Almost certainly not - Lumo have taken on 222s because they are available now convertable into 6 car trains, but they’re only temporary until they are replaced by bimode 80x that are currently on order. 221s provide no advantage over the existing plans.
Its Railforums bingo, just becuase a route existed in the 60s it needs to come back.
It still does exist - at least, last time I looked there was
What trains do Nottingham Carlisle?
Isn’t there one once a week on a Sunday?
Normally a three car 158 or a pair of two cars
Can't find it.
When?
Starts Sheffield, not Nottingham - https://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/service/gb-nr:Y24458/2026-02-22/detailed - but inventing services just to use Voyagers isn't the right answer.
The first thing to do is to
stock is currently running! Extra stock will just be wasted if "they" haven't sorted out their traincrew policy or recruited and trained more staff...
There did use to be a Nottingham-Carlisle though. I know because I once used it myself, so maybe it was lost in the recent timetable changes
Interesting, and how long is a typical Voyager - 4 cars ?
Actually Portsmouth-Cardiff is operated about half by 158, others by ex suburban 165 or ex outer suburban 166.
Why not go the whole hog, and combine the EMR Nottingham London and this. Am sure it'll be full and standing the whole way ...
In my opinion i could be wrong with all of this but i think it's a bit harsh to say there badly designed. I understand why you may say that as there not suited for current cross country fleet as they are not high capacity trains which cross country now need however you have to think back when they was ordered the route isn't of what it is now days. Back then it wasn't even a half hourly core section as virgin brought that in later on which then brought more and more passengers between Birmingham and leeds primarily.
I wouldn't think they would take then as if they wanted more they would took more of the 222s however they didn't so atleast for now untill there's a frequency increase and they take the rest of the unused 222s are scrapped ir elsewhere I would think lumo is a option plus when they have proofed out the route they may opt for a Hitachi like firsts other ops have like lumo on the east coast and hull trains.
Mabey scotrail?These are all pretty reasonable suggestions.
...the bit in bold, is a good reason to reintroduce the Thames-Clyde express (North of Nottingham at least)*sound the forum cliche klaxon*. If they did operate Leeds-Carlisle they'd still be able to stretch their legs on the Airedale line section. The line may be able to cope better with their weight than some other suggestions due to it being engineered to mainline standards, big windows for the views would be a plus too.
I think you have rather missed the point of the introduction of the Voyagers in the first place. The whole idea was that they enabled the frequency increase that Virgin brought in with "Operation Pumpkin". Given that the objective was to grow the business signifcantly, specifying a train fleet that offered less capacity than the old fleet was absolutely brain dead by Virgin. They have not been fit for purpose from day one, with the same flaws that are talked of now applying from the start: an abysmal internal layout that minimises space for seating with low capacity in consequence, exacerbated by the trains being of too short a length.
Thanks.
I think re-engineering them is out of the question, but if they were reformed into 6/7 carriages as suggested on here they could be made more useful and a 7 carriage train would probably be more useful than an 8 carriage voyager formation because you wouldn’t have two additional cabs and you wouldn’t need a second first class section either. There’d be wastage, but no additional cost and the spare driving vehicles could be stripped for parts.
Because a 2 car Turbo is brilliant for the route?
For a service that stops on average every 12 minutes, something that looks like a Turbo is going to be more appropriate than an end doored Voyager. If you replaced it with a 4 car Voyager you would gain a mere 14 seats.
Well simply put. It would be a good stopgap as I’m pretty sure any customer would prefer a Voyager over a turbo. A turbo currently is the perfect train to give you back pain on a route that long.
They are serviced at Crofton, but GC still run them to Central Rivers occasionally. Thus, they can work away from there as long as they cycle back occasionally.
A good stopgap for whom? If a four car Class 22x cannot provide an enhancement in seated capacity over a two (or four!) car Class 15x, I don't see how the economics would add up.
I was talking about the Class 165 since the seats are unbearable. If the railway believes their ticket need to be expensive. Then they better damn right give the customer a proper train with proper seating.
