Priority seats

[Chester1]

I have had an infuriating situation on a TfW train. Two women in their 50s taking up two priority seats each, one for their cases each. I asked if one of them could put their case in the vestibule so that my pregnant wife could sit down. Both were annoyed with the request and told me to ask someone else to stand up. I wasn't willing to start asking random people to stand up, so they sat there with a visably pregnant woman standing next to them for 20 minutes.

Unfortunately the guard was nowhere to be found. How normal is this situation? I wouldn't sit in those circumstances. They had clearly chosen the priority seats for convience with their cases and pressumably expected some random guy to give up their seats. What is the best way for her to handle train travel in next couple of months? We were travelling on a train that was normally not especially busy but appears to have been short formed.

 

[Kite159]

Sadly some passengers are selfish when it comes to priority seats (or even giving up their seat if they see someone who is more in need)

 

[Dr Hoo]

The most effective solution I ever saw was on a Sheffield tram. A group of scholars had joined and sat in all the Priority Seats.
At the next stop a very frail chap with a stick and a younger companion joined.
The companion immediately spoke up with a parade ground voice “WHICH OF YOU YOUNG PEOPLE IS GOING TO VACATE A PRIORITY SEAT SO THIS GENTLEMAN CAN SIT DOWN”.
All of the youngsters sprang up and the conductor came from the other end of the set to see what was going on.
Worked like a charm!

 

[spyinthesky]

If there were no other seats to sit on, personally I would have grown some and dealt with it myself.

 

[WillC]

Pick up bag, move bag, sit down. Bags on seat are not tolerable.

 

[Chester1]

If it was not especially busy then why not just sit somewhere else? You give the impression it's packed to the gunwales but also say it wasn't especially busy.

Sorry to clarify the service is "not normally especially busy" i.e. there are normally seats free when I take the service. It is normally three coaches but only two today and all seats were taken with maybe a dozen people standing in each coach.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: Saturday at 19:52 ==

If there were no other seats to sit on, personally I would have grown some and dealt with it myself.

How do you propose I do that when the offenders are two middle aged women? As soon as I did more than ask them to move and emphasised pregnant woman they would have been the victim.

 

[JamieL]

Unfortunately some people are very selfish. Personally, I would have continued down the carriage and asked if someone else wouldn't mind moving. I think a lot of people would move in that circumstance and it would likely cause the two ladies a little embarrassment when you described their unwillingness to remove their bags from the priority seats. I would also file a complaint with TfW for their lack of onboard assistance and formally ask their guidance on what you should do. You could then post that reply here.

 

[sh24]

I would have asked nicely, then directly, and then removed the case and placed in the aisle.

 

[JamieL]

I would have asked nicely, then directly, and then removed the case and placed in the aisle.

I do agree with Chester1 though that moving the bags could put him in a difficult position. I am (guessing) he is in his 20s/30s and male so when he goes to move the bag, what would happen? My guess would be the two women start shouting and screaming and trying to stop him. That would create a disturbance which, at first glance, could look like a man trying to bully or intimidate others. What would it look like on CCTV that probably doesn't have sound to capture the initial request?

 

[sh24]

I do agree with Chester1 though that moving the bags could put him in a difficult position. I am (guessing) he is in his 20s/30s and male so when he goes to move the bag, what would happen? My guess would be the two women start shouting and screaming and trying to stop him. That would create a disturbance which, at first glance, could look like a man trying to bully or intimidate others. What would it look like on CCTV that probably doesn't have sound to capture the initial request?

The presence of a visibly pregnant woman with him would deflect any tension, surely?

 

[Chester1]

I do agree with Chester1 though that moving the bags could put him in a difficult position. I am (guessing) he is in his 20s/30s and male so when he goes to move the bag, what would happen? My guess would be the two women start shouting and screaming and trying to stop him. That would create a disturbance which, at first glance, could look like a man trying to bully or intimidate others. What would it look like on CCTV that probably doesn't have sound to capture the initial request?

Yes I am male and in my 30s, they were female and 50s and that was my concern.

The presence of a visibly pregnant woman with him would deflect any tension, surely?

I am not convinced by that. It wasn't really an option anyway because they had placed the cases on the window seats. I would have had to lift it over them.

Unfortunately some people are very selfish. Personally, I would have continued down the carriage and asked if someone else wouldn't mind moving. I think a lot of people would move in that circumstance and it would likely cause the two ladies a little embarrassment when you described their unwillingness to remove their bags from the priority seats. I would also file a complaint with TfW for their lack of onboard assistance and formally ask their guidance on what you should do. You could then post that reply here.

I am fairly sure that the people in the next 3 rows heard the conversation and presumably thought it was someone elses responsibility to give up their seat. I think I will contact TfW because the Mrs has a few more weeks before she can work from home every day and after that I can't guarantee we can avoid train travel for other reasons.

 

[Dr Hoo]

Can the OP clarify which route and possibly even which type of stock was involved? It does make a difference to the situation. Putting luggage in a vestibule on a Class 158 for example would block an exit.
How many TfW trains don’t have gangways throughout? Were there any intermediate stops where the guard would have been by a doorway?

The situation described is totally unacceptable and I would have been very assertive on behalf of a pregnant companion.

 

[Chester1]

Can the OP clarify which route and possibly even which type of stock was involved? It does make a difference to the situation. Putting luggage in a vestibule on a Class 158 for example would block an exit.
How many TfW trains don’t have gangways throughout? Were there any intermediate stops where the guard would have been by a doorway?

The situation described is totally unacceptable and I would have been very assertive on behalf of a pregnant companion.

It was a 197 on Manchester to Holyhead. I will go further down the social embarassment route if it happens again. I was extremely surprised to be in the situation and didn't want to escalate too far. Fortunately we got seats after one stop. My concern is journeys over next few weeks when she is travelling alone to and from work and is unlikely to be prepared to make a scene if she can't find a seat.

 

[WillC]

I think this scenario is becoming more common. I witnessed a couple plus bags occupying a table who refused to move a bag for a lady recently. There were a couple of other free seats but she wanted to face forwards (which they weren’t). I did consider intervening (physically removing the offending bag) but sometimes you just don’t want the confrontation after a long day. Fairly disgusted by bags on seats on busy services to be honest.

 

[Dr Hoo]

It was a 197 on Manchester to Holyhead. I will go further down the social embarassment route if it happens again. I was extremely surprised to be in the situation and didn't want to escalate too far. Fortunately we got seats after one stop. My concern is journeys over next few weeks when she is travelling alone to and from work and is unlikely to be prepared to make a scene if she can't find a seat.

I see zero social embarrassment to you or your good lady in asserting her needs. All of the social embarrassment will fall on the selfish individual(s) who refuse to clear a seat and are called out in front of a carriage full of other passengers.

I hope that the lady has a conspicuous ‘Baby On Board’ badge to wear on public transport.

I also suggest that she tries to always board the train at the door that the guard is working from. Once the guard turns away from watching the platform on departure and ‘keys out’, to then politely ask them to direct them to a vacant Priority Seat.

Any failure to provide the assistance reasonably requested to be reported promptly to TfW (or other applicable operator).