A smart and competent ticket inspector is able to comport their duties without endangering their own safety or that of other passengers, whilst avoiding causing unnecessary delays.

 

[Ferret]

Haha, I wish we could recruit RJ to our training school! An eminently sensible post there sir.