Plane Bashing

[trentside]

That's a great combination for the outbound flights. Are there any other fifth freedom flights that you know of within Europe? My next trip looks like being to and from GVA on BA.

Kuwait Airways operate FRA-GVA and CDG-FCO, the flights continuing to KWI.

Ethiopian Airlines operate ARN-FCO, but that ends later this week I believe.

Korean Airlines did operate MAD-AMS, but this has now been dropped in favour of direct flights.

 

[WestCoast]

That's a great combination for the outbound flights. Are there any other fifth freedom flights that you know of within Europe? My next trip looks like being to and from GVA on BA.

All the ones I know of or have found out about;

Singapore Airlines - Manchester to Munich daily - Boeing 777-300ERs. Also, Istanbul to Athens with Boeing 777-200s.

Air China - Munich to Athens - A330-200s or A340-300s.

Air Blue (Pakistan) - Manchester to Istanbul - A320s.

LAN Chile - Madrid to Frankfurt and Paris with very attractive fares. A340-300s.

Kuwait Airways - Geneva to Frankfurt and Rome FCO to Paris CDG. They operate A300s and A340s.

Pakistan Airlines - Copenhagen to Oslo - B777-300s I think.

Ethiopian Airlines - Stockholm to Rome FCO - B757s/B767s. *ends soon I think*

Emirates - Larnaca (Cyprus) to Malta - A330-200s and B777-300s.

Korean Air - Zurich to Vienna - B747-400s. *I heard they may bring back Madrid - Amsterdam next year*

Qatar Airways - Budapest to Zagreb - A320s (?).

MIAT Mongolian Airlines - Berlin TXL to Moscow SVO - B767-300s.

Rumoured:

Oman Air - Zurich to Milan/Rome with A330s.

Can't carry 'local' passengers:

Qatar Airways - Stuttgart to Zurich with A330s(?).

Cathay Pacific - Paris CDG to Amsterdam - type(s) unknown

Biman Bangladesh - Manchester to London Heathrow - Boeing 777-300ERs.

 

[starrymarkb]

ooh tempting. How much were they out of interest? Am tempted to do the A346 to Madrid and return on the BA 767. Thinking I haven't been on a Boeing for 12 years (last was a B738 to Lanzarote - everything else has either been Airbii, BAe146s or Dash 8s)

I'm off to Glasgow for a day on Thursday with Easyjet (more interested in seeing my friend then the flights though)

 

[WestCoast]

ooh tempting. How much were they out of interest? Am tempted to do the A346 to Madrid and return on the BA 767. Thinking I haven't been on a Boeing for 12 years (last was a B738 to Lanzarote - everything else has either been Airbii, BAe146s or Dash 8s)

Singapore Airlines charges a flat single fare of £87 on Manchester - Munich if you book more than about a fortnight before and Air China was €80 on Munich to Athens. Not exactly that cheap, but worth the money IMO.

As I mentioned LAN Chile has the cheapest fifth freedom flights from about £40ish one way for Frankfurt to Madrid, with Pakistan Airlines being very expensive at about €200 single minimum on the short Copenhagen to Oslo flight.

 

[SwindonPkwy]

If only I could do GVA - FRA on Kuwait, FRA - MAD on LAN Chile and MAD -LHR on the Iberia A346!!

I just need to convince my other half that GVA - LHR is fully booked.

 

[flymo]

Cathay Pacific - Paris CDG to Amsterdam - type(s) unknown[/I]

CX270/CX271, usually a B747-400 Operates HKG-AMS-CDG-AMS-HKG.

I agree it does not allow booking AMS to/from CDG though, pity could be a good one...

 

[stut]

AMS-CDG would be a good one, too - the air fares on AFKL are shocking, and Thalys is great, but can also be expensive.

IIRC Varig used to resell fifth freedom flights on that route.

 

[WestCoast]

Yes, Varig used to operate CDG-AMS, as well as between London Heathrow and Copenhagen. Another one that stopped last year (or was it 2010?) was Manchester to Geneva on Saudi Arabian Airlines, which I suspect could have been very useful for some. It was barely publicised though and hardly anyone knew about it!

The only airline that seems to actively promote their fifth freedom flight is LAN Chile.

I've also added some more to the list above.

 

[trentside]

Thanks for the list WestCoast, some good opportunities for flying short haul with some interesting carriers. Will have to investigate some itineraries, but Singapore and LAN are definitely of interest.

Shame that Biman no longer fly the DC-10 to the UK, though the lack of domestic tickets would have scuppered that one anyway. Great aircraft, and a flight with one of Airtours fleet remains the best aviation experience of my life - especially the cockpit visit while flying over Canada (pre-9/11).

 

[WestCoast]

My only DC-10 ride was similar, MyTravel Airways (i.e. Airtours) from Manchester to Las Palmas in 2003/4. The charter airlines did have some interesting aircraft in those days!

 

[SwindonPkwy]

MD-11's are also increasingly rare in passenger service. I managed to fly JAL to Nagoya (Komaki) in 2001. Back then it had a superb viewing terrace. Nowadays, the offshore Centrair (Chubu) airport handles most Nagoya traffic.

 

[stut]

Believe me, if you want to ride in a DC-10, Biman is not the airline to do it in!

Has anyone here had the pleasure of KLM's MD-11s, once a permanent fixture on the Caribbean/LatAm routes? One notable feature (unless you were lucky enough to be in the tiny, silent, forward business cabin) was the seating: 2-4-3. Never seen that anywhere else. Was rather good for travelling in groups.

I remember the old NW DTW-AMS-BOM service was a DC-10 too (KLM used to codeshare on the AMS-BOM leg). It was always in the oldest bowling-shoe livery, and the tattiest plane - so glad when the A330 took it over!

 

[flymo]

Believe me, if you want to ride in a DC-10, Biman is not the airline to do it in!!

Nor is Garuda Indonesia!! Not that they have any in service now of course but back in 1994 I flew Jakarta - Denpasar in one of these things and thought my number was up.

Took off into a thunderstorm, the right hand engine was knocking its conkers off and I ended up getting thrown about the cabin like a rag doll, even with the seat belt fastened. Since then never flown Garuda or a DC10 again and never will.

Frightened the living daylights out of me.hock:

(I blame Garuda more than the DC-10 of course but the memory aint going away!):cry:

\
Has anyone here had the pleasure of KLM's MD-11s, once a permanent fixture on the Caribbean/LatAm routes?

Yikes, instantly transported me to St. Maarten that did. Loads of photos online of the MD coming in over Maho beach,

Gotta go there one day, now where is that lottery ticket....?

 

[WestCoast]

According to reports I've read Garuda has been transformed in the last couple of years into a modern, safe and rather classy airline. All the bans on the airline have been lifted and passed its IATA Safety Audit with ease. It's operating new A330s on long-haul routes, and B777-300ERs have been ordered.

As soon as the 777s arrive they will be able to fly Jakarta to Amsterdam non-stop, the service currently has to make a fuel stop in Dubai.

 

[flymo]

According to reports I've read Garuda has been transformed in the last couple of years into a modern, safe and rather classy airline. All the bans on the airline have been lifted and passed its IATA Safety Audit with ease. It's operating new A330s on long-haul routes, and B777-300ERs have been ordered.

As soon as the 777s arrive they will be able to fly Jakarta to Amsterdam non-stop, the service currently has to make a fuel stop in Dubai.

I see adverts for them everywhere over here in Asia, they are certainly trying their best to reinvent themselves.

Good luck to them, I am sure they are much better than before, but I'll leave it to others for the moment. Between HKG and CGK they operate a B738 and an A332. From HKG - DPS they operate a B738
Both are around 4½ hours long so not too bad.

One more memory from Garuda (a good one this time) is that the first ever B747 I flew on was Garuda which incidentally was the first time across the equator too. Mind you instead of the captain telling everyone about the flight, altitude, weather etc. etc, there was a single piece of paper handed out which one read then passed onto the next person beside you or behind. I kid you not!

Of course it had the time of crossing the equator written on so dutifully at 16:37 I lifted the window flap and was astonished not to see a black line with 'equator' written on....I felt robbed....

 

[trentside]

Believe me, if you want to ride in a DC-10, Biman is not the airline to do it in!

Sadly, I think they are now the only carrier operating the DC-10 in passenger service.

I've certainly heard horror stories about them, and am certainly not in a hurry to find out first hand!

 

[starrymarkb]

My Glasgow trip was pretty good, only one new aircraft as the outbound was G-EZFB, the same aircraft that worked my previous EZY flight back from Berlin.

Tempted to do an A.net trip report.

Next up is the Flight of the Fokker to Amsterdam in July

 

[flymo]

Tempted to do an A.net trip report.

Look forward to reading it!! Yes I am a member there too with different handle.

Next up is the Flight of the Fokker to Amsterdam in July

There must be a joke in there somewhere...

 

[SwindonPkwy]

Tempted to do an A.net trip report.

Look forward to reading it!! Yes I am a member there too with different handle.

I heard that you have to be a paid up member on A.net in order to post anything in the forum. Is that correct?

 

[WestCoast]

I heard that you have to be a paid up member on A.net in order to post anything in the forum. Is that correct?

You do, I think it was about £15 when I joined, for a lifetime subscription. I am user eurowings on A.net and Pprune. I haven't done any trip reports yet, but I will do so for any interesting trips in future. The discussion on A.net is quite good, but there are lot of airline fanboys I find (especially of BA!). I find the crowd can be a bit condescending on Pprune.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

Next up is the Flight of the Fokker to Amsterdam in July

I was on a KLM Cityhopper F70 last year and people were laughing when we were welcomed onboard "this Fokker flight to Amsterdam". Fokker is common surname in the US (and of course in Dutch speaking countries).

 

[SwindonPkwy]

You do, I think it was about £15 when I joined, for a lifetime subscription. I am user eurowings on A.net and Pprune. I haven't done any trip reports yet, but I will do so for any interesting trips in future. The discussion on A.net is quite good, but there are lot of airline fanboys I find (especially of BA!). I find the crowd can be a bit condescending on Pprune.

I would consider doing a trip report myself over Christmas and New Year. I am taking in Hong Kong, Singapore, Saigon (Ho Chi Minh City) and Manila. The HKG - MNL - HKG legs on Philippine Airlines are scheduled to be A340 out and 777-300ER return!!

 

[flymo]

The HKG - MNL - HKG legs on Philippine Airlines are scheduled to be A340 out and 777-300ER return!!

If you have never been to The Philippines before, prepared have you eyes opened. Very strange place........My first visit there was in 1994 and can still remember the wire mesh fence outside the arrivals area with a seething mass of humanity pressed up against it just looking at who was there and the army of "helpers" trying to carry my bags for a couple of Pesos. 8 people in all for a roll along...
PAL use a new terminal on MNL now so it should be better.

FYI PAL use Terminal 2 at HKG for check in and on occasion use the remote stands (gates 500 +) but that is mainly for the A319/A320 they send up here.

Sounds like a fab trip..

 

[SwindonPkwy]

I have a photograph of a Philippine Airlines 747-200 taken at Gatwick in the 80's. It's a shame they don't fly here anymore. I don't think they were blacklisted (like Garuda) because they continued to operate to America. Though, I read on A.net that their new owners, San Miguel Corp IIRC, are looking to resume flights to Europe.

I was surprised to see the 777-300ER used on such a short leg but it obviously helps to keep the fleet utilisation up by filling a gap between long hauls.

 

[flymo]

The PR flights from HKG - MNL today should be an A319, A320, B773 & B744 so they do have quite a variety of aircraft on the route.

 

[stut]

I did fly on PAL a few years ago - a domestic flight from Tagbilaran to Manila (using the new terminal 3 at NAIA). Apart from being amused that the luggage tags for Tagbilaran were "TAG", it was a pretty decent flight - a reasonable mid-gen 737 (734, I think).

The new terminal was significantly better than the old ones (and a world away from the scattered domestic terminals around the airfield) but, to be honest, that doesn't make it any easier to get into Manila from the airport! Pay over the odds for a car you can reserve in the terminal, or take your chances picking up a city taxi from the departures ramp. Up to you...

 

[SwindonPkwy]

The new terminal was significantly better than the old ones (and a world away from the scattered domestic terminals around the airfield) but, to be honest, that doesn't make it any easier to get into Manila from the airport! Pay over the odds for a car you can reserve in the terminal, or take your chances picking up a city taxi from the departures ramp. Up to you...

If I was on business then I would be looking to book a taxi. On holiday I put it down to part of the experience. So, to the departure drop off point it is!! This is also the advice given in the guide book I have.

 

[stut]

Go for it, but have your wits about you. I had every trick in the book pulled on us in Manila, from attempts to plant drugs to fake police inspections (oh, and corrupt police, too!) But it's still a fascinating, energetic place, with a great music scene.

 

[SwindonPkwy]

I'm happy to see that my bmi diamond club silver status has been transferred to my BA Executive Club account. Does anybody know if it is possible to transfer the mileage?

 

[Royston Vasey]

I'm happy to see that my bmi diamond club silver status has been transferred to my BA Executive Club account. Does anybody know if it is possible to transfer the mileage?

I think you can either keep them as they are or transfer at 1:1 from July onwards. I'm not sure if you'd want to keep them as Star Alliance miles, I'm not familiar with the benefits. Avios isn't as good as old BA miles, you have to pay the taxes these days (not use Avios towards them) so there's no such thing as a free flight, and there are some limits on what flights you can use them on. If you think your current miles are better, keep them.

Welcome to BA Silver, the lounges are some of the best there are and the perks are pretty good too. The food and drinks in T5's galleries lounges are fantastic! I seem to live on 767s and 777s between EWR and LHR, and whatever AA 737s I can fit in for the tier points internally. An Airbus free zone (!) until their new fleet of A319/A321s arrive.

 

[SwindonPkwy]

Welcome to BA Silver, the lounges are some of the best there are and the perks are pretty good too. The food and drinks in T5's galleries lounges are fantastic! I seem to live on 767s and 777s between EWR and LHR, and whatever AA 737s I can fit in for the tier points internally. An Airbus free zone (!) until their new fleet of A319/A321s arrive.

Yes, looking forward to using the T5 lounges over the next year. I cannot see me holding onto silver for long because most of my long haul business trips are with Star or Skyteam carriers.