Possible ScotRail EMU shuffle

[drb61]

I've been speculating on how ScotRail's EMU fleet might be reshuffled once the 41 replacement units for the 318s/320s are in service. AIUI they are to be formed as 5 or 6 car units and my guess is that they will be concentrated on routes currently operated mostly be 6 car 318s/320s/334s and that the 334s will be cascaded onto or concentrated on routes that only need 3 car units off-peak or 6 car units during the peaks. Thinking something along the lines of:

334s: Inverclyde, Paisley Canal, Cathcart Circle, Newton (off-peak), Neilston (peak - 6 coach), Dalmuir - Whifflet - Motherwell, Springburn - Milngavie

380s: Ayrshire, Newton (peak - 4 coach), Neilston (off-peak - 4 coach), Barrhead (increased to 2tph), East Kilbride

385s: Lanark, Shotts, Carstairs, North Berwick, Edinburgh- Falkirk - Glasgow, Alloa, Dunblane, Cumbernauld, Falkirk Grahamton

3xx (new 5x23m or 6x20m units): Edinburgh - Helensburgh, Airdrie - Balloch, Cumbernauld - Motherwell / Larkhall - Dalmuir, Edinburgh - Milngavie (peak)

 

[SC318250]

Dont think the Class 334 work well on the Cathcart/Neilston lines.. prone to overheating

Think I read Scotrail were hoping that Ayrshire/Inverclyde would be all 380 operated

 

[tfw756rider]

Not the main point, but I'd be surprised if 3xx numbering was used. I think 7xx is more likely unless they'll be more Hitachi AT200s (385s/386s/whatever).

 

[Ben Conlin]

Are the 334s not pretty self contained on the Glasgow-Edinburgh via Airdrie and Bathgate line? I know there’s one or two on the Argyle line and some on the North Clyde. Would it not make sense to keep them where they are for now and then replace them in a follow up order. By the time the order of 41 are delivered it they’ll be nearing their mid 30s and a follow up order to have a uniform fleet would make sense?

 

[380101]

Very unlikely that the 334s will come back to the south side of the Clyde. The additional training time and costs to train Central, Shields and Corkerhill drivers on 334s ontop of the new EMUs would be massive.

As mentioned above, the 334s are well entrenched on the Helensburgh - Airdrie - Bathgate - Edinburgh route.

 

[drb61]

As I see it, the issue with keeping the 334s on their existing routes though and simply replacing the existing 318/320 diagrams with the new units is that you'd end up with 5/6 coach units running around the Cathcart Circle, Newton, Paisley Canal, Whifflet, and Springburn routes half-empty on diagrams more suited to 3 car units and this could leave the other Argyle Line and North Clyde routes short of suitable stock for the diagrams currently operated by 6 car units.

There are precedents for EMU shuffles in the past - when the 334s started operating Ayrshire services, the 318s moved onto the Argyle Line and North Clyde routes, whilst the 314s were moved south of the river. Then when Ayrshire got the 380s the 334s were then displaced from Ayrshire onto the Bathgate services.

I think it unlikely Ayrshire will get the new stock next time round though as a number of the Ayr diagrams are formed of 7 coaches and doubling up of the new units to 10/12 coaches seems unlikely.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 24 Sep 2025 ==

Dont think the Class 334 work well on the Cathcart/Neilston lines.. prone to overheating

Wasn't that the 385s that suffered from overheating on the Cathcart Circle?

 

[Ben Conlin]

As I see it, the issue with keeping the 334s on their existing routes though and simply replacing the existing 318/320 diagrams with the new units is that you'd end up with 5/6 coach units running around the Cathcart Circle, Newton, Paisley Canal, Whifflet, and Springburn routes half-empty on diagrams more suited to 3 car units and this could leave the other Argyle Line and North Clyde routes short of suitable stock for the diagrams currently operated by 6 car units.

There are precedents for EMU shuffles in the past - when the 334s started operating Ayrshire services, the 318s moved onto the Argyle Line and North Clyde routes, whilst the 314s were moved south of the river. Then when Ayrshire got the 380s the 334s were then displaced from Ayrshire onto the Bathgate services.

I think it unlikely Ayrshire will get the new stock next time round though as a number of the Ayr diagrams are formed of 7 coaches and doubling up of the new units to 10/12 coaches seems unlikely.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 24 Sep 2025 ==


Wasn't that the 385s that suffered from overheating on the Cathcart Circle?

From one of the previous threads on the potential order it was mentioned that the EMU order could be fully formed of 120M units that would replace all 318/320s with the equivalent of what are 6 car units currently. Surely that would mean an increase in capacity regardless as the only 3 car units that would remain would be 334s. I suspect the tender will have options included to replace the 334s in a follow up. I suspect the idea being that by mid 2030s that all of the low level suburban type service will all be a single fleet of 6 car equivalent single units. Unless they decide to order a few shorter units as a cost saving measure