Poor food offering on MML

[richa2002]

MML offer free tea and coffee to all...

And it's fairtrade . Lol, what a farce.

 

[Nick W]

Anyway, to answer Nick W, why should an Intercity TOC be allowed to pad their timetables with so much slack, that at every station they either have to wait for a platform to become available, then sit there for 5 minutes, or arrive 10 minutes early?

Trans Pennine don't serve a long distance market either, and they have to go through more pinch points than MML, but their average speeds are higher than MML. Why is that?

It's DfT who like slack but I'm against excessive slack for the sake of statistics but every ToC seems to have slack i so you can't really use it against a ToC. I understand that in some cases it's needed for operational purposes though.

 

[Donny Dave]

MML could speed all their services up by at least 15 minutes, and it would not harm their performance figures at all. I have been pn MML service that have been looped to let other trains past because they have been running too early, yet when they get to the next station, the arrival is still 2 or 3 minutes early. Is there any need for that much slack?
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Another thing I've just remembered. Evening services from London to Leeds via Doncaster leave Doncaster 6 minutes behind the Northern all shacks to Leeds. Arrival time in Leeds is booked 7 minutes after the Northern stopper....

 

[Nick W]

MML could speed all their services up by at least 15 minutes, and it would not harm their performance figures at all.

That would have made my last journey from London - Loughborough an average of 102mph instaed of 83mph. While it might be possible in a perfect run, it doesn't give much room for delay. Only 2 minutes late could mean losing a path and a knock on effect at some of the flat junctions en route.

 

[Donny Dave]

Erm, speeding a MML service up by 15 minutes still gives them plenty of room for delays. All they have to do is take out a few minutes between stations.

For example. My last journey by MML was from London - Doncaster. 5 early into Bedford. 3 early into Leicester. 1 early into Loughborough. 6 early into Derby, that's after waiting 3 minutes outside the station. 4 early into Chesterfield. 2 early into Sheffield, 2 early into Doncaster. That's 26 minutes early in total.

It's DfT who like slack but I'm against excessive slack for the sake of statistics but every ToC seems to have slack i so you can't really use it against a ToC. I understand that in some cases it's needed for operational purposes though.

The DafT don't require TOCs to put slack into their timetables, and I agree with you about excessive slack, but MML take the proverbial biscuit. Recently, Stagecoach started getting nasty[1] in their bid for GNER, pointing out the fact that nearly every MML service arrives on time, but why is that.

MML run a small franchise, and to be honest, there isn't much to get in their way until they reach Derby. Even then the xx16 Virgin service leaves 3 minutes before the MML service, but gets to Sheffield a lot quicker. Also, as can be seen by my example above, MML pad the timetable with extreme amounts of slack.

By comparison, GNER run a long distance service to Yorkshire, Newcastle and Scotland. GNER have to go through some bottlenecks and slow stations. Welwyn viaduct, Wakefield - Leeds, Newcastle, Edinbourgh and Glasgow to name a few, yet the only places they pad the timetable with slack is at the end of the journey. Also, you have to take into account that GNER share then entire ECML with other operators, and these frequently get in the way.

[1] http://news.bbc.co.uk/player/nol/newsid_6570000/newsid_6573100/6573121.stm?bw=bb&mp=wm

 

[Jim]

VT's Bacon Rolls are the best from the microwaved range

 

[richa2002]

Erm, speeding a MML service up by 15 minutes still gives them plenty of room for delays. All they have to do is take out a few minutes between stations.

For example. My last journey by MML was from London - Doncaster. 5 early into Bedford. 3 early into Leicester. 1 early into Loughborough. 6 early into Derby, that's after waiting 3 minutes outside the station. 4 early into Chesterfield. 2 early into Sheffield, 2 early into Doncaster. That's 26 minutes early in total.



The DafT don't require TOCs to put slack into their timetables, and I agree with you about excessive slack, but MML take the proverbial biscuit. Recently, Stagecoach started getting nasty[1] in their bid for GNER, pointing out the fact that nearly every MML service arrives on time, but why is that.

MML run a small franchise, and to be honest, there isn't much to get in their way until they reach Derby. Even then the xx16 Virgin service leaves 3 minutes before the MML service, but gets to Sheffield a lot quicker. Also, as can be seen by my example above, MML pad the timetable with extreme amounts of slack.

By comparison, GNER run a long distance service to Yorkshire, Newcastle and Scotland. GNER have to go through some bottlenecks and slow stations. Welwyn viaduct, Wakefield - Leeds, Newcastle, Edinbourgh and Glasgow to name a few, yet the only places they pad the timetable with slack is at the end of the journey. Also, you have to take into account that GNER share then entire ECML with other operators, and these frequently get in the way.

[1] http://news.bbc.co.uk/player/nol/newsid_6570000/newsid_6573100/6573121.stm?bw=bb&mp=wm

Your comment about GNER not having much slack isn't true. When I go up on a Saturday, we always hang around at York 5+ mins each way and nearly always get stopped outside Newcastle but still arrive on time.

 

[Daniel]

I've been told MML offer nothing furing weekends.

Free tea and coffee to all is too all.

MML Offer nothing to FC Customers really. Your paying for the at seat service.... which doesn't happen at weekends. Only extras FC get, which are collected from the buffet at the weekend, are biscuits, cookies, olives etc. from the complementary basket, plus FC customers also get free orange juice...

I think it's because MML give tea & coffee to Standard passengers that they don't really spend that much money on free stuff for First Class.

 

[theblackwatch]

GNER has a lot of slack in the timetable between Peterborough and King's Cross. Most non stop services between KX and P'boro are given 46 minutes, but in the other direction, 50-55 minutes tend to be allowed. These 'charter minutes', which allow a late running train to suddenly arrive at its destination less than 10 minutes late, were introduced back in BR days.

With regard to Memorex's message, in First Class on MML I have been given complimentary wine on the return from London in the evenings.

 

[yorkie]

Your comment about GNER not having much slack isn't true.

It is true, relatively speaking. There is not much slack, considering the nature of the route and the distances involved.

When I go up on a Saturday, we always hang around at York 5+ mins each way and nearly always get stopped outside Newcastle but still arrive on time.

What time trains are those?

GNER has a lot of slack in the timetable between Peterborough and King's Cross. Most non stop services between KX and P'boro are given 46 minutes, but in the other direction, 50-55 minutes tend to be allowed. These 'charter minutes', which allow a late running train to suddenly arrive at its destination less than 10 minutes late, were introduced back in BR days.

The alternative would be to pad it out by putting in, say, 3 mins at York, another 3 or 4 at Donny, and another 3 at Peterborough, which would then mean that if the train was on time it has spent time hanging around needlessly, and then if there is a delay at the busy Welywn viaduct it would be late.

I am very happy with the present arrangement of almost all the slack being south of Peterborough for southbound journeys as I realise that if this was changed it would result in slower journey times overall.

Unfortunately it's not quite a case of GNER just getting 10 min padding, it is more a case of FCC getting priority in the southbound direction. In contrast GNER tend to get priority heading north. It is not uncommon for the Cambridge cruisers to be put ahead of a GNER and it is often timetabled for this to happen. Also, there is always a chance of having to slow down for Welwyn. They don't want to delay the semi-fasts as if that happens they will delay the stopper (e.g. xx20 off WGC for a semi fast, then xx23 for a stopper - no margin for a delay to the semi-fast so they won't hold it for a GNER at Woolmer Green).
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At the prices they are though, it is a small comfort! They also offer Coke etc. I've been told MML offer nothing furing weekends.

True, there is no at seat service on MML at weekends.

MML offer free tea and coffee to all...

Yep but at weekends FC passengers will have to go to the buffet along with SC passengers

 

[ChrisCooper]

The only good thing about Midland Mainline weekend first is that sometimes coming south in the evening the guard doesn't bother to do first class before Loughborough, so I've had a few free upgrades. If coming from Sheffield or further north at weekends I usually go in first on HSTs, since it's a long enough run to make it worthwhile. I've never upgraded on a Meridien though since it doesn't seem worth it, as there isn't a big deal of difference (even the decore is the same, it's just a slightly wider seat, yet being thin I don't find seat width a big deal, if anything I feel lost in the bigger seats). At least on an HST, you get a better ambience, and get right next to the powercar. Shame the best on to FC in, the York service, is now a Meridien though, and few HSTs stop at Loughborough so usually a change at Leicester or Derby is needed.

 

[Daniel]

GNER has a lot of slack in the timetable between Peterborough and King's Cross. Most non stop services between KX and P'boro are given 46 minutes, but in the other direction, 50-55 minutes tend to be allowed. These 'charter minutes', which allow a late running train to suddenly arrive at its destination less than 10 minutes late, were introduced back in BR days.

With regard to Memorex's message, in First Class on MML I have been given complimentary wine on the return from London in the evenings.

Oops, yes, forgot that! 1627 from Sheffield was one I had a problem on as the TM didn't know if I was allowed to pour wine...