Prosecution Letter

[maniacmartin]

Remember we can only choose from maps LB, LK, PD, SC or WX, and that a season ticket can be use for starting and leaving at any intermediate station on a permitted route.

Journey 1
Using Map SC

We need to find a route between Clapham Junction and a London Terminal that is on the map and doesn't pass through the same station twice:

Clapham Junction - Mitcham Junction - Sutton - Wimbledon - Tooting - Streatham - Tulse Hill - Herne Hill - Blackfriars

Joining at intermediate station Tooting and leaving at intermediate station Herne Hill


Journey 2
Using Map LK

We need to find a route between Clapham Junction and a London Terminal that is on the map and doesn't pass through the same station twice:

Clapham Junction - Streatham - Crystal Palace - Beckenham Junction - Herne Hill - Victoria

Joining at intermediate station Herne Hill and leaving at Victoria.


As you have a point to point season and not a Travelcard, zones are not relevant to the valdiity of the ticket.

I should note that you were lucky on this occasion as you happened to always be on a permitted route and have a season ticket that let you split your route into two separate "journeys". Also, the Train Companies are planning to overhaul the permitted routes in the coming months, so subsequent season tickets may not be valid for this route.
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http://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/Vict/52-53/57/section/5

But the OP did have a valid ticket, so the premise of that sentence fails. The only sticking point is the Railway Byelaw quoted by michael769 above (which the OP should note is a separate piece of legislation from the Regulation of Raiwlays Act (RoRA)). FCC could potentially still prosecute under this for providing a false address.

 

[London1234]

I understand this and I feel very lucky to be this flukey. It has hopefully helped me miss a court summons and HEFTY fine.

Your help has been invaluable to me and I really appreciate it. thanks so much.

How will we know when this overhaul has happened?
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oh and just to be clear - the fact that I didnt pass through clapham on this journey is irrelevant because I can exit and join at any intermediate station that falls within these maps?

wow, I think i'm getting it. Maybe I should become a train buff!

 

[Yew]

the point here Yew is that I did pay my fare and that my ticket was valid. if this is the case then giving an address in the first place is un-necessary
I am correct in thinking this?

My personal belief is that you could not be sucsessfully prosecuted under this the RORA, but I have no legal training. I was merely including the quote to allow you to see exactly what was said, as it was only paraphrased above.

 

[John @ home]

London1234, due to the complexity of this issue, I recommend that you do not attempt to deal with it by telephone. Instead, I think you should draft a reply to the precise questions asked by the train company and send this by private message to be checked by one of the Fares Advisors.

 

[London1234]

happy for any input Yew

Maniacmartin - Please can you ignore my last question. I know what i said was true as I've just re-read one of your earlier posts. DOH! was getting ahead of myself wth the train buff comment
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john@home -

maybe this is a good idea. I am not going to go into too much detail. just outline that my ticket was valid because of the route planner and terms of conditions of the ticket. I always thought the ticket was valid but did not want to get into a heated debate with the conductor as i was embarrassed and flustered and of course, who would want to argue with the professional? but, I made my situation worse by giving an incorrect address.

I will however write and post my letter tonight (privately of course) to see what some of you think. If you can spare the expertise.

 

[Urban Gateline]

You will find that Clapham to London Terminals is valid via Lancaster or Doncaster.

Ok you got me there! I meant Clapham Junction

 

[maniacmartin]

The OP has got back to me with the outcome of this.

The OP contacted FCC with a summary of the points raised in this thread, and FCC have since replied saying that they will not be pursuing the matter any further.

 

[bb21]

Excellent result. The OP was very lucky this time tbh. I hope that a lesson has been learnt.

 

[CNash]

The lesson being... what, exactly? The OP's ticket was valid, although they didn't know it at the time!

 

[maniacmartin]

The lesson being don't try to avoid the fare, as next time you may not happen to possess a ticket that's valid that you didn't know about

 

[bb21]

The lesson being... what, exactly? The OP's ticket was valid, although they didn't know it at the time!

The OP's intention is pretty clear by his own account. He even admitted himself that it is a fluke.

 

[455driver]

The lesson being... what, exactly? The OP's ticket was valid, although they didn't know it at the time!

Only by luck, not judgement/ knowledge.

Actually (being pedantic) the OPs ticket wasnt valid as they had not actually made the journey (and breaks) that would make the ticket valid, it is only by telling a lie that the ticket is (classed as) valid!

 

[maniacmartin]

Actually (being pedantic) the OPs ticket wasnt valid as they had not actually made the journey (and breaks) that would make the ticket valid, it is only by telling a lie that the ticket is (classed as) valid!

The ticket is valid. Please refer to post #31. One can start and finish at any intermediate station on a season ticket, without previously travelled from the ticket's origin station. NRE and the NRCoC are very clear about this.