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It would be pretty funny to see an 'Activate Windows' warning on the TMS...
Anyway, getting slightly back on topic, are there any EMU fleets that could theoretically be used elsewhere once they have been reformed? Like the 508s dropping to three cars when they were transferred to Merseyside.
It has been reported that 379s use a Linux derivative. Surprised that the 387s are different; will certainly explain some of the difficulties in cascading the 379s.
It has been reported that 379s use a Linux derivative. Surprised that the 387s are different; will certainly explain some of the difficulties in cascading the 379s.
Is there a difficulty cascading 379s? I thought it was just that they aren't currently needed anywhere / no one wants to pay for them.
On the subject of AC EMU cascades, it still isn't clear how Greater Anglia propose to use the further 58 720s not yet in service when they are only replacing 33 remaining 321s that aren't fully utilised.
Equally, whether c2c are going to give up some 357s when all of their 720s are in service.
Is there a difficulty cascading 379s? I thought it was just that they aren't currently needed anywhere / no one wants to pay for them.
On the subject of AC EMU cascades, it still isn't clear how Greater Anglia propose to use the further 58 720s not yet in service when they are only replacing 33 remaining 321s that aren't fully utilised.
Equally, whether c2c are going to give up some 357s when all of their 720s are in service.
GA will be running more 10 car trains in the future than they do now; In addition there is talk that the 720s will be taking over the Stansted Express services completely
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@dk1 reported in another thread that they were looking at ordering more 745/0s. That would not be happening if GA was already flush with stock.
It is important to note that before covid there was talk that the 720 fleet was too small for all the services it was scheduled to operate. This is probably no longer true, but I doubt it's very spacious either
GA will be running more 10 car trains in the future than they do now; In addition there is talk that the 720s will be taking over the Stansted Express services completely
Yes, but even if 10-car 720s replace 8-car 321s, the increase in fleet size isn't needed, and for every pair of 720s used on Stansted Express, a 745 replaces a pair of 720s on the GEML routes.
There must be about 25 spare 720s in the GA order with nowhere to use them as the frequency of services expected in the original order is not going to transpire.
Yes, I understand that is why they were ordered, but leasing twelve extra trains adds cost to the operation at a time when the DfT / Treasury is desperate to find ways to reduce the cost of the railway.
Yes, I understand that is why they were ordered, but leasing twelve extra trains adds cost to the operation at a time when the DfT / Treasury is desperate to find ways to reduce the cost of the railway.
To be honest, the route needs the extra units. The trains are well used all day and all week at the moment, and the maintenance schedule has been under pressure for years now as a result of the intense unit diagraming since they extended off peak trains to 8 cars.
Off peak we are just as busy as we were before COVID, and weekends are mental. Local stakeholders won't accept reductions to 4 car trains during the day and at weekends again, when these trains should have been extended to 8 long before COVID.
There have even been 12 car trains at weekends!
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This is the best I could quickly find for a 379 TMS image. That's definitely not the standard Electrostar TMS. I wish they all had a dark mode like that!
GA will be running more 10 car trains in the future than they do now; In addition there is talk that the 720s will be taking over the Stansted Express services completely
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@dk1 reported in another thread that they were looking at ordering more 745/0s. That would not be happening if GA was already flush with stock.
It is important to note that before covid there was talk that the 720 fleet was too small for all the services it was scheduled to operate. This is probably no longer true, but I doubt it's very spacious either
No, because most of the WMR 323s are already due to head to Northern Rail and replace the 319s and the relevant traincrew are already likely to know how to operate 323s.
No, because most of the WMR 323s are already due to head to Northern Rail and replace the 319s and the relevant traincrew are already likely to know how to operate 323s.
No, but it would be possible to keep 331s on their services, and reorganise the mix of 323/331 elsewhere to displace 319s.
According to https://www.railforums.co.uk/thread...route-and-traction-cards.205085/#post-4624200, Blackpool North drivers don't sign 319s either (with presumably 319s to Blackpool being operated by drivers from other depots). It also suggests that Buxton, Manchester Victoria and Wigan Wallgate drivers don't sign 323s, while signing 319s and 331s.
No, but it would be possible to keep 331s on their services, and reorganise the mix of 323/331 elsewhere to displace 319s.
According to https://www.railforums.co.uk/thread...route-and-traction-cards.205085/#post-4624200, Blackpool North drivers don't sign 319s either (with presumably 319s to Blackpool being operated by drivers from other depots). It also suggests that Buxton, Manchester Victoria and Wigan Wallgate drivers don't sign 323s, while signing 319s and 331s.
To be honest, the route needs the extra units. The trains are well used all day and all week at the moment, and the maintenance schedule has been under pressure for years now as a result of the intense unit diagraming since they extended off peak trains to 8 cars.
Off peak we are just as busy as we were before COVID, and weekends are mental. Local stakeholders won't accept reductions to 4 car trains during the day and at weekends again, when these trains should have been extended to 8 long before COVID.
379s to c2c wouldn't be a terrible idea, could displace the on order 720s to GA so more 745s aren't needed. 12 720s is about equal to 18 379s. Remaining 12 can help with the intensive diagramming and extending trains to 8/12 cars.
I think that you may also need power upgrade on the GWML and you would be spending a lot of money on trains that will only have 15 - 25 years at most of life left of usage. The 350/4's where used on Manchester - Scotland, but they where used from new on that route, rather than after 15 year of usage.
I can see them having third rail shoes added though, as this would not be as much of a cost as completely re - doing the interiors of 37 trains.
'Conversion' doesn't really apply. The only differences are the interior. The first class I believe is the same (note: I believe the plan was to downgrade the 350/4 first class to the same as the other 350s but whether this has happened or not I do not know - somebody correct me if needed) and the seats are very similar. It is quite hard to justify modifying the existing seats to be 2+2 with armrests and tables but technically possible - the question is whether there's a reason to do it in the first place...
'Conversion' doesn't really apply. The only differences are the interior. The first class I believe is the same (note: I believe the plan was to downgrade the 350/4 first class to the same as the other 350s but whether this has happened or not I do not know - somebody correct me if needed) and the seats are very similar. It is quite hard to justify modifying the existing seats to be 2+2 with armrests and tables but technically possible - the question is whether there's a reason to do it in the first place...
Yes this (sadly) happened - all of LNR’s 350s that were refurbished (minus the 350/3s) now have a consistent interior in both first and standard class.
I do find it faintly ridiculous how the DfT are in a panic over costs, while engaging with a franchise system that encourages over-bidding and lavish spending in order to win. (And I imagine the same sort of dynamic may well occur with the interface between companies at GBR.)
The 360/2 units didn't have a use, so they can go, given all other options have been exhausted. Not so in the case of the 379s and the planned withdrawal of the 350/2s.
Yes, I understand that is why they were ordered, but leasing twelve extra trains adds cost to the operation at a time when the DfT / Treasury is desperate to find ways to reduce the cost of the railway.
It depends on how the lease was set up, part of the justification for ordering such a big fleet, and returning some fairly young trains was that leasing cost was cheaper.
To get a deal like this, probably a sting in the tail if try and cancel a few in early years. I would not be surprised if the return and cancellation penalties are hefty, so returning a small number makes no sense, especially if then end up paying out passenger compensation for delay repay due to lack of stock available.
You have to remember these deals were signed off about 2-3 years before covid when there was no expectation of cutting services, so any early return penalties were seen as negligible risk.
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Could probably probably reduce that 60 miles Coventry-Didcot to 45-50 miles by adding 5-8 miles of wiring at each end (in short term effectively wiring as a long siding, with no extra power supply). It’s not like quickly wiring to 3 miles south of Oxford will be wasted long term.
Probably bit of a no brainer if means only needed to provide batteries for about 60 mile range, as could divert some of the costs of not needing the extra batteries into the infrastructure.
Of course if do have a fleet of 350s with batteries, then realistically not very far off having a potential fleet for Basingstoke-Salisbury workings, or for the Southampton Waterside line, or if the Bristol-Bath-Warminster section gets wired, a replacement fleet for Portsmouth-Cardiff line too.
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