Perth Direct Route

[DaveNewcastle]

The reason for posting this question was that there is a lot of lobbying going on right now for re-oopening this route.

. . .

There is also the question of the tay bridge from a maintenance perspective.

Indeed.
And there are other critical points on the country's rail network which merit some careful consideration over the long term - I would add the Forth Bridge and the Killekrankie Viaduct and Tunnel - they won't last forever.

I note your reasons for opening this particular thread, but . . . .

I do not wish to rain upon any other forum members parade but do ask that a semblance of financial realism should be part of the debate, where many projects, transport and otherwise, have to all be viewed by the Scottish Parliament.

What an odd comment!
This forum is dominated by critics of the industry who find fault after-the-event with the industry's failure to have anticipated the obvious (whether or not those critics had stated the obvious before-the-event).

Isn't Transport Scotland to be commended for carrying out assessments of future needs, and of future solutions to future problems before they occur?

And couldn't the Westminster government learn from that approach? To our benefit?

 

[PermitToTravel]

If you've ever driven the M90, you'd know how huge an engineering challenge that would be. The cuttings are already massive, and that's just for a two-lane motorway without hard shoulders. (Also the curviness of the route is an indicator of how difficult the terrain is. It's the only motorway I know of which has sharp bend signs on the mainline.)

There's a sharp bend sign here on the London bit of the M4, complete with an advisory 30mph restriction

 

[Xenophon PCDGS]

.

What an odd comment! This forum is dominated by critics of the industry who find fault after-the-event with the industry's failure to have anticipated the obvious (whether or not those critics had stated the obvious before-the-event). Isn't Transport Scotland to be commended for carrying out assessments of future needs, and of future solutions to future problems before they occur? And couldn't the Westminster government learn from that approach? To our benefit?

My posting attempt to state that the Scottish Parliament has to look at ALL projects, railways and otherwise, before making a decision on which to go forward with, appears to have been misconstrued.

 

[oldman]

Isn't Transport Scotland to be commended for carrying out assessments of future needs, and of future solutions to future problems before they occur?

And couldn't the Westminster government learn from that approach? To our benefit?

The response quoted above - 'Transport Scotland has suggested to Transform Scotland they work with the regional transport partnerships on a new feasibility study to look at all transport modes on the Edinburgh to Perth corridor and we await their response” - sounds like they are not that interested, leaving it to someone else to do a feasibility study.

I am not sure there is such a huge difference between the Scottish government's approach and that of the DfT. The Scottish government in pre-referendum mode is maybe reluctant to come out and say 'this is not a viable scheme, it is not going to happen'. Negativity is not allowed (just now).

My uncle worked in BR in Scotland at the time of Beeching, and he said the mood was totally doom and gloom; he even wondered if the Forth Bridge would survive!

 

[Altnabreac]

The only way it would probably ever happen would be as the first stage of HSR to Aberdeen. Otherwise what's the point of building an entirely new InterCity route that is not built for high speed? The journey time saving at standard speed is pretty useless but if built for >250km/h it wouldn't be too shabby at all. If you're going to spend the money of a new tunnelled route then you might as well build it as straight as possible, dual track at GC + electrification gauge and with ETCS signalling.

I agree, a reopening on the old alignment is unlikely but you can see some potential for a new high speed line passing along the M90 corridor and reusing limited parts of the old trackbed. This could be a northern extension of the Inverkeithing to Halbeath line if that ever got off the ground, possibly with a Dunfermline Parkway station in the Halbeath area.

It would almost certainly require a new base tunnel to the west of Glenfarg. My guess is 10km or so. If you then linked it in to the existing line at Bridge of Earn you would knock a good chunk off the Edinburgh - Perth & Inverness times (a CP6 aspiration for Transport Scotland), a new bridge over the Tay could link you direct to the Dundee and Aberdeen line near St Madoes and reduce journey times on that axis too.

Not going to get much change out of a couple of billion pounds though so can't see it happening in next 20 years, maybe as a long term aspiration though, it could be the sort of project to capture Scottish politicians imagination as it would improve journey times between a lot of different places, especially the northern cities (Perth, Dundee, Aberdeen, Inverness) who often feel the central belt dominates infrastructure investment.

 

[Tetchytyke]

It sounds like an MSP trying to sound important, rather than anything that would actually ever get built, especially now the M90 is there.

There are already two perfectly serviceable routes to Perth from Edinburgh- via Ladybank or via Stirling- so why a third is required goodness only knows. Re-double the (fairly straight) line from Ladybank and increase the line speed and you've cracked it.