Prosecution Letter Received for Incorrect Ticket

[1motm]

Hi All,

Please can I seek advise to settle out of court for my current situation with Govia Thameslink.

I was traveling from Clapham Junction to Gatwick Airport on Nov14th 2024 and intended to tap out with my contactless card even though I did not tap in at the start of my journey. When I arrived at Gatwick station, I saw multiple officers at the exit barriers checking for tickets - this made me panic and I purchased a ticket from Horley to Gatwick Airport to show when they asked (even though I should have just tapped out using contactless card) - I used my valid Railcard when purchasing this ticket. When I got to the ticket officer, they said I just purchased the ticket and that it was invalid and wrote me a ticket (explaining that I will be fined and will receive letter communication about it in the coming weeks). I explained that I travelled from Clapham Junction and also did purchase the shortened journey ticket to show them to exit.

Since then I have received an initial letter which I replied to stating the above and that I planned to use contactless card to exit, but they have now sent me a Prosecution letter to plead Guilty or Not Guilty. Is there any way that I can write or speak to them to explain my situation and also extend my sincere apologies and to ask if this can be settled out of court (I don't want the criminal conviction on my record due to my job and visa status)?

Any advice on this would be much appreciated - the Prosecution letter has as a Phone number to contact Govia Thameslink as well as an address to send a letter I presume.

Lastly, just want to add that this is my first offence - which I hope may help to settle this out of court once I know the angle to approach them.

Thank you all !

 

[Pushpit]

It's a bit unusual since normally that railway company tends to offer out of court settlements quite readily.

Perhaps you could share the text of your letter to Govia? And the more GTR recent letter, but carefully removing all personal information and reference numbers. I'm wondering if they found fault in something you said. Perhaps they didn't receive it? In other words, did they reference it in their second letter? But it does sound odd - if you tap in, you have to tap out, otherwise why tap in? Buying Horley to Gatwick is almost like putting on a red hat with the words "Fare Evader" all over it.

 

[1motm]

It's a bit unusual since normally that railway company tends to offer out of court settlements quite readily.

Perhaps you could share the text of your letter to Govia? And the more GTR recent letter, but carefully removing all personal information and reference numbers. I'm wondering if they found fault in something you said. Perhaps they didn't receive it? In other words, did they reference it in their second letter? But it does sound odd - if you tap in, you have to tap out, otherwise why tap in? Buying Horley to Gatwick is almost like putting on a red hat with the words "Fare Evader" all over it.

Hi - thanks for the reply. I will upload images of the most recent prosecution letter tomorrow. I also find it unusual that they did not consider that I was using contactless, but I presume purchasing that Horley ticket did not help me at all and they may have overlooked the contactless due to this. Any idea on how to contact them to ask forgiveness and an out of court settlement?

 

[Pushpit]

If you did not tap out then presumably there is a Maximum Fare showing on your account, and I would also presume this does not cover the whole amount owed for the journey you took. But this is speculation on my part, we best get the details from you as to what you did and what you have told GTR.

 

[BostonGeorge]

If you did not tap out then presumably there is a Maximum Fare showing on your account

The wording of "Intended to tap out with my contactless card" makes me believe this card was not used to tap in, hence the absolute panic when seeing the revenue officers at the gate line. So, I very much doubt there would be a maximum fare on the bank statement.

This sounds like a clear case of bang to rights. But I'm happy to stand corrected.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 15 Mar 2025 ==

Just to clarify, if my understanding of your post is correct, your defence of planning to use your contactless card to exit wouldn't hold much water if you entered the network without paying. If a person enters without paying, it stands to reason their most likely intention is to also exit without paying.

 

[1motm]

The wording of "Intended to tap out with my contactless card" makes me believe this card was not used to tap in, hence the absolute panic when seeing the revenue officers at the gate line. So, I very much doubt there would be a maximum fare on the bank statement.

This sounds like a clear case of bang to rights. But I'm happy to stand corrected.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 15 Mar 2025 ==

Just to clarify, if my understanding of your post is correct, your defence of planning to use your contactless card to exit wouldn't hold much water if you entered the network without paying. If a person enters without paying, it stands to reason their most likely intention is to also exit without paying.

Correct - I agree with both of you and I am in the wrong as I did not tap in. I know that I am in the wrong and would really appreciate any advice on how to navigate a settlement out of court. I have 18 days to reply to the prosecution letter so was hoping to get into contact with them ASAP to try and ask for this once I know the best avenue to take.

*I have edited the initial thread post to account for this to ensure clarity for other users when reading.

 

[WesternLancer]

Correct - I agree with both of you and I am in the wrong as I did not tap in. I know that I am in the wrong and would really appreciate any advice on how to navigate a settlement out of court. I have 18 days to reply to the prosecution letter so was hoping to get into contact with them ASAP to try and ask for this once I know the best avenue to take.

*I have edited the initial thread post to account for this to ensure clarity for other users when reading.

See other threads related to Thameslink for the general advice given on how best to reply to avoid prosecution in court. Numerous cases on here with Govia thameslink railway. Should be quick for you to find, read and what to write in your reply.

Read those. Draft your own reply. Post it here first for people to check and give you feedback.

 

[1motm]

See other threads related to Thameslink for the general advice given on how best to reply to avoid prosecution in court. Numerous cases on here with Govia thameslink railway. Should be quick for you to find, read and what to write in your reply.

Read those. Draft your own reply. Post it here first for people to check and give you feedback.

Thanks - I will have another look but just wanted to have people's advice given my position of having the prosecution letter - is it better for me to communicate to them to apologise and ask for an out of court settlement via phone contact or letter communication..?

 

[furlong]

Please provide details of the charge and evidence - e.g. copies of the court paperwork you've received (with any personal details covered up).

And how did you get inside Clapham Junction if you didn't tap in there? Was there another part of the journey before that?

(They aren't likely to settle if they can't make sense out of your story.)

 

[Hadders]

It is unusual for GTR to prosecute these sort of cases, they normally settle them by offering an out of court settlement.

We really need to see all of the paperwork relating to this case, including the reply you sent to their initial letter. Can you upload redacted copies in this thread and we will advise next steps. This is urgent as I assume there is a short timescale to reply to the court paperwork.

My initial view is that court papers have been issued because:

- The initial reply sent by @1motm went astray and did not get to GTR; or
- GTR didn't consider the reply co-operateive enough to offer an out of court settlement

 

[1motm]

Hi all,

Please see my reply to the initial letter as well as the entire Prosecution letter attached - unfortunately I do not have their initial letter saved anywhere. I agree with Hadders that they maybe did not think I was co-operative enough, hence the desire to now apologise even more once I know the correct avenue to proceed down.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 15 Mar 2025 ==

Follow up to include the rest of the prosecution letter. Thanks all for the help!

 

[Pushpit]

So it sounds like you told GTR in the letter that you tapped in, when in fact you didn't do so? Plus there was no apology and no undertaking not to do this again.

The paperwork suggests to me that somehow your original letter wasn't received, simply because that's normally what happens here. But regardless, now is probably the time for contrition and apologies to GTR, just in case they relent on the plan to prosecute you.

 

[WesternLancer]

So it sounds like you told GTR in the letter that you tapped in, when in fact you didn't do so? Plus there was no apology and no undertaking not to do this again.

The paperwork suggests to me that somehow your original letter wasn't received, simply because that's normally what happens here. But regardless, now is probably the time for contrition and apologies to GTR, just in case they relent on the plan to prosecute you.

I also think this is a good plan

 

[Hadders]

Thanks for uploading everything. The reply you sent to GTR isn't the best but I'm sure GTR have received much worse in the past and settled. I agree with @Pushpit in wondering if they received your email.

I would contact them urgently and ask if they received it. It's also an opportunity to briefely say that you are sorry, what you've learned etc and ask if they will consider offering you an out of court settlement in return for withdrawing the case from court.

The date to return the paperwork to the court is 2nd April so you've got a bit of time, but not loads. You need a positive reply from GTR and to have paid a settlement before then.

 

[Pushpit]

Actually in the circumstances, it would be best if they didn't get that earlier letter, since it would not help the OP if they were asked for details about their Oyster card. And that's the problem with building lies upon lies. I would suggest a blistering honest apology now, and retracting that earlier letter. Unless of course there are further details not yet disclosed....

 

[1motm]

Thanks all - I will reach out to GTR to apologies profusely and also to ask if they will consider offering me an out of court settlement in return for withdrawing the case from court. Do you guys know if calling them would be the best communication channel or if I should write to them again (if I write there may be a chance they do not receive the letter). Also, if anybody has an email address I can write to that would be great - the Prosecution letter only provided a phone number and written letter address to contact GTR by.

Lastly, is it alright for me to submit a draft of what I will communicate to GTR for any comments/edits that would help my case be settled out of court?

Thanks again to all!

 

[Hadders]

Actually in the circumstances, it would be best if they didn't get that earlier letter, since it would not help the OP if they were asked for details about their Oyster card. And that's the problem with building lies upon lies. I would suggest a blistering honest apology now, and retracting that earlier letter. Unless of course there are further details not yet disclosed....

Agreed.

If it were me I would say you'd written and ask if they received it but not forward a copy of what you wrote. Concentrate on a proper response/apology in the new email.

Lastly, is it alright for me to submit a draft of what I will communicate to GTR for any comments/edits that would help my case be settled out of court?

Of course.

 

[AlterEgo]

I think you need to recant the original version of events entirely, because at best your correspondence with them was disingenuous and at worst was dishonest. This is why you are being prosecuted and they haven’t settled.

 

[1motm]

Agreed.

If it were me I would say you'd written and ask if they received it but not forward a copy of what you wrote. Concentrate on a proper response/apology in the new email.


Of course.

Sounds good - can someone please provide me an email address to contact them as I do not have this for GTR, thanks . I will post a draft email when ready.

 

[WesternLancer]

Thanks all - I will reach out to GTR to apologies profusely and also to ask if they will consider offering me an out of court settlement in return for withdrawing the case from court. Do you guys know if calling them would be the best communication channel or if I should write to them again (if I write there may be a chance they do not receive the letter). Also, if anybody has an email address I can write to that would be great - the Prosecution letter only provided a phone number and written letter address to contact GTR by.

Lastly, is it alright for me to submit a draft of what I will communicate to GTR for any comments/edits that would help my case be settled out of court?

Thanks again to all!

Don’t try to ring them. You’ll never get through to anyone with decision making ability. E mail their prosecutions e mail address and send the same thing gauranteed delivery by Royal Mail on Monday too. Get a postal tracking receipt from the post office so you know it arrives.

 

[1motm]

Hi All,

Please see my draft email / letter below (I utilised drafts on other email threads) and let me know if any edits are required. I received an email confirmation that they received my previous letter, so have addressed that accordingly (see screenshot). The email address that I found for GTR is: gtr.prosecutions@gtrailway.com - I just want to ensure that this is the correct email address to send to tomorrow along with a guaranteed delivery letter.

---- Email / Letter Draft ----

To The Prosecutions Department - Govia Thameslink Railway,

I am writing regarding the following Prosecution Case No: GTRXXXXXX (URN: 00/XXXXX/XX) and want to apologise and take accountability for not travelling with a correct ticket on 14th November.

Firstly, I responded to my initial letter and had confirmation of receival from Govia Thameslink Railway, but have since received another Prosecution letter since.

I deeply regret my actions and understand the severity of the consequences actions such as mine have for the railway companies as well as other passengers. I have learned my lesson and will not be repeating this mistake again. Since 14th November, I have ensured to purchase the correct fares for my journeys, as I should have always done.

I would be very grateful if you would allow me to settle this matter with GTR by paying all my dues as well as any administration fee that this investigation has incurred for you out of court. Please send me details of what I owe and I will ensure to pay the amount as soon as possible. I again apologise for my poor judgement and assure you of my willingness to cooperate with GTR to pay what I owe and behave more responsibly henceforth.

Thank you for your consideration.

Kind regards,

Mr XXX XXXXX.

----------

Thanks again for all of your advice and help !

 

[Pushpit]

I think that's a good response. Yours faithfully would be a more formal valediction but it doesn't really matter. And yes, send it via both email and letter.

 

[Hadders]

Looks ok to me. Please let us know how you get on.

 

[1motm]

Thanks all - will send this tomorrow. Any other contributions are most welcome before I send it off tomorrow .

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 17 Mar 2025 ==

I sent the letter and email today, but received the attached automated email response when emailing: gtr.prosecutions@gtrailway.com. In the email response, it states that: If you are writing in response to an "Intention to Prosecute" letter, this needs to be done in writing along with the reference number on the letter, so I assume the letter I sent should be received and read.

With that being said, is there any other email addresses that I can send my letter to in hopes that it reaches the correct GTR team?

Thanks all!

 

[WesternLancer]

Thanks all - will send this tomorrow. Any other contributions are most welcome before I send it off tomorrow .

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 17 Mar 2025 ==

I sent the letter and email today, but received the attached automated email response when emailing: gtr.prosecutions@gtrailway.com. In the email response, it states that: If you are writing in response to an "Intention to Prosecute" letter, this needs to be done in writing along with the reference number on the letter, so I assume the letter I sent should be received and read.

With that being said, is there any other email addresses that I can send my letter to in hopes that it reaches the correct GTR team?

Thanks all!

No other e mail addresses I don’t think. They want it posted hard copy so you must do that. Get it tracked postage.

Having said that we do occasionally see them respond to e mails despite that auto reply. But don’t rely on that.

 

[1motm]

Hi All,

Yes - I sent a tracked letter yesterday, so hoping for it to arrive today. I also received an email reply today (attached) - should I just mention that I sent a letter to them yesterday and it is likely to be recevied by them today/tomorrow?

Thanks.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 18 Mar 2025 ==

Update - looks like the email (or letter) worked. Thanks all!

 

[WesternLancer]

Hi All,

Yes - I sent a tracked letter yesterday, so hoping for it to arrive today. I also received an email reply today (attached) - should I just mention that I sent a letter to them yesterday and it is likely to be recevied by them today/tomorrow?

Thanks.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 18 Mar 2025 ==

Update - looks like the email (or letter) worked. Thanks all!

Thanks for update - my instinct is this is good outcome and the sum asked for is not excessive - so after you have had a think about it I would expect you are probably willing to pay it.

Out of courtesy to them, and when you have decided, you could of course thank them for this, indicate that you are going to pay (if you are) and advise them that you also sent your response as a letter which will arrive but they can ignore the letter given they have responded to you directly by e-mail.

 

[1motm]

Sent them a courtesy email and will also pay before the deadline - thanks all!

 

[Pushpit]

Sent them a courtesy email and will also pay before the deadline - thanks all!

It's good that you have had this settlement. I would however advise paying it as soon as possible, even though they have given you a few weeks. Firstly people forget, secondly the IT system for payment can go down and finally there are occasional cases where offers get withdrawn.

Thanks also to the GTR Lurker monitoring this thread for the swift resolution.......

 

[Hadders]

This is a good result, all things considered. Thanks for updating us.