Penalty fine paid, should I expect a letter?

[plastic_railin]

I was caught using a child ticket from Bath to Paddington by GWR about a week back. I paid a £100 penalty fine and the price of the full new ticket. My details were taken. Should I expect a letter or have they taken my details just as a record of me paying in case I were to be caught doing the same thing again. Thanks

 

[John R]

They will certainly have taken your details so if you are caught again you are unlikely to be dealt with by a Penalty Fare and would be referred for prosecution. If you had an e-ticket, it's not impossible that they will look at your account and question any other child tickets they find, although if that happens come back here and ask for advice before responding.

 

[plastic_railin]

They will certainly have taken your details so if you are caught again you are unlikely to be dealt with by a Penalty Fare and would be referred for prosecution. If you had an e-ticket, it's not impossible that they will look at your account and question any other child tickets they find, although if that happens come back here and ask for advice before responding.

I did not use an e-ticket. I am not going to be at my address after 2 weeks time for the rest of the summer. Would you recommend setting up a royal mail redirectory to the address I will be at during the summer for the unlikely event I do get sent a letter? By the sounds of it it's unlikely I will get a letter. However, the consequences of not replying to a letter are severe. As I did not have to give an email I am expecting to get a letter.

 

[John R]

If you didn't buy your ticket through an online ticketing account (eg Trainline), then I highly doubt you will hear anything else, so I am not sure I would put a redirect in place simply to cover the eventuality that you do get a letter.

 

[plastic_railin]

If you didn't buy your ticket through an online ticketing account (eg Trainline), then I highly doubt you will hear anything else, so I am not sure I would put a redirect in place simply to cover the eventuality that you do get a letter.

Just to be clear. The ticket was purchased on trainline but collected via a code from the app at the train station. It was not purchased from my trainline account. Would this effect the chances of me being investigated and sent a letter? Thanks for answering my questions.

 

[Pushpit]

For the instance where you paid the penalty fare (or at least I assume you have paid it) then that's the matter closed. So long as you do pay it, you won't be prosecuted for that instance. For any other instances, it's a crime to travel on a child's fare if you are not entitled to it, but not a crime to buy a child's ticket. If I were running GWR I would certainly investigate the matter, but unless you / your Trainline account holder engages in the process, GWR will normally not have the evidence to prosecute you/the account holder. Moreover any communication I suspect will be by email, that's how most fishing trips seem to go. So to answer the question, it's not essential to get a mail redirect.

It's vital that you are not caught doing this again, but particularly if you have other instances in the last 6 months, this can still be prosecuted. If you therefore get another instance within that 6 months window then it will get very difficult for you.

 

[plastic_railin]

For the instance where you paid the penalty fare (or at least I assume you have paid it) then that's the matter closed. So long as you do pay it, you won't be prosecuted for that instance. For any other instances, it's a crime to travel on a child's fare if you are not entitled to it, but not a crime to buy a child's ticket. If I were running GWR I would certainly investigate the matter, but unless you / your Trainline account holder engages in the process, GWR will normally not have the evidence to prosecute you/the account holder. Moreover any communication I suspect will be by email, that's how most fishing trips seem to go. So to answer the question, it's not essential to get a mail redirect.

It's vital that you are not caught doing this again, but particularly if you have other instances in the last 6 months, this can still be prosecuted. If you therefore get another instance within that 6 months window then it will get very difficult for you.

I paid the £100 penalty fine and full price of a new ticket there and then with the officer (the payment has gone through I checked on my bank app). I have an orange/white receipt with the amount I was required to pay, the amount I have paid, and what I owe (£0). There is a bit saying "Ways to pay", but I assume this is for someone who doesn't pay there and then. My name is spelt wrong though by a typo but address and date of birth are all correct so I assume that isn't a problem. I have another orange/white piece of paper that has "Debit my card account with the total amount. Please retain for you records" written on the bottom. Does that confirm the payment has been successful?

I realise now that the consequences of a child ticket are more severe then I thought. I bought a 16-25 railcard to legitimatelly reduce my ticket price in the future. I have no previous instances. Thanks again.

 

[swt_passenger]

I paid the £100 penalty fine and full price of a new ticket there and then with the officer (the payment has gone through I checked on my bank app). I have an orange/white receipt with the amount I was required to pay, the amount I have paid, and what I owe (£0).

Normally if you pay immediately the penalty fare is discounted and only £50? Are you sure you paid £100+fare?

 

[plastic_railin]

Normally if you pay immediately the penalty fare is discounted and only £50? Are you sure you paid £100+fare?

I paid £179.30, which I believe is made up of £100 penalty fare and £79.30 for an anytime single. Not sure how to check the anytime single price though. I also paid about £23 to upgrade my child to an adult for the way back home.

 

[AlterEgo]

I paid £178.30, which I believe is made up of £100 penalty fare and £78.30 for an anytime single. Not sure how to check the anytime single price though

The penalty fare is discounted to £50 if you pay within 21 days. Unfortunately as you have a history of fare evasion you’re better off not complaining about this.

 

[plastic_railin]

@AlterEgo Do you have an opinion on setting up a royal mail redirectory?

 

[methecooldude]

Normally if you pay immediately the penalty fare is discounted and only £50? Are you sure you paid £100+fare?

I paid £179.30, which I believe is made up of £100 penalty fare and £79.30 for an anytime single. Not sure how to check the anytime single price though. I also paid about £23 to upgrade my child to an adult for the way back home.

The adult Anytime (Day) Single for Bath Spa > Paddington is £129.30 (https://www.brfares.com/!faredetail?orig=BTH&dest=PAD&grpd=1072&tkt=SDS), plus the £50 reduced payment is £179.30. The amount is correct.

 

[Hadders]

GWR cannot take any action in respect of the journey where you were caught using a child ticket as this has been dealt with by means of a Penalty Fare which you have paid.

If details of the ticket were noted by the members of staff (eg the ticket number) then it is possible that GWR will be able to use this to search for other child tickets purchased through that online account. As you've told us this was your friend then it's possible that they might get a letter or email from GWR asking for an explanation.

 

[plastic_railin]

GWR cannot take any action in respect of the journey where you were caught using a child ticket as this has been dealt with by means of a Penalty Fare which you have paid.

If details of the ticket were noted by the members of staff (eg the ticket number) then it is possible that GWR will be able to use this to search for other child tickets purchased through that online account. As you've told us this was your friend then it's possible that they might get a letter or email from GWR asking for an explanation.

I have attached part of the receipt I was given. The 'Ticket Number or mobile ticket reference' box which is for withdrawn tickets only is empty. Does this suggest the ticket number was not noted.

 

[Hadders]

I have attached part of the receipt I was given. The 'Ticket Number or mobile ticket reference' box which is for withdrawn tickets only is empty. Does this suggest the ticket number was not noted.

Hard to say. It's possible the number was noted elsewhere, but we cannot be 100% certain of this.

 

[WesternLancer]

GWR cannot take any action in respect of the journey where you were caught using a child ticket as this has been dealt with by means of a Penalty Fare which you have paid.

If details of the ticket were noted by the members of staff (eg the ticket number) then it is possible that GWR will be able to use this to search for other child tickets purchased through that online account. As you've told us this was your friend then it's possible that they might get a letter or email from GWR asking for an explanation.

So GWR may think the friend is the evader and try to pursue any other issues about previous child tickets with the friend not the op.

OP should do the right thing and warn the friend.

The friend allowing others to buy child tickets that they weren’t entitled to use indirectly puts said friend at risk of getting hassles from the railway company about this I suspect. They have been unwise to share their trainline account in my view. Their digital fingerprints are on the op’s offence it seems to me.

 

[SouthernOne]

I would suggest, breaking the cycle. In future use a different app to purchase your tickets. Just don’t use train line anymore.

 

[Joe Paxton]

I would suggest, breaking the cycle. In future use a different app to purchase your tickets. Just don’t use train line anymore.

If following this advice, then presumably also best to avoid any white-label app or site that is "powered by" the Trainline (i.e. one that is ultimately the Trainline underneath all the branding)...

 

[Haywain]

I would suggest, breaking the cycle. In future use a different app to purchase your tickets. Just don’t use train line anymore.

I would suggest buying the right tickets in future. Just don't evade fares.

 

[plastic_railin]

Is it a good idea to email GWR to see if they have an investigation open?

 

[Haywain]

Is it a good idea to email GWR to see if they have an investigation open?

No! That would be a very bad idea. If there is an investigation happening you will hear about it in due course.

 

[Titfield]

Is it a good idea to email GWR to see if they have an investigation open?

In a word No because (a) they may not be able to match your enquiry to an investigation (b) you may incriminate yourself (c) it may encourage then to look at you though of course it is your friend who is the account holder

 

[Hadders]

Is it a good idea to email GWR to see if they have an investigation open?

Do not do this. You'd basically be suggesting that they needed to open an investigation!

 

[furlong]

What day and time did this happen? As you've been charged the Anytime fare, if this happened at a time when an off-peak fare was applicable, you'd be able to appeal the Penalty Fare on the grounds that you were charged more than you should have been. (Also the child ticket can be refunded minus admin fee as the Penalty Fare replaced it and you bought a new ticket to return.) If you mean no previous instances of using a child's ticket when you don't qualify for one, there's no obvious reason not to seek to recoup what you can. If you mean you've done it before but never been caught you might prefer not do anything that might draw any more attention to yourself.